mnx
2018 M3P
Then be sure not to tell her. 
I'm not concerned, but maybe I'll put a smoke detector in the garage for good measure.
I'm not concerned, but maybe I'll put a smoke detector in the garage for good measure.
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Another Tesla fire in a garage, this time in Toronto
- Thread starter yobigd20
- Start date
muleferg
Active Member
I do not think it is that 'we don't care'. It is a concern to everyone, owners and investors. The problem is there is many unknowns and I think we can all agree that there are some powerful industries (auto/oil) and investors (hedge funds/shorts) that would like nothing better to see EVs (TM) fail. I also think we can all agree that the timing of release of the story, just after market close, a day before options close and three business days before Q4ER report and 2014 guidance is a bit suspicious.
I am glad that no one was hurt. I am glad the problem was confined to the garage. My wife is an extreme safety freak ( I am not ) and she plugged in the car for a full charge last night after reading the story and went to bed.
deonb
Active Member
I hope then she's not interested in a Trailblazer, Envoy, Rainier, Saab or Isuzu either, since 200'000 of them were recalled last year for the 12V system starting fires in a garage - and owners were told to park the vehicles outside.
Or how about a Honda Fit? 150'000 recalled last year (twice!) for starting fires from the 12V system, and owners were told not to park in a garage.
And that doesn't include the once-off fires that occur in all random models due to installation error, water intrusion, vibrations etc.
Look, there is a 12V system with battery in the Tesla, using the same 12V parts for wiper motors, windows, lights, music etc. that every other car uses. Most of the time just off-the-shelve parts from other manufacturers.
I wish it didn't have a 12V system - it's a bit annoying that a fully charged car can be dead if that 12V battery is dead. But alas, it has one, and it behaves like 12V systems behave in any other make and model of car. That will probably include sometimes shorting out and cause a fire (if it hasn't yet, it will) - a 12V car battery will supply an insane amount of current.
So unless your wife currently disconnects the 12V battery from her current car every night before going to bed, there isn't any difference in risk with a Tesla or not.
So if the article is accurate with regards to the car being four months old, I assume it probably didn't have those early problematic 12V batteries? I recall Elon mentioning one of their initial suppliers was a reputable source in the US, but they in turn outsourced the supply to China and provided substandard 12V lead acid batteries.
It could have just been a short not a battery problem. We don't know if this guy bought it used. There are too many variables and shoddy journalism that leaves too much to interpretation and assumptions. This is what people were getting at when looking at door handles, but the picture is bad. The point is similar to other fires. It's unfair coverage and focus on Tesla in the grand scheme of things.
CNBC has revised last night's story.
while it is not clear whether or not CNBC directly spoke with anyone at Toronto Fire Services, the story reports:
"The fire, during which nobody was hurt, happened Feb. 1 in Toronto, Canada, Toronto Fire Services confirmed. TFS said the origin of the fire was in the engine area, but the actual source of the fire is unclear."
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101416608?__source=yahoo%257cfinance%257cheadline%257cheadline%257cstory&par=yahoo&doc=101416608%257cAnother+fire+reported+as+
@luciano, my understanding is that a fully fueled gas powered car stores 5X the energy of a fully charged Model S (though this is off memory... googling for 20 minutes, I did not find the original source). If this is indeed the correct comparison, I think it's worth considering the safety risk to people in a house where a garage fire starts or reaches a vehicle depending on whether it contains the energy levels stored in an ICE or an EV.
while it is not clear whether or not CNBC directly spoke with anyone at Toronto Fire Services, the story reports:
"The fire, during which nobody was hurt, happened Feb. 1 in Toronto, Canada, Toronto Fire Services confirmed. TFS said the origin of the fire was in the engine area, but the actual source of the fire is unclear."
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101416608?__source=yahoo%257cfinance%257cheadline%257cheadline%257cstory&par=yahoo&doc=101416608%257cAnother+fire+reported+as+
@luciano, my understanding is that a fully fueled gas powered car stores 5X the energy of a fully charged Model S (though this is off memory... googling for 20 minutes, I did not find the original source). If this is indeed the correct comparison, I think it's worth considering the safety risk to people in a house where a garage fire starts or reaches a vehicle depending on whether it contains the energy levels stored in an ICE or an EV.
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
The "5x the energy" sound bite has always bugged me, because isn't that comparing the energy in gasoline to the electrical energy stored in the battery? That isn't the relevant metric, is it? What's the volume of flammable electrolyte in the battery, and what's the energy potential in that? That's what's going to burn in a fire, not the electric potential stored inside.
Or maybe I am misunderstanding the comparison that's been made.
Or maybe I am misunderstanding the comparison that's been made.
yes, most probably what they mean looking at the photos.
JST, I was not aware of this, but it sounds like your probably have a very good point... I'll have to look into this more.
fwiw, rational or not, I think the biggest (probably only) factor, rational or not, behind the publics concern about Tesla fires is the association of lithium ion batteries generally and spontaneous fire risk. Tesla has quite decisively said the fire did not start with the battery. perhaps with time, the public as a whole will come to separate the track record of Tesla's engineering of their pack of lithium ion batteries, from lithium ion batteries in general.
tdelta1000
Active Member
I too wonder why????
Of the 5 "fire" incidents only three were caused by direct damage to the battery, one was a supposed cord issues and the last one is a mystery thus far. Five "fire" issues out of 25K is good.
Again, I'd say there is a high probability that we have a case of a decent person here.
Krugerrand
Meow
It says something about people, specifically and generally, when they automatically attach nefarious intent and actions to others, just as it says something about people, specifically and generally, when they automatically think the best of others or give the benefit of the doubt until facts emerge. Others being individuals, groups, organizations, companies etc... What a fascinating look inside the minds of people this thread has been. :wink:
On the specific topic of combustion at this residence; smart precaution to have a working smoke detector in the garage.
On the specific topic of combustion at this residence; smart precaution to have a working smoke detector in the garage.
I'm not suggesting the 12V battery caught on fire. That battery is located just above the front passenger's footwell and a if it caught on fire, there would be a lot more centrally located car damage. The 12V system CAN cause a fire up front if the source of high resistance (or a short) is located up there.
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
You have a hidden agenda, don't you? I knew it. I KNEW it! Infiltrating these boards, acting all nice and friendly, making friends.
Carry on.
Krugerrand
Meow
You have a hidden agenda, don't you? I knew it. I KNEW it! Infiltrating these boards, acting all nice and friendly, making friends.
Carry on.
So let it be written. So let it be done. :biggrin:
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