Daniel in SD
(supervised)
Image from camera 1.5 seconds before impact:
A good reminder that everyone should keep their eyes on the road.
A good reminder that everyone should keep their eyes on the road.
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Another tragic fatality with a semi in Florida. This time a Model 3
- Thread starter Az_Rael
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From 1.5 seconds before crash:
"This accident developed over a short time. About two seconds after the front bumper of the truck-tractor crossed the white stop line on the driveway (see Figure 2), the truck-tractor was already blocking the Tesla’s lane. About one second later, the trailer was blocking the lane, as seen in Figure 1. Since the collision happened about 1.5 seconds after that, there were less than 4.5 seconds available for estimating the speed of the combination vehicle."
Will be interesting to read the final conclusion as to how far in advance of the crash was the truck visible and how much the dawn lighting played a part.
"This accident developed over a short time. About two seconds after the front bumper of the truck-tractor crossed the white stop line on the driveway (see Figure 2), the truck-tractor was already blocking the Tesla’s lane. About one second later, the trailer was blocking the lane, as seen in Figure 1. Since the collision happened about 1.5 seconds after that, there were less than 4.5 seconds available for estimating the speed of the combination vehicle."
Will be interesting to read the final conclusion as to how far in advance of the crash was the truck visible and how much the dawn lighting played a part.
It said the driver engaged AP 10 seconds before impact and the no hands detected on whee 8 seconds before impact. Sounds like the driver turned on AP then was distracted by something.
Wonder what happened to the truck driver? It should be 100% his fault. How could he just pull in the middle of the road when a car was coming. The Model 3 headlights are really bright, surely he can't say he didn't see it coming?
I see this far too often in traffic, just because they drive a bigass truck they think everyone will just yield and stop for them.
I see this far too often in traffic, just because they drive a bigass truck they think everyone will just yield and stop for them.
Daniel in SD
(supervised)
68mph is 100 feet per second. Even at the 1.5s video frame there was enough distance to brake to a stop.
EDIT: 450 feet definitely seems way too close to pull in front of another car on a road like that.
The Model 3 would be about 450 feet away when the truck driver pulled in to the intersection. I don't really have a feel for what's acceptable.
EDIT: 450 feet definitely seems way too close to pull in front of another car on a road like that.
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I think he said he saw the headlights but thought he had time. The Model 3 was speeding (69 in a 55), so that was probably a contributing factor as well.
Dan203
Active Member
Based on the video up thread this is not just a problem with Teslas. People hit the sides of trucks like this all the time even when they're actively driving. It shows that in Europe they require the underside of the trailer to have a sort of barrier so that when the car hits it it's like hitting a wall instead of going under it and cutting off the drivers head.
NTSB recommended those be mandated years ago, but they don't have the regulatory power and the NHTSA has chosen to not implement that requirement.
Wait a sec, does autopilot on the Model 3 work with more than 5mph above the speed limit on these kinds of roads? I though it let you set it to a higher speed only on proper highways.
In any case, a shitty situation for both, except the Tesla driver didn't walk away. They shouldn't put any blame on the AP system. Most likely any current car with some better driver aids would've failed to stop here...
I'm very curious how Tesla is going to overcome this scenario for FSD.
Daniel in SD
(supervised)
It does on 395 in California which is similar. I think they only enforce the 5mph over speed limit on roads without a median.
Require driver supervision.
Dan203
Active Member
Too bad. Seems like it could save a lot of lives. Wonder why the NHTSA, or the trucker lobby, would be against them? Do they cost a lot? Create drag that uses more fuel?
Daniel in SD
(supervised)
I think they can get stuck on crests in the road like railroad crossings. And of course they cost money and add weight (which limits maximum payload). NHTSA probably weighs the economic cost versus the benefit. In this case the Tesla driver probably would have died anyway.
Dan203
Active Member
Not so sure about that. The Tesla has a pretty good rating for head on into a flat surface. The frunk is basically just a giant crumple zone. But at 70mph maybe not.
Daniel in SD
(supervised)
Maybe. NHTSA tests at 35mph into a brick wall. 70mph is 4 times the energy. Looks pretty good at 35mph though!
Dan203
Active Member
Although if the truck did have some sort of side wall would the Tesla have noticed it using the radar and stopped?
Dan203
Active Member
I'm sure it's frustrating being a truck driver sometimes when crossing roads like this where there is just never really a hole big enough for you to get across. So I'm sure sometimes they just pull out and block traffic assuming the cars will stop. I've seen some pretty aggressive truck lane changes in my life because no one ever seems to want to let them over.
AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
But does not sound like that's what happened here...it sounds like it was just a mistake.
Yes. There was plenty of time to stop, though it would have been quite scary.
From the truck driver:
"I pulled up at the stop sign and I looked at the traffic coming south. And it really looked like I had plenty of time to go across, so I proceeded out in the intersection. Once I proceeded out in the intersection, I started looking at the northbound traffic because I was going to take the left-hand lane and proceed on going north. And but -- I mean, it's a very busy intersection. But -- and I've done it a dozen times. And I clearly thought I had plenty of time. I mean, it was dark and the cars looked like they was back further than what they was."
At that point he breaks down.
He did not even realize what had happened - he called his safety supervisor and advised her that he had been involved in a hit and run. At that point as it started to get light he realized there was a piece of windshield stuck in his truck trailer (probably the roof glass actually).
" And I hollered at the guy in the white minivan. I said, did that car just hit me? He goes, yes, and they're leaving. I thought I was -- I thought I had been involved in a hit and run.....But at that time I called safety told them, I said I believe I was involved in a hit and run. And the lady asked me what happened, and I told her -- and I got out of the truck when I was talking to her and I said it looks like there's part of the windshield stuck in the side of my trailer. And at this time the sun was -- you know, it was starting to get a little bit light, not real light, but light enough to see. And I said the glass looks like it's a pink tinted color. I said whoever hit me is probably hurt."
It wasn't until the emergency responders told him the person didn't make it that he realized what had happened.
It looks like Auto High Beams may have been a contributing factor:
"I mean, when I looked and seen them two vehicles coming at me, I mean, one of them -- it looked like one of them flickered their lights, so I thought they was going to slow down. So I proceeded across the intersection.
Q. Do you remember which one that was?
A. It was the one in the right-hand lane. "
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