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Discussion in 'Model S: Driving Dynamics' started by Driver Dave, Jun 7, 2017.
Nobody is objecting to the adventure. The problem was the misrepresentations.
I guess I simply view "we'll have this high tech feature in December... actually its taking longer..." as part of the adventure.
I'd agree with you if I thought for a minute that Elon genuinely believed that the AP2 and FSD code would be ready in December but got surprised. Instead, it was one big lie to sell more cars before the end of the year.
Ok, I believe Elon, like most technology leaders set ambition goals for their team to keep them moving at a competitive pace, but unlike regular car manufactures and dealers, Elon really has no need to tell big lies to succeed. In fact, he tends to be more honest about failures than most CEOs.
Considering the outright lies and rip off car dealers do on a daily basis, skimming millions out of the American public each day for absolutely no value, buying a car with self driving hardware in December and the software for it arrives a bit later than expected, really is nothing.
But the point is, Elon/Tesla has no need for big lies, they just don't need them to succeed.
Starting at around 11:33 is what my AP2 looks like.
Point of clarification: You read Tesla's commentary pre-December 2016 as promising "FSD code would be ready in December"? Can you quote that portion from the way back machine? Maybe I misread back when.
Starting around 11:33 I would have turned it off... all those lines and exits is perfect example of when not to have the driving assist on.
Finally, you're back! In style! Man I missed that screenshot
AP1 would have exactly behaved the same way.
I remember the very first youtube video on AP1 was done in a windy *and* hilly two lane road with opposing traffic (only one lane in each direction and no center median). Sure enough AP1 struggled on a hilly curve and went over the center line. The video headline screamed, "Tesla's Autopilot tried to kill me'.
That kind of idiotic video does no justice to how amazing AP1 is. We are going through the same gyrations with AP2.
Sorry, Brian. I misspoke. Elon still has another month until the Full Self-Driving rollout begins. I got so excited about finally having my Tesla drive me to work that I lost track of time. But surely the code is already finished, and they're just completing their testing and validation.
Musk Wants To Begin Shifting Teslas To 'Full' Self-Driving Capability Within 6 Months (Forbes, 1/24/17)
Let me settle this > 100 post thread.
In no way, shape, or form, has AP2 reached "parity" with AP1, now 6 months overdue.
Disclaimer: I don't have the "silky smooth" firmware, but doubt it works. Can I get my $100 bill now?
I have both. I use both. I don't notice that much difference at this point. In some cases AP2 works better.
They both use lines. They both need lines. They both don't work that great when there are no lines.
Other than that, when they both have lines, they both work pretty well.
What I don't understand is why Tesla took money ahead of time.
I had a $2,500 AP1 car on order.
When they delivered an AP2 car in mid-Dec 2016, they said "in two weeks, your car will do what AP1 does. For $2,500 more, it will do much more shortly after that. But if you wait, it will be $3,500".
They could have solved all of this SO easily. Give me back my $2,500 from the AP1 "purchase." Let me buy AP2 or EAP when it's ready and working, but don't charge me a premium because I refused to buy 4 weeks in advance (which is going to be 50 weeks in reality).
Instead, I was misled into buying EAP for $5K total, and I have a minimal amount to show for it. If Tesla called up everyone and said "sorry, but here's your $5K back, you can buy EAP when it's ready for the same price once you decide it's good enough" then I think 90% of the complaints would go away. Don't punish your early adopters. Even better, leave "EAP" on the cars until Tesla really knows it's at the level of the EAP promises and then have people decide and pay.
The Asshats at Tesla could simply refund our EAP/FSD money and have retained us as fans. Instead they choose to bait & switch, fraudulently market features that didn't work (FSD video) and be greedy pigs. Any complaining I do about their half-baked product is entirely their fault.
The only way I can see that it helped is for those that financed the purchase and don't want to make a separate payment outside of the financing. If it isn't an option at the initial purchase then you can't roll it into the purchase financing.
To me money is money and I'd rather just pay later as you suggest. But to some they get bent out of shape if they can't finance it.
I am not surprised considering how well Tesla markets autopilot.
Sitting in the center lane, ignoring other drivers who are forced to pass on your right (assuming that's the case) is not sharing the road properly. It is considered dangerous, leads to accidents and builds traffic behind you. Less stressful for you, but more stressful for others.
Could not agree more. Between flashers in the rain, left and center-lane drivers, little to no enforcement of text/talk-while-driving laws and just a general inability to drive, FL has quite the reputation for poor and dangerous drivers.
Expectations courteous of Tesla's marketing team.
Exactly. This is the expectation. While it can to some degree, it still requires a human brain. In good faith, autopilot should be referred to as a driving assistant. Semantics? Far from it.
Agreed. But to sell cars and juice the stock it is best to keep that between Tesla and those who already bought one of their models.
I'd like to see Tesla put that exact phrase on a billboard and see how it works out. Even having it appear on their website would be a step in the right direction.
After reading this thread, it is clear there are two sides to the AP perspective with very little in-between. We should be able to agree to disagree.
Sharing our experiences, good or bad, is beneficial for us all, as well as for Tesla if they're listening.
Our expectations are all over the map which puts us into one of two buckets. When it comes to sales, setting the right expectations is key. IMO, Tesla has done a poor job in this department.
Did anyone else catch that guy cross country skiing on that winding paved road in the video posted a bit earlier here? There was a large bus not far behind him. No shoulder to speak of and there are road bikes everywhere, along with plenty of cars and buses - in the rain no less. Good luck trying that in Florida.
Now back to point and counter-point with AP2....
Perhaps a $70k+ car isn't right for them then.
I absolutely disagree with this idea. On the internet, everyone needs to be in agreement. Those not in agreement with ones own assessment of something must be constantly harangued, denigrated, brow beat, mocked, tormented, and as a last resort keelhauled until they come into agreement with you. No one could possibly disagree with that!
@RubberToe Hope you're not disappointed. The Model 3 gotchas may make the AP2 fiasco look like a picnic.
Driving a rented Model S (2016 variety) to Vegas this Friday, and back Monday. Been looking forward to this since I booked the rental on Turo about a two months ago. Can't wait to check out the AP2 system. I even bought a BlackVue I'll mount up for the ride to have the video available. Possibly even a chance that I will get the newest release, we will see. Thats why I have been hanging out in this thread despite all the knuckle heads...
When I'm given the keys to my Model 3, I will be kissing the ground. Just like my grandparents did when they arrived here after being deported from Eastern Europe many moons ago.