Australian Model 3 Waiting Room

[Mrhany]

My view on this issue below:

I have owned a variety of left blinker cars (AMG, AUDI x 2, LR Discovery x 3, VW, Tesla) and right blinker cars (Commodore, Subaru x 2, Hyundai x 3, Suzuki) and cannot understand the issue mentioned above.
If you are incapable of remembering which side the indicator is on, how can you operate a vehicle in a LHD country? Or find the volume controls or cruise controls in an unfamiliar vehicle?
I personally feel that if you are so unaware of what you are doing when controlling a 2+ tonne bit of machinery then you shouldnt be operating one.

In addition, the Tesla stalks have a very distinct "movement" and it is almost impossible to accidentally operate them without realising whats happening. i.e. to go from a 3 blink press to full blinker it is a very solid movement required. Likewise moving into drive or reverse requires a similarly forceful movement.

Lasly, if you shift into reverse, the cameras come up and cover the whole screen. Impossible to not realise what is happening.

I too have owned many cars with right or left blinker stalks and have accumulated about 2 years of driving in the USA over my lifetime. Generally I don't have a problem, but at least for me I know it can happen. The significant difference between the Merc and the Tesla is that you get neutral in the Merc and reverse in the Tesla.

Can you honestly say you have NEVER put the wipers on to turn the corner even though you know that you are in a right stalk car (or vice versa). There are lots of motions involved in driving a car and lot of them don't take a fully conscious thought. Once I decide I want to put the blinker on I don't consciously think about moving my hand to the stalk and which way to push it.

I am at a disadvantage here since I don't have a Tesla yet to try this out on. Perhaps the reversing image coming up on the screen might be enough to warn you, but I suspect that since you aren't intending to reverse and are concentrating on other things like what's in front of you (which is where you think you are going), your brain might filter it out.

Your other comments don't seem to be relevant.

Accidents don't usually have a single cause, it is an accumulation of factors, if you remove one of the factors the accident doesn't happen.

Anyway, I didn't intend my first post to turn in to a back and forth debate. I found an email address for Tesla Australia so I think I will just send them an email with the concern and hope they can pass it to the appropriate engineers for consideration and I will retire from the debate (and wait patiently for my car).

 

[meloccom]

I too have owned many cars with right or left blinker stalks and have accumulated about 2 years of driving in the USA over my lifetime. Generally I don't have a problem, but at least for me I know it can happen. The significant difference between the Merc and the Tesla is that you get neutral in the Merc and reverse in the Tesla.

Can you honestly say you have NEVER put the wipers on to turn the corner even though you know that you are in a right stalk car (or vice versa). There are lots of motions involved in driving a car and lot of them don't take a fully conscious thought. Once I decide I want to put the blinker on I don't consciously think about moving my hand to the stalk and which way to push it.

I am at a disadvantage here since I don't have a Tesla yet to try this out on. Perhaps the reversing image coming up on the screen might be enough to warn you, but I suspect that since you aren't intending to reverse and are concentrating on other things like what's in front of you (which is where you think you are going), your brain might filter it out.

Your other comments don't seem to be relevant.

Accidents don't usually have a single cause, it is an accumulation of factors, if you remove one of the factors the accident doesn't happen.

Anyway, I didn't intend my first post to turn in to a back and forth debate. I found an email address for Tesla Australia so I think I will just send them an email with the concern and hope they can pass it to the appropriate engineers for consideration and I will retire from the debate (and wait patiently for my car).

I have a model S and the controls are different, but similar and I have hit the drive stalk a couple of times instead of the indicators in seven years of ownership, one way you simply re select drive again or in the other direction the worst I have done is select neutral. I’m pretty sure reverse is locked out above a certain low speed.
Edit
I found an online owners manual

Model 3 Owner's Manual | Tesla

Understand how to shift gears and the prerequisites for each gear.

www.tesla.com

From the link:
“If you try to shift when it is prohibited by the current driving speed, a chime sounds and the drive mode does not change.

Reverse​

Push the drive stalk all the way up and release. You can only shift into Reverse when Model 3 is stopped or moving less than 8 km/h.”

 

[Cammo]

Same for me. I’ve been told allow for an extra week.

You should get it this week I assume?

 

[MadFruit]

or moving less than 8 km/h.”

This is weird right, why would you ever want to go from moving forward straight into reverse. Curious to understand that thinking.

 

[ArdieLest]

You should get it this week I assume?

Unfortunately not. I was one of the unlucky ones who ordered an LR in December and have been bumped to Q2.

 

[DM221291]

Not too sure if anyone else has heard the news this morning. A family home has caught fire by the Tesla which was charging.

Whilst the family cat has died it’s lucky no one else was injured.

I wonder how the car was being charged and what caused it to catch fire? Make me rethink charging at home…

Family cat dies in house fire allegedly caused by a charging Tesla

A southwest Sydney family has lost their cat and home after a Tesla car charger allegedly set their garage alight. The fire on Sunday night has 'destroyed' the family's garage and kitchen.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[kalamata]

My view on this issue below:

I have owned a variety of left blinker cars (AMG, AUDI x 2, LR Discovery x 3, VW, Tesla) and right blinker cars (Commodore, Subaru x 2, Hyundai x 3, Suzuki) and cannot understand the issue mentioned above.
If you are incapable of remembering which side the indicator is on, how can you operate a vehicle in a LHD country? Or find the volume controls or cruise controls in an unfamiliar vehicle?
I personally feel that if you are so unaware of what you are doing when controlling a 2+ tonne bit of machinery then you shouldnt be operating one.

In addition, the Tesla stalks have a very distinct "movement" and it is almost impossible to accidentally operate them without realising whats happening. i.e. to go from a 3 blink press to full blinker it is a very solid movement required. Likewise moving into drive or reverse requires a similarly forceful movement.

Lasly, if you shift into reverse, the cameras come up and cover the whole screen. Impossible to not realise what is happening.

It's not about "remembering", after 20+ years on the road most of your small hand movements are just muscle memory. Yes, I'm using the left stalk for blinkers 98% of the time, but when your mind is overloaded a bit - like you need to check if guy on the right is giving you the way, the way to the left is free from pedestrians, kids are chatting on the back seat, - you rely on your muscle memory for the things like blinkers. People that switch cars know how for couple of weeks after a switch you accidentally turn on wipers instead of blinkers in moderate stress situations. However, wipers would not cause accident.

Also you do not look at your screen to see if your camera is on in those situations - you are checking the road and mirrors.

The whole your comment says "it could not happen, impossible if you are paying attention, probably you are pretty shitty driver" - I don't think so, I drove RHD and LHD vehicles for 20+ years, and last 8 years in AU without single incident or fine. And here we are, after a week of driving Tesla I got this situation.

The whole thing could be prevented by either not putting reverse on the stalk, or at least giving sound warning if you switch to reverse.

 

[StepsInTime]

This is weird right, why would you ever want to go from moving forward straight into reverse. Curious to understand that thinking.

Reverse​

Push the drive stalk all the way up and release. You can only shift into Reverse when Model 3 is stopped or moving less than 8 km/h.”

Yes, I have never been in a situation where I was traveling forward at 2-3kph and decided to go into reverse without stopping first. Maybe dropping this from 8kph to 2-3kph would be a good start.

 

[PcS000]

It's not about "remembering", after 20+ years on the road most of your small hand movements are just muscle memory. Yes, I'm using the left stalk for blinkers 98% of the time, but when your mind is overloaded a bit - like you need to check if guy on the right is giving you the way, the way to the left is free from pedestrians, kids are chatting on the back seat, - you rely on your muscle memory for the things like blinkers. People that switch cars know how for couple of weeks after a switch you accidentally turn on wipers instead of blinkers in moderate stress situations. However, wipers would not cause accident.

Also you do not look at your screen to see if your camera is on in those situations - you are checking the road and mirrors.

The whole your comment says "it could not happen, impossible if you are paying attention, probably you are pretty shitty driver" - I don't think so, I drove RHD and LHD vehicles for 20+ years, and last 8 years in AU without single incident or fine. And here we are, after a week of driving Tesla I got this situation.

The whole thing could be prevented by either not putting reverse on the stalk, or at least giving sound warning if you switch to reverse.

Did you read this from meloccom?

I have a model S and the controls are different, but similar and I have hit the drive stalk a couple of times instead of the indicators in seven years of ownership, one way you simply re select drive again or in the other direction the worst I have done is select neutral. I’m pretty sure reverse is locked out above a certain low speed.
Edit
I found an online owners manual

Model 3 Owner's Manual | Tesla

Understand how to shift gears and the prerequisites for each gear.

www.tesla.com

From the link:
“If you try to shift when it is prohibited by the current driving speed, a chime sounds and the drive mode does not change.

Reverse​

Push the drive stalk all the way up and release. You can only shift into Reverse when Model 3 is stopped or moving less than 8 km/h.”

 

[StepsInTime]

everyone waiting for their LR’s. Where are you guys located ?

Canberra.

 

[kalamata]

Did you read this from meloccom?

yes I did?

As I mentioned, I stopped, turned the "blinker" on, ensured that car on the right gives me the way, and started moving. Do not see how that "8 kmh limit" changes anything?

 

[kalamata]

Just for the sake of simplicity, my real situation could be replaced with hypothetical "you are stopping at STOP sign of T intersection, with intention to turn left, turning on left blinker, look both ways that there are no cars, and start moving".

If you used the wrong stalk you will go backwards. There is a chance that you notice that there is no blinker sound, that rear view camera is on your screen, or that 4mm letter "R" is darker than 4mm letter "D" now, but chances are you are paying attention to the road, not the screen or quiet sounds of blinker.

From my point of view, that's clearly bad design, and much more dangerous than poor choices of v11 UI. Not sure why that needs to be stressed, arguments brushing that off are the same as "we don't need to block switch to Parking when car is driving 50 km/h, if you cannot prevent accidental pressing that button on the stalk, than you should not drive 2 tonne heavy machinery".

 

[believer__]

I see the shipping information was update 1/April

http://www.armacup.com/documents/Schedules/AsiaNZSchedule.pdf

If we were to expect a car leaving on the
20/4 Morning Crystal

When would we expect to receive a VIN? How much before that date?

 

[ArdieLest]

I see the shipping information was update 1/April

http://www.armacup.com/documents/Schedules/AsiaNZSchedule.pdf

If we were to expect a car leaving on the
20/4 Morning Crystal

When would we expect to receive a VIN? How much before that date?

VINs can be allocated anywhere between the factory and reaching PK on the ship. You won't 100% get a VIN before the car is shipped.
To make matters worse the Shanghai factory is still in shutdown and it is one day at a time as to when it will reopen.

 

[ArdieLest]

Just for the sake of simplicity, my real situation could be replaced with hypothetical "you are stopping at STOP sign of T intersection, with intention to turn left, turning on left blinker, look both ways that there are no cars, and start moving".

If you used the wrong stalk you will go backwards. There is a chance that you notice that there is no blinker sound, that rear view camera is on your screen, or that 4mm letter "R" is darker than 4mm letter "D" now, but chances are you are paying attention to the road, not the screen or quiet sounds of blinker.

From my point of view, that's clearly bad design, and much more dangerous than poor choices of v11 UI. Not sure why that needs to be stressed, arguments brushing that off are the same as "we don't need to block switch to Parking when car is driving 50 km/h, if you cannot prevent accidental pressing that button on the stalk, than you should not drive 2 tonne heavy machinery".

I think it is more of just an unfamiliar environment for you.
Many makes and models have the same setup with the gear lever as the Model 3 (Mercedes mostly).
It is a very distinctive movement of the stalk and doesn't feel the same as putting an indicator on

Probably just a case of getting used to it and while it is new just making sure you're paying attention to it.
How are you finding the car overall? Are you happy with it after the wait and was it all worth it?

 

[garylovesbeer]

To make matters worse the Shanghai factory is still in shutdown and it is one day at a time as to when it will reopen.

Thought it was reopening today?

 

[jazeng]

Not too sure if anyone else has heard the news this morning. A family home has caught fire by the Tesla which was charging.

Whilst the family cat has died it’s lucky no one else was injured.

I wonder how the car was being charged and what caused it to catch fire? Make me rethink charging at home…

Family cat dies in house fire allegedly caused by a charging Tesla

A southwest Sydney family has lost their cat and home after a Tesla car charger allegedly set their garage alight. The fire on Sunday night has 'destroyed' the family's garage and kitchen.

www.dailymail.co.uk

thought provoking- i read about a similar incident in the US but that was a model S. wonder which model they had in the garage.

 

[kalamata]

I think it is more of just an unfamiliar environment for you.
Many makes and models have the same setup with the gear lever as the Model 3 (Mercedes mostly).
It is a very distinctive movement of the stalk and doesn't feel the same as putting an indicator on

Probably just a case of getting used to it and while it is new just making sure you're paying attention to it.
How are you finding the car overall? Are you happy with it after the wait and was it all worth it?

That would "just a case of getting used" if it was not a car not driving in a way driver expects and can injure people. That's brushing off safety issue. That's not moving "play" button in Spotify interface in unfamiliar place, that's experimental features that do not have enough safety guardrails and could lead to people injured. Any other car on the road has "Reverse" on the stalk?

I'm pretty frustrated that most of Tesla owners are just happy to ignore all that stuff and focus on "how great the car is". Wondering, what the guy that has his house ruined and cat killed think about how great the car is?

 

[Onshore]

This is weird right, why would you ever want to go from moving forward straight into reverse. Curious to understand that thinking.

3 point turn?

 

[garylovesbeer]

Wondering, what the guy that has his house ruined and cat killed think about how great the car is?

Have you seen any proof that the car caused the fire? I think the only article seen so far is the Daily Mirror one. Could have been poor wiring or a number of other causes.
All I can say is that it is very fortunate that the Coroner is not involved.
Also the last thing we need at this stage of EV adoption is for charging to be banned in peoples' homes.
Also someone on Facebook someone made the salient remark "Interesting that they were able to put it out. Mustn't have been the battery then. Seems a bit suss to assume it was the car".
Sounds plausible.