Camping Trailer Selection for Model X

[Zaphod]

Can anyone offer any thoughts on how the X would fair towing this trailer? It is not overly heavy (~3900# dry weight) but I'm sure the aerodynamics are horrible compared to an Airstream. Our current 2016 Ford Explorer, which probably gets ~20mpg normally, drops down to ~12-13mpg when towing this trailer. But I think I am not the most efficient towing it.

Farthest we've traveled from home with the trailer was ~60 miles, so I'm sure even a 75D would be able to handle that. But I'm sure in the future we will wander further from home. Greatly appreciate any thoughts. Thanks!

Full Specs for 2016 Keystone Passport Ultra Lite Express 238ML RVs | RVUSA.com

 

[ohmman]

Can anyone offer any thoughts on how the X would fair towing this trailer? It is not overly heavy (~3900# dry weight) but I'm sure the aerodynamics are horrible compared to an Airstream. Our current 2016 Ford Explorer, which probably gets ~20mpg normally, drops down to ~12-13mpg when towing this trailer. But I think I am not the most efficient towing it.

Farthest we've traveled from home with the trailer was ~60 miles, so I'm sure even a 75D would be able to handle that. But I'm sure in the future we will wander further from home. Greatly appreciate any thoughts. Thanks!

Full Specs for 2016 Keystone Passport Ultra Lite Express 238ML RVs | RVUSA.com

You quote the dry weight, the GVWR is 5400 lbs. I think you could pack light and keep it under 5000, but then you run into the question of keeping the tongue under 500 lbs. Dry tongue weight is listed at 495 lbs, and the tongue rating of the X hitch is 500. A frequently quoted rule-of-thumb for towing is to stay under 80% of the vehicle and hitch ratings. I don't have any empirical support for that, so do with it what you will. I think it's more about keeping one from white-knuckling while driving.

My feeling is that this trailer is not safely towable with a Model X. If it were, my guess is that your range would be in the 80-120 mile range with a 90D, and less with a 75D. Your 60 mile distance wouldn't be round-trip capable unless there were hookups at the campsite (for the car, not the trailer).

With this size of a sail behind the vehicle, you also will enter the realm of anti-sway and weight distribution hitches, which I've been researching myself.

I wouldn't recommend that trailer at all.

 

[ecarfan]

Can anyone offer any thoughts on how the X would fair towing this trailer? It is not overly heavy (~3900# dry weight)
Full Specs for 2016 Keystone Passport Ultra Lite Express 238ML RVs | RVUSA.com

Calling that trailer "Ultra Lite" goes beyond standard marketing obfuscation and into truly Orwellian territory. As @ohmman points out, that trailer's tongue weight is pushing the limit of the X towing spec. I wouldn't try it.

Full disclosure: I have never owned a trailer or towed one. I am trying to educate myself because I plan to tow a trailer with a Tesla (exact model TBD) when I receive my Safari Condo Alto trailer in early 2018.

 

[Zaphod]

You quote the dry weight, the GVWR is 5400 lbs. I think you could pack light and keep it under 5000, but then you run into the question of keeping the tongue under 500 lbs. Dry tongue weight is listed at 495 lbs, and the tongue rating of the X hitch is 500. A frequently quoted rule-of-thumb for towing is to stay under 80% of the vehicle and hitch ratings. I don't have any empirical support for that, so do with it what you will. I think it's more about keeping one from white-knuckling while driving.

My feeling is that this trailer is not safely towable with a Model X. If it were, my guess is that your range would be in the 80-120 mile range with a 90D, and less with a 75D. Your 60 mile distance wouldn't be round-trip capable unless there were hookups at the campsite (for the car, not the trailer).

With this size of a sail behind the vehicle, you also will enter the realm of anti-sway and weight distribution hitches, which I've been researching myself.

I wouldn't recommend that trailer at all.

I am well aware of all the things you mention and already have weight distribution hitch and electric brake controller. From an overall feel of towing, I can't imagine it would be any worse than our Explorer which handles it just fine. Was just thinking out loud what potential range would be.

 

[Zaphod]

Calling that trailer "Ultra Lite" goes beyond standard marketing obfuscation and into truly Orwellian territory. As @ohmman points out, that trailer's tongue weight is pushing the limit of the X towing spec. I wouldn't try it.

Full disclosure: I have never owned a trailer or towed one. I am trying to educate myself because I plan to tow a trailer with a Tesla (exact model TBD) when I receive my Safari Condo Alto trailer in early 2018.

Well, it is a 25ft trailer and it is fairly light for it's size. Comparable trailers (not including higher-end ones) will be easily in the 5,000+ pound range. It's apples and oranges comparison to trailers like your Alto or the Basecamp mentioned in this thread. It's much bigger and cheaper so doesn't have all the fancy aluminum and such.

Our current tow vehicle has the same tow rating as the X, 500 pounds tongue and 5000 pounds gross. It handles it just fine. Anyway, was just pondering range potential. And trying to find an excuse to get an X and give my wife the 3 reservation.

 

[ecarfan]

And trying to find an excuse to get an X and give my wife the 3 reservation.

Who needs an excuse to buy a Tesla no matter what the model?

If you want to tow a trailer, right now the X is the only "factory approved" choice, and there are a lot of trailers on the market that the X can tow beside small ones like the Alto or BaseCamp.

 

[ohmman]

Regarding teardrops and travel trailer aerodynamics, I've added a new post to my other thread which describes some interesting findings that may be important to travel trailer selection.

 

[ecarfan]

We hope to join you in 2018 with our 1723

Just checking to see if you have picked up your Alto R1723? I’ll PM you...

 

[aesculus]

I thought I had posted this tutorial that @ohmman helped me with in this thread but a search came up blank, just in case you have not seen it.

Towing with EVTO | Digital Auto Guides

 

[JimVandegriff]

I'm not sure this link has been posted before, but if you are interested in a used Airstream travel trailer, a good source to find them is Airstream Trailer Classifieds - Airstream Trailers For Sale. This site has individuals selling their own used trailers (some with little use), and a few dealers that specialize in used Airstreams. It is worth a look if you want to purchase a used trailer to save some money. Jim (looking forward to three weeks in our sport 22 pulled by our X in October.)

 

[idoco]

I'm not sure this link has been posted before, but if you are interested in a used Airstream travel trailer, a good source to find them is Airstream Trailer Classifieds - Airstream Trailers For Sale. This site has individuals selling their own used trailers (some with little use), and a few dealers that specialize in used Airstreams. It is worth a look if you want to purchase a used trailer to save some money. Jim (looking forward to three weeks in our sport 22 pulled by our X in October.)

Another advantage is that many of the "recently older" Airstreams have better specs for towing with an MX. Lighter dry weights and lower tongue weights. Also opens up different floor plans.

https://www.airstream.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Trailer-Motorhome-Weights.pdf

For instance a 2018 Airstream Sport 22 has a 3643 dry weight, 4500 lb GVWR, and a 422 hitch weight. No double axle 2018 Airstream, such as the Flying Cloud, have specs with GVWR < 5000 lb and hitch weight < 500 lb.

Go back ten years and prior and you can get a double axle 2008 Safari 22 with a lighter dry weight and hitch weight than a 2018 Sport. Or a 2002 International 22. Even further back a 1983 International 27!

 

[DarkHelmet]

I’ve got a UEV-490 on order for delivery next year (for tow behind my Rubicon). Plenty of badass MX towable campers.

Conqueror North America

Also check out Patriot campers... they’re pretty awesome. Available in the US.

Patriot Campers - The Ultimate Off Road Camper Trailer. Built for the harsh Australian Outback. View the award winning Patriot Campers Range.

 

[ohmman]

I’ve got a UEV-490 on order for delivery next year (for tow behind my Rubicon). Plenty of badass MX towable campers.

Conqueror North America

Also check out Patriot campers... they’re pretty awesome. Available in the US.

Patriot Campers - The Ultimate Off Road Camper Trailer. Built for the harsh Australian Outback. View the award winning Patriot Campers Range.

Very cool campers. But those do look like they're much more terrain-capable than the X. They outclass it quite a bit in that regard, so I'm not sure if they're the proper pairing. If I had one of those, I'd want to be able to take it where it can go!

 

[DarkHelmet]

They’re def a little more off grid but if you want a small, lightweight, capable camper to tow behind a MX the Patriot is hard to overlook.

 

[JimVandegriff]

For Pacific Northwest Model X owners - The Portland RV and van show starts today at the Portland Expo Center. Illijana and I attended this show before we purchased our Airstream and got to see and examine a large number of trailers before we found what we liked. The show runs from Sept.13-16, and more info is available at pdxrvshow.com. There is a discount coupon for the show at the website. It is a gigantic show, and a great place to check out trailers. Let us know what you see that appeals to you.

 

[JimVandegriff]

Here is the list of RV's at the Portland RV show - I note that Airstream is not listed, but that is where we saw them in a previous year. It is quite the list!

AERO TEARDROPS AERO
ARCTIC FOX APACHE CAMPING
ASPEN TRAIL BLUE DOG
ATLAS CAMPING WORLD
AURA FUNTIME
AUTUMN RIDGE BLUE DOG
AUTUMN RIDGE OUTFITTER BLUE DOG
BEACON B YOUNG
BIG COUNTRY BLUE DOG
BIGFOOT APACHE CAMPING
BLACK SERIES BLACK SERIES
BLACKSTONE APACHE CAMPING
BULLET CAMPING WORLD
CARDINAL FUNTIME
CEDAR CREEK PAUL EVERTS
CHEROKEE APACHE CAMPING
CHEROKEE ALPHA WOLF BLUE DOG
CHEROKEE ARCTIC WOLF BLUE DOG
CHEROKEE GREYWOLF APACHE CAMPING
CHEROKEE WOLF PUP APACHE CAMPING
COLEMAN CAMPING WORLD
CONNECT APACHE CAMPING
CREEK SIDE APACHE CAMPING
CRUSADER BLUE DOG
CYCLONE FUNTIME
DESERT FOX APACHE CAMPING
E PRO APACHE CAMPING
EAGLE CAMPING WORLD
ELK RIDGE BLUE DOG
ESCAPE APACHE CAMPING
EVO FAMILY FUN
EVO ATS FAMILY FUN
EVO FS FAMILY FUN
FALCON FUNTIME
FLAGSTAFF APACHE CAMPING
FOX MOUNTAIN APACHE CAMPING
FREEDOM EXPRESS APACHE CAMPING
FUEL CAMPING WORLD
FUN FINDER FUNTIME
GATEWAY FUNTIME
HEMISPHERE FAMILY FUN
HIDEOUT B YOUNG
HQ 12 BLACK SERIES
HQ 15 BLACK SERIES
HQ 17 BLACK SERIES
HQ 19 BLACK SERIES
HUMMINGBIRD CAMPING WORLD
HYPERLITE FAMILY FUN
IDAHO TOTE TRUE NORTH IND.
IMAGINE B YOUNG
IMPRESSION FAMILY FUN
JAY FEATHER CAMPING WORLD
JAY FLIGHT CAMPING WORLD
JAY FLIGHT SLX CAMPING WORLD
KODIAK B YOUNG
LA CROSSE PAUL EVERTS
LITTLE GUY MAX B YOUNG
LITTLE GUY MINI MAX B YOUNG
MALLARD CAMPING WORLD
MICROLITE APACHE CAMPING
MICRO MINNIE B YOUNG
MINNIE DROP B YOUNG
MINNIE PLUS B YOUNG
MOMENTUM B YOUNG
MT MCKINLEY PAUL EVERTS
NASH APACHE CAMPING
NO BO / NO BOUNDARY FUNTIME
NORTH TRAIL CAMPING WORLD
OPEN RANGE BLUE DOG
POWERHOUSE COACH POWERHOUSE COACH
PREMIER CAMPING WORLD
R POD FUNTIME
REDWOOD B YOUNG
REFLECTION B YOUNG
RENEGADE FUNTIME
RUBICON BLUE DOG
SALEM FUNTIME
SANDSTORM BLUE DOG
SANIBEL BLUE DOG
SHADOW CRUISER BLUE DOG
SHAMROCK APACHE CAMPING
SHOCKWAVE FUNTIME
SOJOURN FAMILY FUN
SOLITUDE B YOUNG
SONOMA FAMILY FUN
SPORTSMEN APACHE CAMPING
SPRINTER CAMPING WORLD
STRYKER BLUE DOG
SURVEYOR FUNTIME
TAB APACHE CAMPING
TAB 400 APACHE CAMPING
TAG APACHE CAMPING
TIMBER RIDGE APACHE CAMPING
TORQUE FUNTIME
TRACER PAUL EVERTS
TRACER BREEZE PAUL EVERTS
TRANSCEND B YOUNG
ULTRA LITE BLUE DOG
VENGEANCE FAMILY FUN
VIBE FUNTIME
VILANO B YOUNG
VOLANTE PAUL EVERTS
VOLTAGE B YOUNG
WHITEHAWK CAMPING WORLD
WILDCAT FUNTIME
WILDERNESS BLUE DOG
WILDWOOD BLUE DOG
WILDWOOD XLITE BLUE DOG

 

[idoco]

And on the east coast the same RV show is in Hershey PA Sept 12-16th.

Also if anyone is interested in seeing the Bowlus Road Chief in person I'll be at an EV event outside DC on Saturday. Thanks to @TaylorJD

National Drive Electric Week Poolesville Day Event 2018 Driver and Vendor Information

 

[bob_p]

Bowlus recently posted a nice video walkthrough of the Road Chief.

It looks like a great trailer, with a number of very nice features, though I wish the company improved their business practices.

To join their insider program and get information on new Road Chief editions, they require payment of $1,000 and committing to their terms & conditions (without providing them to you prior to making the payment) and that you agree to execute a non-disclosure agreement (without providing that to you for review, prior to making the payment), and don't even document their refund policy.

We were considering joining their insider program, so we'd learn about their new editions, but due to how they have set up their insider program, decided against joining.

 

[KirkNason]

During the Model X launch event an Airstream was towed on the stage as an example. We are looking for a camping trailer. Our requirements are as follows:

• 2 independent sleeping areas
• shower/toilet
• light weight and aerodynamic for good range
• ample space on the roof to put semi-flexibe solar (single-curvature roof line)

We like to camp in remote places, which makes for long distances between charging and slow charging too. If possible we avoid traditional camgrounds with full hookups.

Choices so far:
1 - Airstream FLying Cloud 19 - $US60k+, GVW 4500lbs, 19'2" by 8' - Floorplans | Flying Cloud | Airstream
Good quality, but heavy. Drag probably ok. limited space for semi-flexible solar panels.
View attachment 96616View attachment 96617


2 - Safari Condo R1723 - $CDN31k., Base Weight 1760 lbw, GVW estimated 2260lbs, - Caravanes (Alto) – SÉRIE R – 1723 | Safari Condo
Very aerodynamic due to lifting roof, very light, lots of space for solar, smaller, less convenience, new available earliest January 2017
View attachment 96619 View attachment 96618

Does anybody have experiences with these or any other suggestions to look at?

 

[Atlantian]

The Airstream Flying Cloud 19 has a hitch weight of 550 lbs. which is over Tesla's limit of 500 lbs. I don't have experience with the Safari Condo trailers but I did briefly look at buying one until I found out delivery times were 16 to 18 months.

I finally bought the Airstream Sport 22FB (same as @JimVandegriff, @ohmman and @mengwong) for the following reasons:

1. Has a full bathroom with separate shower (not a wet bath).
2. Is only 7' 3" wide which makes it more aerodynamic than 8' wide trailers.
3. Has a base weight of 3600 lbs. (4500 GVWR) and a hitch weight of 422 lbs. which is within Tesla's limits.
4. Has a separate main sleeping and dinette area.
5. Can sleep up to 4 people.

I was able to fit 3 solar panels on the roof. One 100 watt and two 50 watt for a combined power of 200W. If you like I can take a picture of the roof so you can see the layout. I believe there is room for additional panels.