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Can't decide between Model S or Audi S6

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My hat's off to you Derek... for you commitment to a calm and purely logical discussion/decision - in the face of a lot fan boys on both sides of the fence. Your arguments are quite valid.

You were getting peppered pretty robustly there (and probably still will). This is after all, a new kind of fun in driving that can't be found anywhere else...(like you say) If you're trying outrun your supervillains.
 
The Audi S6 makes a good 'feature/performance" comparison, however, the Model S is a game changer. I think most Tesla vehicle owners and reservation holders are in this because it's different and can quite possibly convince the establishment that we don't need to burn up all the fossil fuels to the point where we're choked out of our own planet. It's impossible not to be a bit hypocritical... I currently drive an Audi S4 which even though more efficient than previous models, burns a lot of gas (premium gas). When the lease expires in a couple months, I will be driving my Model S Performance instead :)

At this point, buying a Tesla is not about saving money, it's about taking a risk to change a 100 year old way of getting around.
 
I like being green. But for me, buying the S is about being green and getting a wonderful driver's car that's also quite practical (range and capacity). If the S weren't out there, I would be buying another ICE car, not a hybrid or electric because there's a limit to how much I'm willing to compromise my experience as a driver.

But the S is out there. And I like being green so I'm willing to spend a more than I normally spend on a car to get it.

I think there are a lot more people out there like me. I think that if the Model S is to become a viable 20K per year car, the Model S is going to be about a drivetrain that delivers full torque instantly, paired with a great handling chassis, very comfortable ride and practical form factor (5+ passengers and plenty of cargo room). And it's green :).

The S is a wonderful driver's car. It just so happens that the only way to get this entire package is to go with an electric drivetrain. Kudos to Elon and the Tesla team for building a car that leverages the advantages of a fully electric drivetrain.
 
I'm simply wondering, for example, why your comparison includes a sound package for the Model S, but not for the Audi. Very simple. To me it just doesn't look like a "fair" (your word) comparison of "apples to apples" (your words). If someone cares enough about an *optional* sunroof to include it in a cost comparison and chooses to pay $1,500 for it, then it should be pointed out that this *choice* is for a much better sunroof (at least in my opinion).

I've addressed these and your other items, many of which are silly arguments from a fanboi.

I'll lay money down you haven't actually done a real test drive in an S6. If you had, you'd know that the standard S6 audio system is better than the optional one included in Model S, especially for the rear passengers. As for your insistence that one compare the S6 with a sunroof to Model S without a sunroof, well, that's pretty much the end of our discussion.
 
+1. Where's that "LIKE" button? :smile:

Yes! Anyone considering getting a $70k+ car that is using saving money as their primary reason for buying the car might want to re-evaluate things anyway as a nice $40k car might also work as well and you'll come out ahead. It's reasonable of course to compare the Model S to something in a similar price range but I think the driving experience or the fact that the Model S is an EV has to be a top 3 reason to get it at this point. Maybe in a few years when Tesla catches up with the cool toys (ACC, heads up displays...etc) then it will be an even easier comparison.
 
I like being green. But for me, buying the S is about being green and getting a wonderful driver's car that's also quite practical (range and capacity). If the S weren't out there, I would be buying another ICE car, not a hybrid or electric because there's a limit to how much I'm willing to compromise my experience as a driver.

But the S is out there. And I like being green so I'm willing to spend a more than I normally spend on a car to get it.

I think there are a lot more people out there like me. I think that if the Model S is to become a viable 20K per year car, the Model S is going to be about a drivetrain that delivers full torque instantly, paired with a great handling chassis, very comfortable ride and practical form factor (5+ passengers and plenty of cargo room). And it's green :).

I'm one of those people out there like you. We have five kids ages 4-17 and a 2002 Honda Odyssey minivan, which at some point we'll replace with a new one (Model X is too small, and want an ICE car for family road trips). My car is a 2011 Audi A4 that has been maintenance-free and a joy to drive. Last summer when the dealer called at the two-year mark about trading it in for a new one, I said I was good for several more years. Then I got more interested in the Model S and reserved in early November after seeing one in the Natick store, thinking it would arrive at the A4's 3-year mark. Instead I got my configure email last month and will have the S later this month or next - I can't wait.

I wouldn't be buying a new car if it weren't for the Model S. For me it's not just about being green, but being part of a movement for change - while enjoying the ride. I'm an early adopter (broadband, wifi, Sonos, Alarm.com, etc.) and like others here am willing to take the risk and put in the effort to help this technology - and company - cross the chasm to the mainstream. And I can sort of justify replacing my A4 with a car that costs twice as much because it can carry the entire family when needed (jump seats) with no tailpipe, supported by fuel and maintenance savings and the solar superchargers.

As witnessed by the New York Times article (discussion thread here), we have a ways to go until taking an extended road trip in a Model S is foolproof, especially in winter. As a Model S owner I will work to address this - I've already emailed a hotel and ski area I frequent in New Hampshire to lobby them to install chargers. And I want to prove to the anti-EV, anti-Tesla idiots who comment on every article online that they are dead wrong.
 
Was there an update to this that I missed? Has there been any decision? I thought there was some urgency to making a decision last year from reading earlier posts.

Good plan.
I drove the BMW M5 today. It seemed pretty similar to the Audi S6. It might have taken a hair longer to shift, but it was pretty close. (So, so much better than the Infiniti M56 which took forever to downshift).

I then drove the Model S again. I actually thought that it took a bit more g-force for me to get the M5 or S6 to start squealing the tires than for the MSP, which somewhat surprised me with Tesla's 21" wheels and low CG. (All 3 are way better than my SLK32). I also found that MSP's traction control was a bit more intrusive than I had remembered. While it's light years ahead of my SLK32's traction control, I thought Audi's Quattro was able to better deal with wheels that were slipping.

And yet, somehow, at the end of the day, the grin on my face was much bigger after driving the Tesla. Instantaneous power is so wonderful. It can make things so smooth (or more precisely, it's so much smoother when driving like a supervillain is out to get you). And it's so much quieter when you stomp the pedal.

After that experiment, it seems likely that I'll finally finalize my reservation.

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Yes, the destination charge should not be included in the decision. I was trying to say that in my initial point, but I should have said that more explicitly.
 
Has anyone mentioned that the 5-60 times. 4.9 for the s6 and 4.5 for the MSP according to car and driver. When you take the launch out of the situation expecially with a double clutch transmission things change. I own a M3 with a DCT trans and if you dont launch with LC you loose dig time. The MSP does not have this. As you know you hit the gas you are accelerating at the max level. With double clutch cars you need to go through the launch procedure and failing to do this costs time. The s6 looses 1.3 seconds starting at 5 mph where the MSP gains .1 sec. Thoughts???
 
Has anyone mentioned that the 5-60 times....Thoughts???

MSP kills the S6 in terms of straight-line acceleration to 60MPH (at least) - both in absolute numbers and feel. The twin turbo doesn't punch you in the stomach when you mash the pedal.

However, I felt the S6 was superior in terms of steering feel, handling, interior quality and comfort, backseat headroom, exterior size, and available technology/convenience features. Yes, the 17" touchscreen is cool, but that doesn't make up for missing heads-up display, night vision, multiple exterior cameras, electrically folding exterior mirrors, normal size wheels/tires etc. - at least in my mind. It'd be interesting to see how the cars compare in a slalom run.

I decided to put some money into our existing car and wait to see what EVs come out a few years from now. I don't want to buy another gasser, but I'm not ready to settle for the Model S v1, either.
 
derekt75 is now the proud owner of a Model S. Has been for a while I think.

Yes indeed.
Sorry I didn't reply after I took ownership on 12/31, but I didn't realize the thread was going to get revived.

Anyway, I'll never know if I made the right choice. The car is mostly as expected. It's tremendous fun to quietly accelerate. I like not having to worry about the car downshifting when you punch it (although, if you've never driven a car with a dual clutch transmission like the S6 or M5, you should know that those cars shift in a small fraction of a second unlike most automatics). I love that my car is never low on fuel.

Plugging in / unplugging the charger takes less time than I expected. I estimate it costs me about 5 seconds each morning and night, or about one minute per week, which is much less than the time I used to waste going to gas stations. It could be faster if there weren't various flaky issues related to charging.

My Model S has more issues than I was hoping for. I figured it would likely have more things wrong than the Audi, but I was hoping I'd get lucky. The car runs well, though (except for the time it went into limp mode for 20 seconds or so).

The air suspension provides a very smooth ride [at least compared to my SLK32], but the car does sometimes feel a little unsettled to me when the accelerator pedal is floored.

The touchscreen is not as easy to use as I had hoped. Even though I'm somewhat used to it now, my eyes are still off the road longer when I switch radio stations, or change the fan speed than in a car with physical buttons. I still think it was a good choice by Tesla to go with a simple screen than a panel of buttons, but it does take me longer to do many common tasks.

The huge screen will hopefully have more benefits in the future. I'm looking forward to Tesla allowing 3rd parties to develop tools for it. Once they do, it won't be long before someone has parking guidance lines integrated with the backup camera, and someone else has a radio program with 12 presets instead of 6, with the steering wheel controls cycling through the presets instead of scanning.

Anyway, I'm not sure that Jalopnik's "Beta test" characterization is off the mark, but I can say that even in its current state, this car is a ton of fun.

Derek

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MSP kills the S6 in terms of straight-line acceleration to 60MPH (at least) - both in absolute numbers and feel. The twin turbo doesn't punch you in the stomach when you mash the pedal.

However, I felt the S6 was superior in terms of steering feel, handling, interior quality and comfort, backseat headroom, exterior size, and available technology/convenience features. Yes, the 17" touchscreen is cool, but that doesn't make up for missing heads-up display, night vision, multiple exterior cameras, electrically folding exterior mirrors, normal size wheels/tires etc. - at least in my mind. It'd be interesting to see how the cars compare in a slalom run.

I decided to put some money into our existing car and wait to see what EVs come out a few years from now. I don't want to buy another gasser, but I'm not ready to settle for the Model S v1, either.
Well, since you're talking "feel", I thought the S6 felt faster. It has higher peak acceleration, and I think that's what my stomach & tukhus are most sensitive to (rather than the average acceleration over 4 or 5 seconds).

The touchscreen right now is a negative to me, so I don't expect that to make up for any of the missing features in the Model S. What I think could make up for it is the car getting energy at home, the silence when accelerating, and never needing to shift.

Waiting for Tesla to polish their offering would be nice, but my roadster was inappropriate for transporting my baby.
 
My wife loves Audis in general, but we and thousands of others on this forum think you made the right choice (not that that means anything to you), and hopefully your baby will also in time. We have a ton of friends who are having issues with new Audis, somer verious serious so having issues with cars is normal. Congrats!

Yes indeed.
Sorry I didn't reply after I took ownership on 12/31, but I didn't realize the thread was going to get revived.

Anyway, I'll never know if I made the right choice.

Waiting for Tesla to polish their offering would be nice, but my roadster was inappropriate for transporting my baby.
 
Hey Derekt,

It's not completely clear from your response, but it sounds like a few of your steering wheel buttons may not be working?

When you have the radio on, the buttons on the left side of the steering wheel should switch you from preset to preset. (At least that's what I thought it did, I'll check next time I head out the door)

You can use the right buttons to change fan speed, even setting it to the right scroll wheel if you want (in the same area that you can set the right steering buttons to control your sunroof, temperature, etc).

Peter

Yes indeed.
Sorry I didn't reply after I took ownership on 12/31, but I didn't realize the thread was going to get revived.

Anyway, I'll never know if I made the right choice. The car is mostly as expected. It's tremendous fun to quietly accelerate. I like not having to worry about the car downshifting when you punch it (although, if you've never driven a car with a dual clutch transmission like the S6 or M5, you should know that those cars shift in a small fraction of a second unlike most automatics). I love that my car is never low on fuel.

Plugging in / unplugging the charger takes less time than I expected. I estimate it costs me about 5 seconds each morning and night, or about one minute per week, which is much less than the time I used to waste going to gas stations. It could be faster if there weren't various flaky issues related to charging.

My Model S has more issues than I was hoping for. I figured it would likely have more things wrong than the Audi, but I was hoping I'd get lucky. The car runs well, though (except for the time it went into limp mode for 20 seconds or so).

The air suspension provides a very smooth ride [at least compared to my SLK32], but the car does sometimes feel a little unsettled to me when the accelerator pedal is floored.

The touchscreen is not as easy to use as I had hoped. Even though I'm somewhat used to it now, my eyes are still off the road longer when I switch radio stations, or change the fan speed than in a car with physical buttons. I still think it was a good choice by Tesla to go with a simple screen than a panel of buttons, but it does take me longer to do many common tasks.

The huge screen will hopefully have more benefits in the future. I'm looking forward to Tesla allowing 3rd parties to develop tools for it. Once they do, it won't be long before someone has parking guidance lines integrated with the backup camera, and someone else has a radio program with 12 presets instead of 6, with the steering wheel controls cycling through the presets instead of scanning.

Anyway, I'm not sure that Jalopnik's "Beta test" characterization is off the mark, but I can say that even in its current state, this car is a ton of fun.

Derek

- - - Updated - - -


Well, since you're talking "feel", I thought the S6 felt faster. It has higher peak acceleration, and I think that's what my stomach & tukhus are most sensitive to (rather than the average acceleration over 4 or 5 seconds).

The touchscreen right now is a negative to me, so I don't expect that to make up for any of the missing features in the Model S. What I think could make up for it is the car getting energy at home, the silence when accelerating, and never needing to shift.

Waiting for Tesla to polish their offering would be nice, but my roadster was inappropriate for transporting my baby.