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Delay in model X launch?
- Thread starter Eds
- Start date
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- Tags
- Model X model x launch
hill
high fiber member
Krugerrand
Meow
Please. The FBI goes around issuing warrants for the arrest of non-US citizens because of a lack of merit. Do you think Tesla just randomly pulled some ex-employee's name out of hat, called the FBI and said, 'Yo, FBI, we THINK this person did some bad stuff, and we know you've got nothing better to do, so, um...wanna go arrest them?
I'd hope that a company with a mission to help humanity survive its own self-destructiveness would in fact have a positive bearing on moral compasses and moral decisions.
Are you sure you wanted to use the word 'reality' there? In reading many of your posts, reality often never enters the picture. It's a bunch of wishy-washy, maybe this, possibly that tossed in a good amount of passive aggressive. Case in point: ....if what we read has merit. The 'reality' is there's enough merit to bake cake for everyone.
I'll only chime in on this one point, but I have to agree with AR here. Morality should be applied the same way to all situations and entities. While I agree that Tesla's mission is important (and a major catalyst in my purchase(s)), I think their action should be judged on equal footing to any other entity.
I don't think you were disagreeing with that, but I think maybe you didn't catch that from his comment. I just wanted to clarify.
hill
high fiber member
Please. The FBI goes around issuing warrants for the arrest of non-US citizens because of a lack of merit. Do you think Tesla just randomly pulled some ex-employee's name out of hat, called the FBI and said, 'Yo, FBI, we THINK this person did some bad stuff, and we know you've got nothing better to do, so, um...wanna go arrest them?
I'd hope that a company with a mission to help humanity survive its own self-destructiveness would in fact have a positive bearing on moral compasses and moral decisions.
Are you sure you wanted to use the word 'reality' there? In reading many of your posts, reality often never enters the picture. It's a bunch of wishy-washy, maybe this, possibly that tossed in a good amount of passive aggressive. Case in point: ....if what we read has merit. The 'reality' is there's enough merit to bake cake for everyone.
As per usual you read me like the devil reads the bible. What was merely an innocent disclaimer suggesting I/we have only reports to go by was read as something more. As for FBI, it is of course for the courts to decide if anyone is guilty... As said, I agreed with Tesla pursuing an email hacker.
Reality is hard to come by sometimes, hence good dialogue and multitude of sources is required to try. We can't solely rely on any one - and no source is perfectly reliable, ever. It is a hard game but worth the try. I try to weigh the facts and morals objectively and we all should. We all fail sometimes, myself included.
The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No good guys should get a pass to do bad things, ohmman got my point perfectly. I do NOT believe Tesla is doing a bad thing pursuing an email hacker, I just don't think our determination of that should hinge on the merits of their mission, but merely on the merits of their case.
Krugerrand
Meow
No need for a disclaimer, innocent or otherwise. What we read has merit. Period, end of story.
And most times it's not hard to come by. You make it hard to come by because you're unwilling to just stick to the facts. Everything has to be maybe, possibly, probably, perhaps.
So now you want to get black and white, and super specific. Normally you would have answered along the lines, good people do bad things all the time and we refer to that as making a mistake. Those good people deserve second chances depending on the level of the bad they did. Obviously some bad things are badder than other bad things and can't be forgiven, but often the bad thing can be made right, or a good deed (like community service) can be done to undo the bad, or the bad wasn't that big of a deal in the first place, or, or, or...
Agree.
Krugerrand: Our difference in this case is probably more one of personal style than of substance.
I hate making definite statements on events, because there are often more than one or even two sides to a story - and I like to express this uncertainty, not leave it implicit. Others have a different approach.
I hate making definite statements on events, because there are often more than one or even two sides to a story - and I like to express this uncertainty, not leave it implicit. Others have a different approach.
It's called lack of ontological arrogance and is usually a sign of critical thinking. Dealing with complex issues requires the sort of introspection that leads to discovering all the assumptions and relativities in observations; and exposing them builds a richer dialogue than "I agree or disagree".
I for one appreciate the distinction you make between painting "reality" vs "your perception" and how you expose it. It does not make opinions weaker, but stronger if the goal is to contribute to a shared constructive conversation (it is perceived as a handicap when the goal is to have some opinions win at others' loss)
Krugerrand
Meow
It must have darn near sent you over the edge to make that definite good guys/bad things statement. And you're also pretty definite about TMC and a number of its members. :wink: I get the whole personal style thing and have no problem with it, but when you purposely add noise to something that clearly doesn't need or warrant noise, well...it's why you get the flak you do.
Nigel Tufnel
Member
The reason why I called for closing the thread and continuing the discussion on the potential ramp up curve, is that this thread has become a discussion on Eds' credibility (I don't care if he had insider information or was just trolling because in both cases his projections might turn out to be right or wrong for any other reason). The thread title is suggesting that we're discussing/speculating about a potential delay in the Model X launch. Since this topic is settled now and Eds is no longer around, plus there's not even his starting post available, there's little sense to continue a discussion/speculation on the ramp up here.
But, of course, that's just my opinion and my suggestion. Go ahead with repeating your statements on Eds and his statements (which have been deleted, so that there's no starting post to this thread, thus only a few of us can continue this discussion anyway), but for me there's no sense to refer to him and his first post as if he was a prophet or revelator. And then people took sides (for or against him) and now we're holding out here until October, November, December until he's proven right or wrong, and AR or opposition can claim their victory. Fine. Continue in that manner if this is what you're looking for. But again, keep in mind that for any other reason he probably was not aware of (and we all aren't), it could turn out that Tesla puts out only 100 Model X in 2015... or a smashing 7,000 cars, despite Eds' eventual insider information (or wild speculation) telling him otherwise. So either way, this discussion makes no sense to me. My last post in this thread.
I don't know how many Mr. Eds there are, but this one is dead:
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
anticitizen13.7
Not posting at TMC after 9/17/2018
I plan on reviving the subject of Eds whenever relevant, because the supply chain issue is of concern to shareholders, and it's also good for occasional lulz.
I think I get flak mostly for unwanted thoughts.
As for the good guys/bad guys statement, it is true I'm pretty adamant that the goodness of the cause is no reason to justify bad actions. I have my moments of ontological arrogance, if you will.
Krugerrand
Meow
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
Mark Z
Active Member
No horsing around with GM, they announced their latest delay. No 2016 Chevrolet Volt for most of the nation.
2016 Chevy Volt Availability Delayed | GM Authority
2016 Chevy Volt Availability Delayed | GM Authority
