Discussion: Model 3 and Y price drop Jan 2023 / April 2023 / Oct 2023 and All other Pricing Speculation going forward

[ord3r]

Or u can wait a bit longer, who knows, they may discount even more next month....

Yeah... still a ton of inventory and my friends that ordered last night got VINs today... starting to think there may need to be some more demand levers pulled.

I'd probably wait until at least HW4 since that's starting to leak now and Tesla internal comms to fcc claim announcement mid-january.

I'm curious if you put on hold after just ordering if tesla will still cancel you after 7 days, they may want to hold on to the sale now, but either way $250 really is a drop in the bucket either way.

 

[BitJam]

Sweat shops aren't bad business moves either of you ignore the optics.

It should have been perfectly clear that I was including the optics of disgruntled 2022 buyers when I said this was not a bad business move by Tesla.

If you bought a Tesla recently then that sucks and I'm sorry for you but if you can put your personal feelings aside for a moment, what do you think would have been a better business move by Tesla?

• They've bet the company on selling a metric boatload of Model Ys in the next two years
• Tesla unexpectedly missed out on the tax credit for the model they bet the company on
• Demand had already softened

The way I see it they had a choice between pissing off many/most 2022 buyers and tanking the company. They chose to not tank the company. If you feel you got a raw deal, you have my condolences but drastically cutting prices does not have the bad optics that a sweat shop does. This price cut will be seen as a good thing by most people, (most Tesla owners and most non-owners). The only demographic that dislikes it are the 2022 buyers and their numbers will soon be dwarfed by future buyers.

 

[JaeTheDev]

Still the sexiest upside down valued item Ive ever owned. Looking at this pic softens the blow.

 

[DL_Mike]

So a gradual price decrease over say 6 months would have worked better to soften the blow?

Yes. Let's be real, they slashed prices specifically to come under the thresholds for the rebates. Had it been for any other primary reason, they would have dropped them in tiers and over time, just as they did when they increased them.

They knew they were going to do this, and sold now massively overpriced Teslas right up until the day of the slash. They can do whatever they want as a business, but they will eventually reap the consequences of their customers' sentiments and experiences. My confidence that a new Tesla is fairly priced and will be a good trade in in the future, is shot. Tesla did that.

 

[sunwarriors]

Silly comparison. We're taking about a very large purchase you make once ever 3-5 years, maybe more. And a price cut that is rather unprecedented in the auto industry for both its steepness and abruptness. Tesla gets the benefits of direct and online sales without having to provide any of the payment options (credit card that many have price drop protections on) or customer-friendly policies.

I'm sympathetic to you guys, but I've never felt the MY was worth the $67k here in the US, especially when folks were paying closer to $50k before Covid. That huge price increase, highest margins across all auto makers, add in what China buyers were paying and clearly, they were too expensive since they were making so much $$ from it.

This isn't like Costco where the company forces themselves to only have so much margin/profit (I think it's 10-15% for Costco) and make $$ from memberships to sorta protect their "brand" and customer loyalty even though wall street is demanding Costco raise prices (I think they refused).


People here didn't want to think Tesla can cut prices (a lot of people actually were arguing Tesla wouldn't cut prices), but they were clearly wrong and who knows what will happen, but don't believe all the bulls here.

Ultimately, it'll be interesting to see how this plays out in terms of brand loyalty, but with people buying cars rarely honestly (you say 3-5 years), Tesla is in it to look out for Tesla and the Tesla of now. The Tesla experience isn't like when they started. You're a number like most consumers in pretty much anything we buy.

You do have a vote though and can definitely see what else is out there. There should be a lot more IMO coming up.

 

[sunwarriors]

What are these 800k owners going to buy?

Tesla has built a competitive advantage (a "moat" as some busines people would say) based on pricing. Would these 800k owners buy an alternative car that was $10k or $15k more expensive? Remember these are the same owners peeved off at their lost of value because cars are now cheaper (i.e., these people care a lot about pricing...).


Gigafactory... giga mold.. custom robots.. vertical integration... etc... etc... these are all competitive advantages that will take years for the competition to overcome.

Other car manufacturers simply cannot make cheaper EVs right now with the same features... period...

Go to any other EV forum (Mercedes, BMW, Ford, Hyundai, Porsche, Rivian) and people do buy other cars for various reasons. It maybe more expensive, but people have been buying more expensive stuff for thousands of years.

We'll see how much the $$ changes people's decision in a few months.

They may not care that they paid $60k+ or more for an i4 because it says BMW on it.

 

[whydontwe]

Do you all think used car market for 3/Y will go out the roof, like we experienced last time? I am asking because with the reduced pricing, demand may jump to a point where lead times increase to months or even up to a year. Well, with Texa Giga, probably not.

 

[BitJam]

It's not easy to measure long term effects. After the initial buyers jump in and inventory drops, will Tesla raise prices back up? Will prices be back at these levels for the long term? Will inventory pile up again after this after everyone who blinks, purchased and they have to cut further if inventory piles up?

It's not possible to know at this point and it's all questions.

Tesla has some inventory level they like. They clearly did not like the 1400+ yesterday. If I was buying, my concern will be they have a ton of manufacturing capacity. This puts concern on supply.

The long term effects of pricing the 5-seat Model Y out of the EV market by missing the EV tax credit would have been catastrophic for Tesla. That's why I predicted they would reduce the price to $53K ($2K under the cap so people could add two $1K options).

 

[Kairide]

I would still say its a premium product
When you put the RAV4 next to MY, the Tesla is still years ahead.

What makes it premium? The quality of the build, interior quality, exterior quality, the customer service experience?
Yes, it’s a nice car, but it’s not a luxury/premium car.

I considered it a premium product in the same way an iPhone 14 pro is. Premium isn’t just price or volume. It comes down to how you treat the customer and making sure they are happy with using the product and their purchasing experience. Their actions might’ve been necessary to reduce inventory but they burned a lot of customer goodwill and trained new customers to be cautious so it’s probably no longer a premium product.

Tesla could have been more transparent with their pricing and give something to the customers they screwed over.

Let’s face it no one who bought in the last two month outside of diehard Elon acolytes are happy. All the people defending the move bought before q3. There’s a lot of pissed owners with high disposable income out there who probably wouldn’t buy from them again. Spending $10k unnecessarily for the same product a month later does not leave a good taste in anyone’s mouth and not easy to forget.

You just described why Tesla isn’t a premium product. They have high price tags and flashy technology. But premium is as you described, not just about price or volume. A premium vehicle is the entire package; quality of the build, interior quality and also how well you’re treated as a customer.

 

[Stirfry]

Still the sexiest upside down valued item Ive ever owned. Looking at this pic softens the blow.

Even with the fake brakes (at least on mine)?

Not gonna lie, Photo does help

 

[JaeTheDev]

Even with the fake brakes?

Not gonna lie, Photo does help

I mean, they stop so they aren’t technically fake…. Haha!

 

[sunwarriors]

Some people are a$$ hurt now but if they think logically when the time comes to buy their next car they'll do what they've always done, buy the best value for their money at the time. I seriously doubt many will say "Tesla has the best XXXX but because they dropped their prices last year I'll buy a Ford!" Or if they do they're silly IMO....

Hah, yeah, I agree with you. Some of the people who claim they will never buy a Tesla could be the loudest people saying everything else is inferior and, "What else are you going to get?". I personally didn't think that and there are many things negative about a Tesla others have posted and I think the competition is pretty decent (all IMO).

The supercharging network is the biggest advantage I feel, the rest is more subjective. We'll see what those folks do when it's time for a new EV.

 

[sunwarriors]

What makes it premium? The quality of the build, interior quality, exterior quality, the customer service experience?
Yes, it’s a nice car, but it’s not a luxury/premium car.


You just described why Tesla isn’t a premium product. They have high price tags and flashy technology. But premium is as you described, not just about price or volume. A premium vehicle is the entire package; quality of the build, interior quality and also how well you’re treated as a customer.

To me, premium is something no one else has/can get. Maybe premium isn't the best word honestly to use in this example. Cost usually is tied to it because there are less rich people than poor people. Rimac Nevera is premium because there are so few.

I can't drive on a street and not see 5 of 10 cars is a Tesla. It's hard for me to associate the term premium when everyone has one. I guess iPhones are supposed to be premium? They gave those away for free recently on cell plans.

That's all in CA of course, but seeing a Tesla is a yawn vs. a Ferrari or something that's actually rare. When every other mom is driving one in the burbs, it's hard to think much of Tesla as a upscale/premium brand.

It's build/fit/finish isn't premium I don't believe.

 

[804son]

To me, premium is something no one else has/can get. Maybe premium isn't the best word honestly to use in this example. Cost usually is tied to it because there are less rich people than poor people. Rimac Nevera is premium because there are so few.

I can't drive on a street and not see 5 of 10 cars is a Tesla. It's hard for me to associate the term premium when everyone has one. I guess iPhones are supposed to be premium? They gave those away for free recently on cell plans.

That's all in CA of course, but seeing a Tesla is a yawn vs. a Ferrari or something that's actually rare. When every other mom is driving one in the burbs, it's hard to think much of Tesla as a upscale/premium brand.

It's build/fit/finish isn't premium I don't believe.

Premium is usually a combination of Exclusivity, Price, High-end components, build quality. You're right Tesla isn't a really good match in any of those categories.

 

[dachshund]

^Nice photo above. The one in my garage is also very pretty.

I guess we could go out and protest like they're doing in China. I picked up my MY in December and was steamed that I missed the 10K free supercharger miles by 3 days. I wore out my anger over that one and I'm done, since on 12/12 there was no way of knowing it was coming. Now I know Tesla will pull this stuff, and I can't get angry anymore. How do you time this sort of thing? I'm glad I picked it up and won't be chewing on Tums to second guess my delivery.

Hopefully everyone knows Tesla won't compensate those who bought recently. I suppose people who have orders based on the old price should cancel immediately.

I wonder if this will force BMW, Audi, etc., to lower their prices. It's crazy.

 

[SpicyPaneer]

wow.. prices are over $10,000 less than what they were selling for at year end. MYP is now $56,990. It was at $72,000 just a couple weeks ago without the $7,500 incentive.
Anyone guess what's going on?

Would I qualify? I picked up the car in late August and the tax credit is for 2022 or 2023?

 

[DL_Mike]

It should have been perfectly clear that I was including the optics of disgruntled 2022 buyers when I said this was not a bad business move by Tesla.

If you bought a Tesla recently then that sucks and I'm sorry for you but if you can put your personal feelings aside for a moment, what do you think would have been a better business move by Tesla?

• They've bet the company on selling a metric boatload of Model Ys in the next two years
• Tesla unexpectedly missed out on the tax credit for the model they bet the company on
• Demand had already softened

The way I see it they had a choice between pissing off many/most 2022 buyers and tanking the company. They chose to not tank the company. If you feel you got a raw deal, you have my condolences but drastically cutting prices does not have the bad optics that a sweat shop does. This price cut will be seen as a good thing by most people, (most Tesla owners and most non-owners). The only demographic that dislikes it are the 2022 buyers and their numbers will soon be dwarfed by future buyers.

Yes, this is exactly what I'm saying. Tesla, without throwing any bones to recent 2022 buyers, is effectively broadcasting to us that they don't care about how we feel, or the financial loss we've taken when it comes to a product that is universally understood that the better it holds its value the better it is. And with how they've been doing things (a book price cuts, throwing no bones, removing USS, etc, etc) buying a Tesla is actually rather risky, and the same thing can happen to a future generation of Tesla buyers. I wouldn't want to be in that camp again having gone through it, and Tesla seems to be okay with that because I don't care about making anything right.

 

[dachshund]

Yes, this is exactly what I'm saying. Tesla, without throwing any bones to recent 2022 buyers, is effectively broadcasting to us that they don't care about how we feel, or the financial loss we've taken when it comes to a product that is universally understood got a better holds its value the better it is. And with how they've been doing things (a book price cuts, throwing no bones, removing USS, etc, etc) buying a Tesla is actually rather risky, and the same thing can happen to a future generation of Tesla buyers. I wouldn't want to be in that camp again having gone through it, and Tesla seems to be okay with that because I don't care about making anything right.

I think it's best to assume that companies do not care about how customers feel. Maybe the people who work at your local businesses. But a large corporation should care about making a profit, period. Protecting customers is what I expect my government to do.

 

[Happy Hippo]

Awww man.. I'm ready for some pain. Lets see what happens lol!

View attachment 895294

how much did you pay?

 

[zoomer0056]

for the rebates

Tesla did that.

Nope, Tesla is reacting to what Biden did in addition to other market forces.