Eastern Canada Superchargers

[iKhalid]

As you know, six of the eight existing Eastern Canadian sites had at least part of their construction done between December and March, but I don't think Tesla wants to deal with Winter work again. So, there's really not much of a window left for breaking ground.

That's why I think Tesla Motors would be advised to consider temporary stalls somewhere. Besides the risk of new 70 and 60 CPO owners running into trouble, the Kingston site could get clogged up by everyone wanting a full range charge when heading to Toronto.

This is happening for sure. I'm sorry in advance :-D

 

[Cottonwood]

That's a full-resolution crop of the original. Of course the whole map is larger than the small portion I posted.

If you go to the source JPEG's, then you can get higher resolution maps and crop the portion that you want. The source JPEG's are at the links below. If you ever want to find these links yourself, view the source HTML of the Tesla page.

• North America — Today
• North America — 2015
• North America — 2016

To go all out, you can use a program like PhotoShop, put a portion of one of these maps in a 50% opacity layer over a high res road map, and adjust scale to make features like shorelines and boundaries match. See an example that I did at I-84 — Pacific NW to SLC.

Have fun!

 

[KR1]

I just sent an e-mail to the supercharger team to suggest they provide better supercharger service between Ottawa and Sudbury than is shown on the 2016 superchager map. Here is the message:

Hello,

I would just like to point out that on your 2016 Supercharger map there are Superchargers shown in Ottawa, North Bay and Sudbury. The issue is that the Ottawa to North Bay leg is very long at about 358 km while the North Bay to Sudbury leg is only about 132 km.

I notice a supercharger shown in Huntsville which is about 243 km to Sudbury. If that is an acceptable range, then the North Bay supercharger could be moved to around Bissett Creek, which is about 245 km from both Sudbury and Ottawa and would allow safe travel from Ottawa to Sudbury.

If the supercharger is left in North Bay, then maybe one could be added in Pembroke, which would be about 147 km from Ottawa and 214 km from North Bay. Another good thing about Pembroke is that it is about 233 km from Huntsville and the route goes right by Algonquin Park, which is a big tourist attraction.

Regards,

Carey Garrett
Ottawa area P85+ owner

 

[vandacca]

I just sent an e-mail to the supercharger team to suggest they provide better supercharger service between Ottawa and Sudbury than is shown on the 2016 superchager map. Here is the message:

That's a good idea to write that letter and thanks for following up on it. However, it is my understanding that selecting supercharger locations doesn't work that way. If someone has a location in mind (assuming that they own or can make decisions for that location), they can put in a request for it to be considered by Tesla. This approach makes it easier for Tesla to collect a list of "friendly" locations to choose from, and not have to worry as much about fighting to build at a location.

Therefore, the choices made in Ottawa, North Bay and Sudbury are based on available locations and unless a property owner in Bissett Creek comes forward, that will never be considered. You might have better luck finding a suitable location(s) in Bissett Creek/Pembroke and asking the owner(s) to submit a request to Tesla for consideration.

 

[decibel]

I think that a bigger problem than the distance to Sudbury is the 317km distance between Sudbury and Sault Ste Marie, and would advocate moving the proposed Sudbury supercharger to Espanola (which would also connect well with folks that take the Tobermory ferry). That would provide better spacing with the proposed supercharger in North Bay (200km) and would have a really nice 225km spacing to a new supercharger in Parry Sound (which would also be an ideal supercharger location for a wide variety of folks travelling to/from the near north areas south of Sudbury). Sudbury needs a bunch of destination chargers to meet local needs, but is a suboptimal location for a supercharger meant to serve long distance travelers.

Along the Ottawa River, I do not think that there will be adequate travel volume in the next few years to warrant a supercharger between Ottawa and North Bay (360km), nor would a single location be flexible enough to address the needs of those travelling to/from locations in the Valley. At this point, I think it is more realistic and sensible to work towards the installation of 100amp HPWCs in Renfrew, Pembroke, Deep River, and Mattawa. These would allow enough charging in a short enough period of time to facilitate travel between Ottawa and the proposed superchargers in North Bay and Huntsville, while also providing the flexibility to address the disparate needs of folks travelling to locations in the Ottawa Valley and the Madawaska Highlands.

On a trip out west, I was really impressed with the usefulness of high amp level 2 chargers installed by B.C. municipalities such as Invermere and Fernie to facilitate my travel between superchargers in Montana and B.C. I think that is a model that needs to be replicated in areas between superchargers in Ontario's near north.

 

[Phillip L]

As you know, six of the eight existing Eastern Canadian sites had at least part of their construction done between December and March, but I don't think Tesla wants to deal with Winter work again. So, there's really not much of a window left for breaking ground.

It does seem strange that Tesla would work on SC's in the southern U.S. during their very hot summers and in Canada during the winters. It would make more sense to have the crews work in July and/or August in Canada and the Northern U.S. and all the rest of the year in the more southern parts of the U.S.

 

[KR1]

I agree with the concept of 100 amp chargers between Ottawa and North Bay as you suggest provided that they are accessible to the travelling public without having to stay overnight. This has been a problem with level 2 chargers between Ottawa and Toronto in the past as freely accessible Sun Country Highway chargers became reserved for guests only.

 

[Doug_G]

It does seem strange that Tesla would work on SC's in the southern U.S. during their very hot summers and in Canada during the winters. It would make more sense to have the crews work in July and/or August in Canada and the Northern U.S. and all the rest of the year in the more southern parts of the U.S.

Pretty sure they use Canadian contractors to do the work up here. Otherwise work permits etc. would be a major stumbling block. So there's no competition for resources that would cause them to do such a thing.

 

[Phillip L]

Pretty sure they use Canadian contractors to do the work up here. Otherwise work permits etc. would be a major stumbling block. So there's no competition for resources that would cause them to do such a thing.

Makes sense. That would mean that this whole year there has been no supercharger construction in Canada is not because the crews are busy elsewhere but that Tesla has just been doing nothing about building them in Canada? Or is it because the contractors with the required skill set are not available?

 

[PoweredByRain]

Makes sense. That would mean that this whole year there has been no supercharger construction in Canada is not because the crews are busy elsewhere but that Tesla has just been doing nothing about building them in Canada? Or is it because the contractors with the required skill set are not available?

Either doing nothing or getting nowhere in negotiating sites. Insufficient "human resources" on the Tesla side would be my guess.

Try explaining the gaps in the network - they don't make any sense. They installed a whole string of Superchargers along I-90 and left a gap where the last two should go. The second-last one (Sheridan, WY) was just turned on in the middle of July. The remaining one (Gillette, WY) is still missing. This and other examples suggest that they are not capable of making things work smoothly such that routes are done in a sensible manner.

 

[Doug_G]

Makes sense. That would mean that this whole year there has been no supercharger construction in Canada is not because the crews are busy elsewhere but that Tesla has just been doing nothing about building them in Canada? Or is it because the contractors with the required skill set are not available?

Tesla launched a bunch of Ontario Superchargers in March, so it's not fair to say there has been no construction this year. But it did come to a screeching halt after that. Aside from finishing some long-delayed Quebec chargers.

So obviously the contractors are available. They've already built stuff.

I'll also point out that they've pretty much fully built out the New York network, and many of those are in the wasteland of upstate NY, so they must largely exist to support Canada/USA travel. As such you could consider them adjunct to the Ontario/Quebec network.

My guesses:

(a) Site selection / permitting delays galore, or

(b) Tesla's Supercharger team built out the absolute minimum necessary network, declared victory, and left the country.

Given the total lack of news, I'm kinda leaning towards (b) at this point.

 

[RiverBrick]

Doug, the New York network is still lacking. Plattsburgh, a critical link on the Montreal to New York route, is not open and speculation is that it isn't coming until 2016, despite being on the projected 2014 map.

With the present infrastructure, when it's -20C to go from Montreal to Albany in an 85 you either have to drive 70-80 km/h or drive 90 km/h and stop for two hours to recharge at 7 kW. I am not sure what you do in a 60 or 70. I think even in the Summer you cannot travel from Montreal to New York in a 60 without compromises.

In all of Canada, I believe Comber is the only site where construction started this year, and that was in January. It's reasonable to believe that 2015 Canadian ground-breaking simply hasn't been budgeted. As disappointing as this is, I understand that that Tesla Motors has been earning much less per sale in Canada than in the States due to exchange rates, tariffs, and the lack of regulatory credits, so the lack of urgency isn't surprising.

I do think that Tesla Motors should update their maps to reflect reality. All 2015 projected Canadian sites should be erased and only appear on the 2016 map. Discussion of the current 2016 map a few posts up is very optimistic, because those sites aren't coming until 2017. Hopefully, sales of the X and powerwall will allow for accelerated infrastructure budgeting and I will be proven too pessimistic. A few months ago, you suggested there might be no further Canadian site openings in 2015, and I thought there would be 2-4 (out of around eight on the map.) I now agree with you that zero is likely, except perhaps in a warm area of BC where there are less Winter construction concerns.

It really is sad that where Superchargers are needed most due to cold weather, construction is delayed for partly the same reasons.

 

[Doug_G]

I'm sure it's just financial considerations. There is no logistical reason except budgets.

 

[Forty Creek]

I do think that Tesla Motors should update their maps to reflect reality. All 2015 projected Canadian sites should be erased and only appear on the 2016 map.

It really is sad that where Superchargers are needed most due to cold weather, construction is delayed for partly the same reasons.

I'm in agreement with this view. Leaving the Supercharger map up in it's present rendition is misleading to potential buyers and frustrating to current owners. Tesla is better than this.

 

[KenN]

I'm sure it's just financial considerations. There is no logistical reason except budgets.

Permits and approvals, also. Canada can be one of the toughest countries when it comes to electrical codes and requirements.

 

[Mayhemm]

As disappointing as this is, I understand that that Tesla Motors has been earning much less per sale in Canada than in the States due to exchange rates, tariffs, and the lack of regulatory credits, so the lack of urgency isn't surprising.

While I don't necessarily doubt that this is the case, it would be very disappointing nonetheless, since Tesla is supposed to be mission-driven (accelerating the advent of sustainable transport) not profit driven. They should be expanding into markets like Canada to get us on electric transport, not because they can clean up on sales. This is what (was supposed to) makes them different from every other company.

Speaking of sales, Tesla should have realized by now from their experience in other markets how critical Superchargers are to sales. Now, after three years of selling in Canada, the poor sales argument shouldn't really be an excuse for backing off on their infrastructure commitment.

 

[mknox]

Permits and approvals, also. Canada can be one of the toughest countries when it comes to electrical codes and requirements.

...except that there are a number of Canadian Supercharger installations already, so any Canada-specific equipment approvals should have already been taken care of. From a utility connection point of view, I can assure everyone it is trivial. The utility connection is no different than any other commercial connection of similar size, and utilities hook these things up every day.

I suspect @Doug_G is right in saying they've built out what they deem "necessary and acceptable" for Canada and perhaps are budget constrained.

 

[PoweredByRain]

While I don't necessarily doubt that this is the case, it would be very disappointing nonetheless, since Tesla is supposed to be mission-driven (accelerating the advent of sustainable transport) not profit driven. They should be expanding into markets like Canada to get us on electric transport, not because they can clean up on sales. This is what (was supposed to) makes them different from every other company.

So why isn't Tesla selling in Mexico? Eastern Europe? Russia? Anywhere at all in the southern hemisphere outside Australia? Most likely due to projected lack of sales, I would say.

I think we have to keep reminding ourselves that this is entirely being funded by a private company. I'd love to see them do everything now, but that's just not realistic. Cross-Canada travel by EV will remain, for at least a few years, possible but painful.

 

[sitter_k]

Tesla launched a bunch of Ontario Superchargers in March, so it's not fair to say there has been no construction this year. But it did come to a screeching halt after that. Aside from finishing some long-delayed Quebec chargers.

So obviously the contractors are available. They've already built stuff.

I'll also point out that they've pretty much fully built out the New York network, and many of those are in the wasteland of upstate NY, so they must largely exist to support Canada/USA travel. As such you could consider them adjunct to the Ontario/Quebec network.

My guesses:

(a) Site selection / permitting delays galore, or

(b) Tesla's Supercharger team built out the absolute minimum necessary network, declared victory, and left the country.

Given the total lack of news, I'm kinda leaning towards (b) at this point.

 

[wayner]

...except that there are a number of Canadian Supercharger installations already, so any Canada-specific equipment approvals should have already been taken care of. From a utility connection point of view, I can assure everyone it is trivial. The utility connection is no different than any other commercial connection of similar size, and utilities hook these things up every day.

I know these things happen every day, and you have direct experience with utilities, but they can move at glacial pace. My solar panels have been up on my roof for two months but aren't connected to the grid thanks to Toronto Hydro who take forever to do inspections and install a generation meter. You would think that they do these every day as well. Meanwhile we burn more NatGas aimlessly...