where's the problem about which you speak? There are so many Superchargers that it almost doesn't matter to a Tesla driver. On the highway, we just assume there will be a working one available when we see one on the map. That assumption holds true nearly always - even in remote locations.
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Electrify America general discussion
- Thread starter Mockingbird
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srs5694
Active Member
I don't know for a fact if this is the reason for the different kW ratings of different EA stalls, but I suspect it's because CCS cars vary so much in their charging capabilities. You've got everything from 50 kW max to 280 kW max (or more; I'm not sure what the top is, across all models). Putting in 100% 350 kW units would indeed simplify things, but it would cost more, and given the mix of vehicle capabilities, it'd largely be wasted money -- odds are, at any given moment, some cars at an EA station where more than a couple of vehicles are charging couldn't do more than the 150 kW max of their low-end DC fast chargers.
Although Teslas do vary in their capabilities, there's less variability between different Tesla models -- and the ones that sell the best (the Model 3 and those introduced or updated after it) are capable of 250 kW charging at V3 Superchargers. (At least, in their top trim lines. IIRC, the SR+ Model 3 can't do 250 kW, although I don't recall its precise limit.) Because a high percentage of vehicles using a new station can use the best Tesla Supercharger technology available, it makes more sense for Tesla to install uniform equipment at all their sites.
The United States, depending on the source I check, is 14,608 or 14,638 stalls. This is 6 times more than Electrify America.
There are 1,114 stalls under construction that we know about. There are 2,133 stalls permitted for construction that we know about. Keep in mind that both of these figures assume a default of 8 stalls per location unless otherwise specified by the permit documents or by visual verification, so these numbers are lower than reality.
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That would put the average at nearly 12 stalls per supercharger location which is probably about right.
So EA is behind Tesla in US locations by less than 2X, but is behind Tesla by about 6X on stalls.
The next comparison would be vehicles sold per charger.
I think the issue they're referring to is busy superchargers in areas with high concentration of Tesla's.
I don't know if anywhere in Europe compares to the sales density of California.
Where I live the latest feature to route less busy superchargers will likely keep people from waiting.
But, I'm not so sure as what I've noticed is high concentration at V3 superchargers located in popular places like the Vancouver Mall in WA or easy to get to places off the highway.
In rural places Superchargers and EA chargers face the same challenges. Things like intentional icing by rednecks, vandalism, copper thieves, forest fires, etc.
I think the writing is on the wall that Tesla will open up the Supercharger network to other vehicles.
There is just too much money to be made in reoccurring revenue, and tax incentives.
The white house has already said they're going to.
Tesla's location count is currently 1,433 compared to EA's 758 (according to their site - fastcharger.info has that number around 780). Construction site count for Tesla is 147 compared to EA's 76 coming soon (not sure what exactly that means).
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....so, what you are saying is that if you were charging your Tesla Model Y and a Cadillac Lyriq pulled up to charge next to you, you might get a sense of jealousy because you would rather have a Cadillac Lyriq.
The number of chargers (or stalls/whatever) isn't as important as the number of locations.
For example, the Electrify America charging station in Ogallala, NE has 4 chargers, but the Supercharger in Ogallala, NE has 8 chargers.
Sure, Electrify America could double the number of chargers in Ogallala to 8 chargers to match the Supercharger in Ogallala, but if the current charging station with 4 chargers is rarely ever full, what would be the point of adding 4 more chargers?
It would be a wasted expense.
I've seen 6 Teslas charging in Ogallala, including one pulling a trailer parked behind the row of chargers there. 8 seems like a good number if not a bit short today.
Besides, from the map at fastcharger.info that our good friend @RTPEV keeps, there are some extremely wide gaps in CCS availability along key cross country Interstate arteries making it very difficult to find a good route.
What's your point?
As someone who has used EA a bunch over the years (have had native CCS cars since end of Jan 2019), I disagree with first point, for now. For ages, the EA sites whenever I swing by would have NOBODY using them. Finally, maybe starting a year ago, I actually do see some cars there.
As for the latter, I don't know that it's a huge issue either. It doesn't matter for me since my cars won't even reach 150 kW. But, it can cause problems/confusion and conflict when someone w/a slow charging car uses a 350 kW charger for no reason and someone who has an 800 volt car shows up.
Many of the EA sites that I've used are all 150 kW max.
In my part of the Bay Area, there were only 2 72 kW Tesla SC sites until a 250 kW site opened up later. These are all within a few miles of each other.
The funny part is that before the 250 kW site opened up, the EA 150 kW chargers that opened before ended up being faster than the 2 Tesla SC sites.
You already made the mistake of using your credit card. Don't use the CC readers!
Search Electrify America Talks Charging Network Problems, Has Solutions for about those credit card readers. Search Interview: Electrify America expects you to raise hell if chargers don’t work for financial session.
If I got $1 for every time someone checked into Plugshare saying one or more CC readers didn't work (it's not an EA only problem), I could have a small fortune.
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Now, I see EA urban sites clogged with cars that came with free charging promotions, particularly ID.4s. At least the Hyundai/Kia cars only come with free 30 minute sessions, so they're not camping out charging to 100%.
ambudriver03
Member
I second @Earl 's point... Interstate 80 (across Wyoming) is a no-go for non-teslas even in summer.
Interstate 80 in my opinion is not passable in a tesla in winter. There are too few locations and way too many spots where one could literally be iced in... 🌨 ❄
I charged at the EA in Evanston WY (near the border with Utah) , and ironically as I was charging there there was another tesla with a CCS adapter...
A gentleman in his late 70s came up and said he had never seen ANY car ever use that station, also he didn't even know what a tesla was, he was shocked that I had came from California, and was heading east to Ohio.
Going across i-80 there isn't another EA charger, nor any other functioning DC fast charger along the interstate until you cross over into Nebraska (Ogallala) 523 miles later.
Rawlins and Cheyenne, are listed as coming soon.
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For '22 ID.4, they changed it to free 30 minute sessions with a 60 minute timeout between each free one.
Was Is VW making a huge mistake limiting FREE charging to 30... started long ago which I haven't read. Per Porsche Taycan Owners Get 3 Years Of Free Electrify America Charging and I think confirmation from someone I know w/a Taycan, they only get 30 minute at a time free sessions. After that, it's paid but at a discounted rate.
Some of the other cars I listed only come with a limited # of kWh of free juice.
Count them here if you like…
Haha, it was a one time mistake.
I won't be making that mistake anymore.
I wonder why they don't just remove them
Things are changing quickly the market is getting really heated.
The Hyundai is making some really decent EV's that support 350kw chargers.
Rivian is getting production going on their R1T/R1S. The batteries are so massive that each one should count as 2 vehicles.
Ford has the Mach-E, and the Lighting.
VW is making progress with their own Gigafactory battery factories
Tesla owners are starting to use EA chargers either as a fallback in case of a busy supercharger nearby or simply as a more convenient place to charge.
Tesla didn't make this mistake, and instead had overcapacity when they build their chargers. It was pretty common for me to be the only one charging at an 8+ stall site.
I won't be the least bit surprised if I don't end up using a Tesla Supercharger to charge my Rivian 2 years from now simply because 20+ chargers at a location is a lot more reassuring than 4. This is assuming Tesla opens up their network which I'm assuming they will.
Electrify America started installing charging stations back in 2018 and it's only now, 4 years later, that the charging stations are starting to fill up.
If Electrify America started with ever more chargers per charging station, it would take even longer for the station to fill up.
It doesn't make much sense to have vastly underutilized charging stations, years after years.
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