If BMW stop lights is released because one dude got it to work, then you must consider Tesla's release of L2 City Streets to 100x the user base a full production release success.
-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
Elon tweets "pure vision" will solve phantom braking
- Thread starter diplomat33
- Start date
GlmnAlyAirCar
Active Member
Point me somewhere. I've had a Tesla with AP2 since 2016, and have had many braking events on and off AP, and I'm pretty informed about how the vehicles work. None of the AP events beep at me. AEB events do. If this was not AEB, what is it? The Model 3 manual says this:
Even if this was an event that would only happen with AP engaged- it's sill a phantom braking event. It's a behavior the driver would not have done for a non obvious reason, and was raised to the level of audible alert which suggests a driver needs to take over. It's also non-repetitive for the same situation a second time, so it's likely responding to more than the vehicle turning green on the screen.
I explained multiple times why this does look like AEB to me- I'd appreciate you explaining what you see that indicates this is not AEB, and hopefully what it is, rather than just saying "read up." None of us can "read up" on how city streets beta works, given it isn't released to the public.
BMW has "ampelerkennung" and more features included in the "BMW Driving Assistant Professional" package, in Germany. How it works in real life I do not know. The 545e was the first to get it late 2020.
Mobileye just increased its market share by millions of cars. But but it gonna fail....
I think we all realize that this is the best and only thing the FUDsters have. Nonsense amplified by sheer volume (repeat, repeat).
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
This unfortunately is another second hand account by someone in a different market speculating about the features in other markets (same with the UK post you linked above), but not having first hand experience if it actually exists. I thought you had a first hand account from a German user using the feature without any coding.
Again this is complicated because BMW has a "coding" procedure that advanced owners are using, so it's possible to try out many features ahead of official release. The videos on youtube from users are done using such coding. BMW have also demoed the feature widely since 2019.
I guess it's kind of like the verygreen examples posted before, except in BMW's case people widely do the same (not just a handful of people).
Last edited:
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
I don't believe it is true older vehicles don't support TLA. From the post by the German guy, the "Gen 1" TLA is supported by older vehicles. The "Gen 2" TLA is supposedly for newer vehicles, but still was able to activate on a G21.
That does not appear to be a valid reason. Again I linked the Alexa example, it was released in only select locales, but it's still in the release notes.
Link to the manual? It would at least be some evidence, although some direct evidence of a owner using it without going through coding is better.
Soda Popinski
Member
Back to the original topic: Do we know if this new vision only / non-Radar software will apply to HW 2.x, or just HW3? I'd guess if they're using Pseudo Lidar to gauge distance, it'll have to be HW3 only.
Good question. If HW 2.x is not suitable for speed sign and traffic light detection, is it good/powerful enough to replace radar?
Given the only place we have even heard about this is the same tweet that postulated this week for it, it's impossible to know. I'm sure some people believe "US production" means all AP2 US production cars, and others believe it only means cars on the production line, and others believe it means cherry picked beta testers.
The nice thing about this is that since it will come out this week, we only have to wait about 110 hours to find out.
No all BMW series made from Q4 2018 has the same hardware and capability for TLA. That doesn’t mean they will get it. BMW said they will give it only to those made from July 2020 as a OTA (which hasnt shown up) and the cars from the factory has it from November 2020.
You are talking about traditional automakers who are all incapable of doing OTA. All of them. Out of all of them only bmw has done it and even then they struggle with it. They do OTA for -1 software version and they only have 3 software updates a year. Even then they are struggling with it as most people don’t get it. Secondly they don’t include any new feature so you end up having to enable it through a hack.
rxlawdude
Active Member
Cruise control from that BMW manual:
"The system does not relieve you of your per‐ sonal responsibility to assess the traffic situa‐ tion correctly. Due to system limitations, it can‐ not respond independently and appropriately in all traffic conditions. There is a risk of accident. Adapt your driving style to the traffic conditions. Observe the traffic situation and intervene ac‐ tively if the situation warrants it."
"There is a risk of accidents or material damage. Only use the system if it is possible to drive at a constant speed."
That last one goes into the WTF file.
I'm not sure what you are trying to assert here... have you seen the manual for autopilot (tacc and autosteer), smart summon, etc?
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
The obvious issue is there doesn't seem to be any demo of a consumer car that has it from factory. Where did BMW say that? Do you have a link?
Well I'm only making the point here that BMW still includes features in the release notes even if it's limited to a region.
That's from Euro NCAP. I tried to search Euro NCAP and can't find which specific year/region and sub-model it's for (can't find the page that link is from). The pages for 2019 and 2020 BMW 3-series doesn't have that link. Can you link the page it came from?
The only thing I found is the Australian/NZ manual (page 8 shows the region) for the 2021 3-series plugin has that section too, but from the discussion forums Australia isn't getting Traffic Light Detection, so it would seem the manual may not necessarily be an accurate indicator of availability.
https://ownersmanuals2.com/bmw-auto/3-series-sedan-plug-in-hybrid-2021-owners-manual-80505/page-266
Pure vision looks to becoming more and more real.
- Some vehicles have been running 4.15.x firmware with vision NN for a while.
- Tesla appears to have scrubbed their website of references to the front radar.
teslamotorsclub.com
- Some vehicles have been running 4.15.x firmware with vision NN for a while.
- Tesla appears to have scrubbed their website of references to the front radar.
No mention of Radar on Tesla Website
The site seems to have been updated to remove any mention of radar. It lists vision and sonar only. The old autopilot website hasn't been updated yet. I wonder if this means that new vehicles won't include the radar hardware.
teslamotorsclub.com
Interesting update. As part of the removal of radar from the Tesla website, they also changed the list of standard safety features. The removed Automatic Emergency Braking (AEB) and Forward Collision Warning (FCW). That does make removing phantom braking pretty easy, but probably not in the way we expected.
Before:
Automatic Emergency Braking
Side Collision Warning
Front Collision Warning
Auto High Beams
After:
Side Collision Warning
Obstacle Aware Acceleration
Blind Spot Monitoring
Lane Departure Avoidance
Emergency Lane Departure Avoidance
Before:
Automatic Emergency Braking
Side Collision Warning
Front Collision Warning
Auto High Beams
After:
Side Collision Warning
Obstacle Aware Acceleration
Blind Spot Monitoring
Lane Departure Avoidance
Emergency Lane Departure Avoidance
Well if they actually did, which I don't think they did, it would only be for a very short period as AEB becomes a mandatory feature on all new vehicles in 2022. (Unless it is delayed for some reason.)
mikes_fsd
Banned
For the record, the Autopilot landing page (that many of you on here want to dismiss, yet Tesla keeps updating) has been updated along with the rest of the site to remove mention of radar.
www.tesla.com
Autopilot
All new Tesla vehicles are equipped with the hardware needed for Autopilot and Full Self-Driving capability features, designed to improve functionality over time.
www.tesla.com
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
I don't see it as viable to truly remove also, given some jurisdictions may make it mandatory, plus my impression is it's a standard feature in many cars today.
I'm guessing it's a hedge while they work on the software (as they did for early AEB release back when Model 3 came out) and the cars will gain the feature back (assuming they really don't come with it out of factory).
Similar threads
