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JeffK
Well-Known Member
Exactly, but they don't think so at the moment, which is great for everyone... I'm assuming that should they have to replace the unit, that the cost was already built into the original price... otherwise some people are going to be quite angry if the upgrade wasn't free.
Drone Flyer
Active Member
People tend to not realize that even if Tesla gets its act together with regards to AP2, it will never be implemented because of bureaucratic red tape from law makers.
What I mean by " never" means at least 5 years from now.
Anyone who buys a Tesla with AP 2 in hopes of driving autonomously in the near future is in for one hell of a disappointment.
By the time legislators permit it in its entirety, we will all have new cars anyway such as the Model EZ, as in "Easy now, don't get mad at Tesla"! Lol!
It's not their fault.
If you really want the car to drive itself as opposed to driving these wonderful cars yourself and experiencing the proverbial grin while driving, why not just take a taxi?
Geez!
What I mean by " never" means at least 5 years from now.
Anyone who buys a Tesla with AP 2 in hopes of driving autonomously in the near future is in for one hell of a disappointment.
By the time legislators permit it in its entirety, we will all have new cars anyway such as the Model EZ, as in "Easy now, don't get mad at Tesla"! Lol!
It's not their fault.
If you really want the car to drive itself as opposed to driving these wonderful cars yourself and experiencing the proverbial grin while driving, why not just take a taxi?
Geez!
JeffK
Well-Known Member
This is why legislators are fast tracking autonomous driving and companies like Waymo, Apple, Tesla, etc are lobbying heavily. If it's proven to be safer than a human then it's in the public's interest for it to become available as soon as possible. Hopefully regulation will be done more at the federal level instead of the state level. You don't want different rules in different states regarding autonomous driving.
I don't think LIDAR will be explicitly required on any level 5 car. A better point may be to say that the advanced inexpensive sensors are being developed now, including various forms of lidar and exotic photosensors. I assume advanced radars are also being pursued.
Basically there is the EM spectrum that is read passively or actively pinged. I can't predict what will be used in the near future. I just doubt that the answer is the cameras and radar available at reasonable production prices in 2016. There is the right time for new tech. Maturing Li-on technology from consumer electronics made pursuing low cost car batteries a realistic possibility. Musk declaring AP2 hardware good enough seems to be three or so years too early. The design challenge with limited sensors must be enormous.
I'll gladly nap in a moving Tesla in 2019. But I don't put the odds of that happening at more than 1%.
Reciprocity
Active Member
Its helarious how people can take a part of what someone says and say it means something else.
1. Tesla CEO Elon Musk says ‘almost all new cars will be self-driving within 10 years’
As in all cars from all manufacturers would be autonomous by then, not Tesla. Tesla's solution will be out much sooner.
2. "Interestingly, he hinted today during the talk that Tesla could need to upgrade the computer in the new vehicles in order to enable fully self-driving."
He has also said as recently as yesterday, and we have already seen pictures, that the board is simple to upgrade and sits right behind the glove box. No problem at all.
3. True. They could also be dramatically behind, and counting on Twitter/TED/Blog hype to buy time. EM tells everyone he has the best and smartest working on AP2 and FSD, because, well....he tells us they are....
Shrug.. maybe.. he also said he was going to be build the worlds best luxury car regardless of power train and no one believed him. Seems to have done that ok..
4. Yes. Yes, I believe he would.
Sorry, I didnt think I had to qualify it by stating, do you think he would sacrifice his future potential success just to jerk us around? I realized he has made some interesting claims in the past, but he has delivered the big ticket items. Examples: 335 mile fully electric car that now has 30% of the large, luxury market in the US. A giant Gigafactory. AP2 in just 6 months from nothing... the list goes on and on and on..... yeah so you cannot yet summon your car to pick you up at the front door at work and have it go park.. that is still in development. Cut the guy some slack, he is saving the world you know.
For what it's worth, the governor of Virginia has stated 'we' will be (one of) the least regulated/restricted states when it comes to autonomous driving.
I don't know if that means anything goes, and when you cross the Potomac leaving Virginia, heads up and hands on, or what. But it's an interesting point of view for him to take!
So many amateur lawyers (plus a few real ones) on this and similar threads all over the forums. There's not a lot of point in us owners litigating with each other about the meaning of "expect" and ticking each other off. There's a real class action suit underway, and if it gets certified the discovery process will shed lots of light on what's been going on.
One thing we've learned in recent days is that though Musk ignores his customers he pays lots of attention to anything that could hurt his stock performance. That's perhaps why AEB appeared just hours after Consumer Reports lowered the car's rating because of its absence.
My hope is that In the face of the suit Musk will stop gazing at the stars for a while and put his hands back on the wheel of his cash cow company until it's back on the road. I don't want to hurt Tesla; I want them to meet their commitments.
Edit: I see on reading that a cow with a wheel is a seriously mixed metaphor. Just thought I would mention it before the grammar cops descend.
One thing we've learned in recent days is that though Musk ignores his customers he pays lots of attention to anything that could hurt his stock performance. That's perhaps why AEB appeared just hours after Consumer Reports lowered the car's rating because of its absence.
My hope is that In the face of the suit Musk will stop gazing at the stars for a while and put his hands back on the wheel of his cash cow company until it's back on the road. I don't want to hurt Tesla; I want them to meet their commitments.
Edit: I see on reading that a cow with a wheel is a seriously mixed metaphor. Just thought I would mention it before the grammar cops descend.
JeffK
Well-Known Member
No that's not why AEB appeared.
Timeline was:
Electrek reported April 25th and Tesla confirmed they were going to release AEB that week. Roll outs started the evening of the 25th
Tesla will release ‘Automatic Emergency Braking’ feature on cars with Autopilot 2.0 hardware this week
April 26th Consumer Reports downgrades Tesla for lack of AEB even though headlines said it was coming...
Consumer Reports downgrades Tesla for just one day over Automatic Emergency Braking
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I'm predicting that the Mennonites of Virginia will find AP1 acceptable, but FSD too flashy.
"Tesla said the company expects AEB to be included in a software update this Thursday, April 27.”
There's the E word again. If we've learned anything it's that when Tesla says they expect something we'll be accused of having poor reading comprehension if we infer that it's actually going to happen.
I'm happy to have AEB, even though it's in a crippled form that fails to protect against the most lethal crashes, those that occur at high speed. At least I think I have it. I can't figure out how to test it safely.
There's the E word again. If we've learned anything it's that when Tesla says they expect something we'll be accused of having poor reading comprehension if we infer that it's actually going to happen.
I'm happy to have AEB, even though it's in a crippled form that fails to protect against the most lethal crashes, those that occur at high speed. At least I think I have it. I can't figure out how to test it safely.
JeffK
Well-Known Member
They need to stagger the role out of new software... as stated, the updates started April 25th (fact)... the day before Consumer Reports and their nonsense.
And consumer reports was right to not trust Tesla. AEB on AP2 isn't the same as on AP1, and Tesla hasn't rolled it out fleet wide a week later. What Tesla has done so far doesn't count.
Tesla hasn't staggered any other AP2 releases like this except the first one where they released on Dec 31 to hit a marketing date to 1,000 cars then took 3 more weeks to hit the rest. All other AP2 releases have been fleet wide within about 3 days. AEB is different, which means to me that they know it isn't ready, and which is why their release notes were purposely missing critical information.
Tesla hasn't staggered any other AP2 releases like this except the first one where they released on Dec 31 to hit a marketing date to 1,000 cars then took 3 more weeks to hit the rest. All other AP2 releases have been fleet wide within about 3 days. AEB is different, which means to me that they know it isn't ready, and which is why their release notes were purposely missing critical information.
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
Citation required. I remember reading people not getting updates for weeks, while others have gotten them much earlier. And the cheat by going near an SC doesn't work anymore.
JeffK
Well-Known Member
No, they stagger ALL releases into progressively larger groups testing and analyzing the results at each stage. If the update hits a group of people and the results aren't looking good then they can halt the update and fix issues before it goes to the entire fleet.
The main issue with AEB is false positives. You absolutely don't want the car braking for no reason and causing an accident.
My X still brakes for overpasses and highway signage. Luckily no accident yet.
And maybe it's banana-pants thinking from me (wouldn't be the first time!), but the release number 17.11.45 certainly suggests that the low-speed AEB build is a rejected week 11 build that got pushed out weeks later coincidentally -
- around the CR report.Anyways, still seems weird that no one will ask Musk how they are testing FSD. The silence in comparison to other manufacturers and in contrast to Musk's usual bombast is disconcerting.
JeffK
Well-Known Member
I also wish they were more transparent in their FSD testing... I'm just impatient and I want to witness both progress and failures.My X still brakes for overpasses and highway signage. Luckily no accident yet.
And maybe it's banana-pants thinking from me (wouldn't be the first time!), but the release number 17.11.45 certainly suggests that the low-speed AEB build is a rejected week 11 build that got pushed out weeks later coincidentally -
Anyways, still seems weird that no one will ask Musk how they are testing FSD. The silence in comparison to other manufacturers and in contrast to Musk's usual bombast is disconcerting.
boonedocks
MS LR Blk/Blk 19”
I still find it "funny", not LOL kind of funny though, that even considering it was Electrek and NOT Consumer Reports to make it public that out of the 94 updates on the firmware tracker Consumer Reports just HAPPENED to be one of them. What about the other k's of cars? Like mine LOL LOL
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