FSD v12.x (end to end AI)

[swedge]

Quick report: FSD 12.3.4 (2024.3.15) installed. Vanilla car: 1021 MY, white, USS, Radar. On a quick drive it seems just like 4.3.3.

It still stops too far back from stop sign and light limit line. It still failed on a short merge onto the freeway and took the exit instead. (This is before it switched to V11 freeway code, so this is a V12 problem.)

I didn't try the auto-speeding setting, sorry.

 

[joelkfla]

I just let google maps navigate using iPhone, and the stop signs in question were not displayed. At the same time, Tesla's nav map showed the stop signs on the same route.

My understand, from posts here on TMC is that Tesla combines data from at least two map sources for their navigation. Rout planning, if I remember, is done by yet a third source.

I use Android. Stop signs were only displayed after Start was tapped. It looked like it may have been displaying only ones coming up shortly. But the point is, Google does have stop signs & signals in their map data.

 

[joelkfla]

My phone also shows FSD subscription @ $99.00/mo on the Android app, but purchase price is still $12,000.

I'm in, if it's still at that price when my referral + trial expires in June.

ETA: It's official. MarketWatch says:

The company announced the move on X, formerly known as Twitter, and Chief Executive Elon Musk amplified it from his own account. Tesla shares TSLA, -2.03% were up nearly 1% in after-hours trading Friday.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/teslas-latest-self-driving-push-a-price-cut-on-its-fsd-software-b562d841

 

[Ben W]

The next biggest safety issue FSD really needs to tackle is potholes. When you are supervising the car, it can be difficult to notice them soon enough and avoid them without making a sudden evasive maneuver. Quite frankly it's also inconvenient and unsatisfying to constantly disengage then re-engage to swerve around them. Hugging the edge of the road unnecessarily and falling into drainage ditches is also a huge problem. I'm not sure it's worth taking damage to the car to use FSD at this point. They recently solved speed bumps so I'm hopeful they can sort out potholes and other road hazards soon. I think it should basically just treat them as generic obstacles which it needs to avoid.

On the freeway a couple days ago, my Model Y with FSD ran straight over a (thankfully empty!) 5-gallon plastic bucket. I had momentarily glanced away from the road (terrible timing) so I missed it, but my passenger said that any human driver who saw it coming would have swerved around it. This is the FSD 11 stack of course, and hopefully once the end-to-end stack is enabled for highways it will better be able to handle things like this. Also, I completely agree about potholes; there's a spot on my daily commute where I always have to disable FSD and manually dodge potholes to avoid tire damage.

 

[asterothe]

$99 / month -> takes even more than 10 years to subsidize $12000. It does not make sense. They will need to reduce the price too.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

but purchase price is still $12,000.

As has been mentioned, this is because this is imminently going to be worth $100k or more. So cannot reduce the fixed price; our cars are nearly Robotaxis which will be very valuable.

Remember, once FSD is solved, Tesla will stop selling cars (they will just keep them all for themselves). This is the way. Car values will go through the roof.

This is the beauty of the subscription model: you get super good value and it can account properly for the AI Apocalypse when the time comes.

I need to increase the endorsement on my insurance policy to $15k I think. Appreciating asset.

 

[cyborgLIS]

Yes. It just makes sense it will get cheaper over time.

I think one of the reasons they have kept the cost of FSD so high and made transfers difficult is simply to restrict the number of cars on the road using FSD. The more cars using FSD, the more accidents and the more bad publicity. As Tesla gains confidence in the safety of the software, I imagine they will continue to make it a reasonable purchase for an increasing number of people.

 

[swedge]

I use Android. Stop signs were only displayed after Start was tapped. It looked like it may have been displaying only ones coming up shortly. But the point is, Google does have stop signs & signals in their map data.

Ah! I did "Start", but a stop sign did not appear till I was already there, and I was checking for cross traffic rather than staring at google's map.

But.... A bit farther down the road, Tesla was showing a sign which Google was did not show. Google was right in this case, as the stop sign is no longer there. But Tesla still maps it. Strange.

Over the last few months, I've reported the phantom stop signs to Tesla, google, TomTom and TMC. That last one we all know is useless, but so it seems are the other reports. ;-) The good news is that V12 does not stop for the phantom signs, so fixing whatever map they are on is not vital. It does give a clue about how slow Tesla's maps are to adapt to changes here in the real world...

Anyway, thanks for setting me straight on Google's stop sign mapping.

 

[JohnB007]

I'd be happy now if tesla converts the current FSD license to follow me forever instead of the car.

 

[Nakk]

The correct wording is FSD Unleashed or FSD for Dummies

Nope! L3 will be FSD Performance, L4 will be FSD Ludicrous, L5 will be, well, you know!

 

[TK211X]

Are you an EAP user? If no and the monthly came down from $199 to $99 that is great news for you. I am an EAP user and had $99 per month for FSD so I would expect my cost to go down to $45 etc but it is still showing $99

No, I never bought EAP, I’m perpetually broke.

 

[JohnB007]

Has anyone figured out what's different about this latest version? So far, it's not obvious looking at the videos and reading messages here...

 

[willow_hiller]

Has anyone figured out what's different about this latest version? So far, it's not obvious looking at the videos and reading messages here...

I think the primary difference between 12.3.3 and 12.3.4 is the configurations of vehicles that can receive 12.3.4. It might just be a minor update to include Highland M3 and legacy S/X.

 

[aronth5]

Too bad TeslaScope has to scale back on sharing information it looks like they had a run in with Tesla's legal department.
They have been a useful source of information.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1778622348171825412

 

[phxazcraig]

Over the last few months, I've reported the phantom stop signs to Tesla, google, TomTom and TMC.

Off topic - how do you go about reporting issues to Google? I'm wondering if there is a way I can report the back gate to my neighborhood as an out-only gate. There is no keypad, and it's the shortest way into the neighborhood. For years Google has directed cars in this way, only to be stuck at a gate they can't open. (You can open it if you have a wireless keyfob, or it's programmed into your car).

 

[SidetrackedSue]

Google maps are not crowd sourced

Apologies, I was actually responding to this and quoted you by accident.

lzolman said:
OK, so what's the full story about "crowd sourced map data" ? As this has the potential of being such an 800 lb. gorilla in the room, why have I heard essentially nothing about it except an occasional mention here on this board?

P.S. Summer is coming.

As for "sweet summer child", it is an idiom I'm familiar with, dating back to Victorian writing. Ironically for the discussion, the wiktionary dates it from the 1990's. Which just goes to prove my argument that using crowd sourcing map data could be problematic, but in this case, it is ignorance failing to inform, not intentional misinformation, which is my concern with crowd sourced mapping (unless it was corroborated by video from the car as part of the reporting process.)

Citations:sweet summer child - Wiktionary, the free dictionary

en.wiktionary.org

 

[TK211X]

2024.3.15 RN

 

[syncword]

Nice to see the price reduction today for a sub - a step in the right direction.

On a ~175 mi trip today in varied environments, I had at least 15 disengagements, all but two my own, and reported every one I reasonably could, almost entirely stuff already mentioned in this thread.

There also happened to be many 65 mph signs/zones - at least 6-7 before I stopped counting. It picked up exactly one and thanks to this thread, I wasn't too surprised it missed all the rest. The clincher on speed limit control was coming back into town in a zone where it's important to decelerate from 45 to 35, then finally 30 over about a mile. Ascending a sweeper hill in the 35 mph part of that, it decided to flip to 55. Last week Tesla cleaned my front camera inside glass (warranty/no charge), and afterwards I ran a recalibration cycle. Afterwards FSD seems neither better nor worse. At least it hasn't tried to curb my wheels.

Any ADAS worth paying extra for has to *effectively offload* this driver by doing whatever it does, *reliably* in all the situations you can reasonably put it in. The FSD 12 trial was mighty cool for the first week. Continuing to use 12.3.3, now start of third week, serious warts are starting to show. Autopark is so far the most useful thing to my wife and I, as it has been working well and actually offloads that particular driving task, hands off. Today she only half jokingly asked... how about they offer Autopark by itself?

 

[Ramphex]

I think the primary difference between 12.3.3 and 12.3.4 is the configurations of vehicles that can receive 12.3.4. It might just be a minor update to include Highland M3 and legacy S/X.

I got it on my non-FSD 2021 Model Y but not FSD 2021 Model S

 

[Todd Burch]

Has anyone figured out what's different about this latest version? So far, it's not obvious looking at the videos and reading messages here...

I mentioned this a few days ago.

12.3.3 -> 12.3.4 is not a major release. It's not even a minor release. It's a maintenance release. So don't expect much in the way of anything as far as improvements. 99% of what people think is an improvement is really just confirmation bias.