Get Amped Tour: Seattle, 7/6 - 7/8

[W8MM]

My first thought on reading the original post was "Troll". Found it nice that nobody fed it.

Or, maybe that poster drives a Buick, wears a hat while driving, and is so set in their ways that an electric car won't ever work for them.

I enthusiastically adapted to the Roadster's regen braking in about 45 seconds in my first drive. I'm somewhat disappointed that the Model S is reported to have less enthusiastic regen deceleration.

 

[kevincwelch]

That first time poster must have been a troll....

While I admit that a first time post with content that is strikingly opposed to what most of us experienced (and assume we would experience in my case) suggests a troll, I don't find anything overly "trollish" in that post. Maybe the regen was a foreign and unmanageable situtation for him. Maybe he had hyped up the experience so much that he had no other recourse other than to be let down. Maybe he had hemorrhoids and the construction caused a bumpy ride. As much as we'd like to think not, I imagine that there are going to be many people who are let down by the Model S and who choose some alternate EV, hybrid or ICE.

Just a thought.

 

[AnOutsider]

To the ability to keep a steady speed: my current car (2010 Jetta TDI) takes a very soft touch on the accelerator to keep a 50-60mph cruising speed. I drove it to/from the test drive event (Fremont was my local event) and noted the differences. It will be very interesting when I switch back and forth between the TDI and the MSp on a weekly basis since they drive somewhat differently.

There is also cruise control. If you're on a stretch of highway and cruising at a constant speed, why wear your foot out trying to keep the pressure just right when there's cruise control? +1 effectiveness once it's adaptive.

 

[CyberDutchie]

While I admit that a first time post with content that is strikingly opposed to what most of us experienced (and assume we would experience in my case) suggests a troll, I don't find anything overly "trollish" in that post.

But I find it a bit suspicious for someone who has obsessed over this car for 3+ years, reservation number less than P1000, and is long TSLA, to have never posted on TMC before.

 

[kevincwelch]

But I find it a bit suspicious for someone who has obsessed over this car for 3+ years, reservation number less than P1000, and is long TSLA, to have never posted on TMC before.

I didn't know about the forum until I decided to make a reservation, and I've been on the mailing list for >2y...but, I wouldn't consider myself obsessed

 

[gg_got_a_tesla]

But I find it a bit suspicious for someone who has obsessed over this car for 3+ years, reservation number less than P1000, and is long TSLA, to have never posted on TMC before.

Yup. Almost as if he was trying very hard to convince us that he's not a troll. If it's too good to be true, then it's not (or some such saying)!

 

[dsm363]

I don't know why regen shouldn't always be on when your foot is off the accelerator? As long as you're moving fast enough to assist in stopping. Why would you want to disengage regen with your foot on the brake? After all, when you put your foot on the brake your intention is to stop.

P.S. If I have to make a panic stop, I want every advantage the car can give me. I.e., brakes on all four wheels and regen, if the car is still moving enough to produce any.

I guess I don't understand what you are looking for. In a gas car when you let up on the gas you coast until you slam on the breaks. In the Tesla, regen kicks on as soon as you lift your foot off the accelerator and transition to break. In a emergency stop you are applying maximum breaking force so not sure regen would help you much.

 

[brianman]

I remembered something else Lance told me. Let me see if I can get the details right. Was something like...

In a month or so, the Bellevue store (and others) will be getting "permanent" test drive vehicles where we'd get "much more than the Amped style 8 min drives". He mentioned this in response to a question my passengers had prior to the Amped trip ("can we switch drivers after a couple streets?"). I asked him how they would do scheduling of drives initially. While he didn't have specifics, he said it would initially be for reservation-holders only. After the reservation-holder need / demand died down, he said it would be open to the general public (people lining up?) but that when/if reservation-holders visited they would cut in front of the line. After sharing that information I asked about the switching drivers mid-ride, and he said "no problem" to that.

Exciting times.

 

[ian201]

It certainly was not my intention to troll, but rereading my post's tone I can understand why one might say that. Apologies for that, I shouldn't post/email when grumpy.

For context, I am looking for a luxury EV, an iPad on wheels (good choices made for me). I have held onto my failing 1995 Ford, forgoing a gas car purchase to support this great company and the EV industry. I have never driven a manual, I like automatic creep and soft deceleration (my wife easily gets motion sick). Perhaps the Model S will train me to love 'driving', but my starting frame of reference is a simple and deterministic luxury drive (I suspect I would like Cadillacs/Lilcolns, though have never driven one). The 40kWh is a stretch for me, so I take my positive and negative impressions very seriously. While I may be in the minority, I do not think my profile is unique as a prospective Tesla Model S owner.

My observations about the vehicle:
* It is very quiet inside - I couldn't put my finger on it for a while - something I look forward to getting used to
* I enjoyed the road noise with the window down - am inclined to get the pano roof for that open air feeling
* The turning indicator is in the 7:30 position - not typically where I like, but I think I will get used to it
* The steering wheel has 2/10 o'clock inner bumps - did not care for that, and exaggerated the distance to the turn indicator, but expect I will get used to this
* The finish of the interior/dash/steering column was very nice - the Leaf while techy does not come close to the same polish
* Push the indicator/wiper stick to get windshield water - good solid feel to the mechanism
* The wiper motion was fast with a confident arc across the windshield - a single swish proved very effective
* The door handles were more solid than I was expecting - did not get to play with the push to expose feature
* There was more visibility in the rear view mirror than I was expecting from the sport back
* Side mirrors seemed of a good size - I felt confident I had visibility when changing lanes
* Good visibility out the front - hood drops away quickly, only the edges of the hood styling visible
* The 17" display size just seemed right - while I know it is massive by car standards, it felt very natural in the vehicle
* The recess under the display nicely fit my iPhone and wallet side by side - subtle rubberized texture stopped them bumping around
* The center console slides backwards to reveal two cup holders - I pulled on the arm expecting it to raise (not sure if it does)
* I did not perceive any body roll - the car is incredibly stable - I suspect it will ruin other cars for me
* I never noticed the seat - it was very comfortable throughout the ride
* Turning radius was reasonable - no Honda Civic, but acceptable for a large sedan
* I did not accelerate hard during the drive, but would look down and see the car effortlessly at 40

The regen just really threw me. I love the regen experience in my wife's Toyota Highlander Hybrid. I take my foot off the Go pedal and it cruises with subtle regen down a hill. If I push the brake pedal with small to moderate pressure I get regen. If I hard press I get disc braking.

The car as configured seems to match what most on TMC want. It was not a match for me in the time I had and the course selected, and considering my expectations of car-per-dollar. On a different day I may have had a very different experience. My comments are not directed at the car - I didn't have a drive experience compatibile with my review process to really form a complete picture. I'm inclined to think the car will work for me, and ultimately delight me, but I have not gotten to that decision point in my purchase process based on my experience so far.

 

[ian201]

Get Amped All Access

 

[ian201]

Tap tap, this thing on? My latest message is not posting. Writing this to check if I have thread write permissions.

 

[jasonhi]

Worst. Route. Ever. Construction everywhere, 2 sections closed down to one lane with a flagger, pedestrian crosswalks everywhere, 40mph max.

If any Tesla employees, Seattle employees, anyone connected with this event, or George Blankenship are reading this:

PLEASE, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, CHANGE THE SEATTLE ROUTE!!

It's the weekend - I5 has very little traffic.

I thought Tesla did a pretty good job of route selection given what they had to work with in Seattle:

1. Mercer street exit on I-5 was closed this weekend (at least Saturday afternoon, pretty sure all weekend). Traffic on I-5 was a mess (stop and go) when I went down to Tesla for my test drive yesterday.
2. Traffic on the next nearest I-5 exit (Denny Way) was being directed by police and Denny was bumper to bumper cars for as far as I could see. Given those circumstances, I-5 wasn't really an option for the test drive route.
3. Running test drives out of Bellevue would have been a challenge as well. You would have to load/unload in the parking garage, tangling with the Valet area. Traffic on NE 8th in Bellevue can also be a real problem which would limit the distance that could be driven.

To get a better route Tesla would have had to have based out of a location other than the two Seattle locations (store and service).

Given those kinds of constraints, having a route that got right out onto a road where you can open up quite a bit (Aurora ave) worked pretty well. I had no problem getting on it as many times as I wanted both on Aurora and the other roads -- but I work in the area, so I know the streets well.


Overall I was really impressed with the car. I drove the performance model. While it's not quite as fast as my Roadster, it's easily faster than any sedan I've driven before, plus it's got all that electric torque. As a Roadster owner/driver, there was absolutely nothing surprising (in a negative way) about the car. Had I not been able to replace my first Roadster after it was totaled, I would be plenty happy to drive a Model S performance model instead.

Realistically the Roadster is a very raw car to drive. It's all sports car, and exposes a lot of "techy" details -- things that hard core enthusiast drivers tend to enjoy. The Model S is a great next step. It's polished, refined, still stunningly fast. I really can't imagine any other sedan that I would even be interested in driving over the Model S.

My wife got to drive the black performance model after I drove the gray one. She loved the loved comfort steering setting (the Roadster's manual steering is not to her liking). She also loves the space between the front two seats that people want a console in -- she loves it as a place to put her purse, and considers it a major selling point to women! I found the middle back seat to be a very comfortable place to ride due to the flat floor.


Obviously I'm a huge Tesla fan, but I didn't feel like I was overlooking faults at the event. The "worst" part of the event was sitting around waiting for my turn to get out and drive the car.... hardly Tesla's fault that I was a bit impatient and excited to get my hands on it.

--Jason

 

[bonnie]

Tap tap, this thing on? My latest message is not posting. Writing this to check if I have thread write permissions.

Posts from new forum members are moderated ... helps to keep the spam down. I approved all your posts, but deleted the two that were duplicates of the first.

 

[AndyM]

Overall I was really impressed with the car. I drove the performance model. While it's not quite as fast as my Roadster, it's easily faster than any sedan I've driven before, plus it's got all that electric torque. As a Roadster owner/driver, there was absolutely nothing surprising (in a negative way) about the car. Had I not been able to replace my first Roadster after it was totaled, I would be plenty happy to drive a Model S performance model instead.

Realistically the Roadster is a very raw car to drive. It's all sports car, and exposes a lot of "techy" details -- things that hard core enthusiast drivers tend to enjoy. The Model S is a great next step. It's polished, refined, still stunningly fast. I really can't imagine any other sedan that I would even be interested in driving over the Model S.

Thanks for the great review, especially the comparison of Roadster driving experience to Model S.

 

[ian201]

I had less than glowing things to say about my test drive, and did so in a grumpy fashion (my bad). It was suggested I didn't attend the event, hence the pass picture.

 

[Discoducky]

I have been interested in the difference in speed and "umph" one gets between the performance and standard production 300 mile range. Would you say it was a lot of fun to drive and the car felt powerful? Would you equate it to a Mustang GT or greater, if you've ever rode in one that is? I currently drive a V6 Mustang, not GT, though I feel for the price I am paying I am hoping for something with a strong kick without having to drop the extra money for the performance model. I will be replacing my Mustang with the Model S. While speed isn't as important to me as other items, the "Rollercoaster" feel is very enticing.

Right after my drive I hoped into the Dolphin Grey Performance back seat to be sure that I wasn't "missing" anything. And I'm confident that the extra oomph is really only felt from standing still starts. 40 to 60 feels the same. And by "same" I mean it's the most fun I've ever had driving city streets semi-legally.

 

[brianman]

Had I not been able to replace my first Roadster after it was totaled, I would be plenty happy to drive a Model S performance model instead.

I really can't imagine any other sedan that I would even be interested in driving over the Model S.

Both points are very high praise!

 

[ian201]

A comment about how EV handling behaves. On the one hand I agree with the point that EVs can choose to have a clean break from previous legacy decisions (and should), it's not to say that they shouldn't accomodate 'feels like' experiences if there is a large enough demographic. Case in point, my test drive of the Leaf after my Model S test drive, in the default drive mode the car was very familiar and still performed regen (not unlike my hybrid experience) when I pressed the brake pedal moderately.

My concern with the Model S test drive, is that if I do not like the more eco/aggressive regen after extended ownership, I did not experience enough of the low regen mode to know if that will work for me as a backup. I'd also then like to understand better how this impacts range, which is of higher concern if the brake pedal truly never contributes to regen.

 

[Bardlebee]

A comment about how EV handling behaves. On the one hand I agree with the point that EVs can choose to have a clean break from previous legacy decisions (and should), it's not to say that they shouldn't accomodate 'feels like' experiences if there is a large enough demographic. Case in point, my test drive of the Leaf after my Model S test drive, in the default drive mode the car was very familiar and still performed regen (not unlike my hybrid experience) when I pressed the brake pedal moderately.

My concern with the Model S test drive, is that if I do not like the more eco/aggressive regen after extended ownership, I did not experience enough of the low regen mode to know if that will work for me as a backup. I'd also then like to understand better how this impacts range, which is of higher concern if the brake pedal truly never contributes to regen.

I read your previous comments about the 40kWh being a stretch for you so you are taking this decision seriously. Not that I don't think those on this forum who can afford the car easily aren't taking it seriously, but you are right in stating that its easier to be unhappy with something you are saving for for so long. I am in this same boat, and I know there are several others on this forum. I am sorry to hear you had a bad ride, I won't be getting a ride until after all these Get Amped Tours are done.

I could perhaps make a suggestion, though unappealing as it sounds you could postpone your purchase. This will enable you to do another test drive of the vehicle with a longer test ride time. Someone had mentioned on this forum that they will be opening up test drives to reservation owners after the Get Amped tour, but it wasn't said when. You could post pone, save up even more assuming you haven't done all your saving already, and take a test drive a few months from now. A few months may be nothing to me though, since I won't be getting mine till this time next year probably.

 

[dsm363]

A comment about how EV handling behaves. On the one hand I agree with the point that EVs can choose to have a clean break from previous legacy decisions (and should), it's not to say that they shouldn't accomodate 'feels like' experiences if there is a large enough demographic. Case in point, my test drive of the Leaf after my Model S test drive, in the default drive mode the car was very familiar and still performed regen (not unlike my hybrid experience) when I pressed the brake pedal moderately.

My concern with the Model S test drive, is that if I do not like the more eco/aggressive regen after extended ownership, I did not experience enough of the low regen mode to know if that will work for me as a backup. I'd also then like to understand better how this impacts range, which is of higher concern if the brake pedal truly never contributes to regen.

It really is just a matter of getting used to it. I think most people love the way Tesla implemented regen on the accelerator than the brake. You can accomplish exactly what you are looking for with the Tesla. You want to slow down you slowly lift your foot off the accelerator and regen start to kick in. You want to slow down faster you completely lift off the accelerator giving you max regen and the best help to your range. You need to stop faster you push on the break soft or harder for emergency braking. Tesla really did make the right call in putting the regen where it its. It will is effortless one pedal driving and with practice, you almost never use your breaks. Why would you want to tap on your break to allow regen to kick in to help your range when you can coast with regen? It's a personal preference I guess but I've never owned one of the hybrids that does this.