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GM Chevy Volt
- Thread starter vfx
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swaltner
Active Member
So, did the prices actually get reduced on the Volt? I just tried pricing a Volt on chevrolet.com and it came up with the old pricing (base price of $40k). They don't mention factory rebates on the factory web site. I also checked the inventory of the closest Chevy dealer and they still have the Volt listed for $41k to $43k. I'm not interested in a lease, if that's all they are discounting the prices on....
Zzzz...
Member
swaltner
Active Member
OK. Sounds like you would need to actually go to the dealer and have the sales droid "talk to the manager" to see what kind of special pricing they can give you. Ugh!
I saw some great lease deals on the 2012's, for as low as $199/month. Since the Volt saves me about $200/month in fuel I could of leased one for "free." However I already have a 2011. I think the $10k off list in the video is bogus, and really refers to the $7500 federal and $2500 California tax credits.
Even at $299/month for a 2013 lease, the Volt is a great deal IMHO.
GSP
PeterW
Member
In New Zealand the Volt (under the Holden banner) is NZ$85,000 to buy and, get this NZ$2,100 a month to lease
Chevy Volt Discussions
Don't take this the wrong way, because I'm all pro-Tesla and can't wait to get my Model S! --> but isn't this similar to what happens with the Chevy Volt during winter? Isn't there a significant drop in range when its cold out? I know they started turning on the engine below 28 degrees to help warm the car up but as far as a range drop I would think this is kind of expected in both the Volt and the Model S. So basically what I'm saying is that this range drop, if it is a true range drop, is expected behavior in this cold weather. That's not going to deter me from buying the Model S in any way though as to me that's normal.
I even test drove a Volt last winter and when I turned on the car it said 15 miles range left, and when I pulled out of the parking lot for my test drive (e.g. about 100 feet) it said 8 miles left. That's the cold weather range drop problem in a Volt. The salesman basically confirmed that yes it was a problem - and that he would significantly reduce the price of the vehicle if I was still interested in buying it - lol. He knew it was crap. All the salesman at the dealer did. I feel bad for them trying to sell a car that they all know is a junker.
However I know the Model S is leap years ahead of the tech in the Volt and there is really no comparison. Even still, I would expect to see something somewhat similar with regards to a range drop in the Model S just due to mother nature and its affect on these batteries. I'm no expert though on this though. I'm just talking from personal experience with the Volt. :/
Don't take this the wrong way, because I'm all pro-Tesla and can't wait to get my Model S! --> but isn't this similar to what happens with the Chevy Volt during winter? Isn't there a significant drop in range when its cold out? I know they started turning on the engine below 28 degrees to help warm the car up but as far as a range drop I would think this is kind of expected in both the Volt and the Model S. So basically what I'm saying is that this range drop, if it is a true range drop, is expected behavior in this cold weather. That's not going to deter me from buying the Model S in any way though as to me that's normal.
I even test drove a Volt last winter and when I turned on the car it said 15 miles range left, and when I pulled out of the parking lot for my test drive (e.g. about 100 feet) it said 8 miles left. That's the cold weather range drop problem in a Volt. The salesman basically confirmed that yes it was a problem - and that he would significantly reduce the price of the vehicle if I was still interested in buying it - lol. He knew it was crap. All the salesman at the dealer did. I feel bad for them trying to sell a car that they all know is a junker.
However I know the Model S is leap years ahead of the tech in the Volt and there is really no comparison. Even still, I would expect to see something somewhat similar with regards to a range drop in the Model S just due to mother nature and its affect on these batteries. I'm no expert though on this though. I'm just talking from personal experience with the Volt. :/
With all due respect I would not classify the Volt as a junker. The Tesla Roadster did not have these same cold weather problems.
Well I guess I'm also a little biased as I owned a chevy camaro and was extremely dissatisfied with the flimsy parts chevy used, dozens of mechanical issues, and just a plain old bad service dept who tried to rip me off every time I had to bring the car in. One time they even tried to charge me $200 for changing a front headlight during regular service. It was a friggin $5 part. The interior of the Volt reminded me of the crappy inferior parts used in the camaro. All that for $40k? Are you kidding me? Obviously I was not impressed with the Volt whatsoever. The salesman even offered $10k below sticker before negotiating. That seemed to indicate that they're just trying to get rid of them all. Your experience must have been a lot different than mine was.
mknox
Well-Known Member
This is contrary to everything I know and have heard about the Volt (not the range issue; that it is a "junker"). I am a VP at a Canadian electrical utility, and we bought one as part of a study into EV's. We've let employees take the car for a week at a time to pound on it and study the impacts of EVs on driving behavior and the distribution grid. We're about a year into it, and the car has performed flawlessly, and comments are generally positive from our employee "reviewers" (we have them track results and complete a survey). I myself was quite impressed with the vehicle. I would seriously consider a Volt (or, more likely, the upcoming Cadillac ELR) except for the fact that my commute is so long that I couldn't make it even one way on electricity alone. I really want to drive on pure electricity and so the Model S is really the only car that can do this for me.
I have seen a lot of your posts on here mknox and I have to say that you are very impartial/unbiased and I always value your opinion, although I do not always agree with it
. Now that I know you are a VP for an electrical utility company, it just makes your opinions on EVs just that more valid. Thanks for your input!
Personally, I am not a fan of the Volt. In fact, I am not a fan of hybrids. Seems to me more companies need to put out real purely electric vehicles as options that don't involve risking lives for oil, temptations for governments to be persuaded by perverse morals of shady dictators just because they have oil, and polluting the atmosphere any more than is absolutely necessary. The Volt seems to me like a way to peddle further gas consumption as being somehow fantastically more eco. Having said that, it gets better milage than a Hummer, so on that front it is an improvement (as I recall, we had that discussion on another thread a few months ago).
Glad to hear that the testers liked it though. Makes me think that other american companies could produce electric vehicles if they chose to do so, so hopefully Tesla's Model S success will push them all in that direction.
Cheers
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bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
I felt the same as you, not all that long ago. I felt the Volt was just a *nod* to conservation. But that's changed. There are more and more reports (some I've heard firsthand) that Volt owners are bragging about 'how long since I last had to buy gas'. The Volt is truly becoming a great way for people to find out how little range they really do need, while addressing the whole range anxiety thinking that keeps people from buying EVs. As Nikki wrote about, Volt owners aren't experiencing range anxiety, they have gas anxiety (as in 'OMG I might have to use some gas!'. Forget Range Anxiety, Chevy Volt Owners Have Gas Anxiety
I think of the Volt now as more of a 'gateway EV'. It will be interesting to see how many Volt owners move to pure EV on their next vehicle.
Well that's good that its not as bad as I think it was originally made out to be. When I had looked at the Volt, this was LAST december 2011 - last year. I believe a number of bad incidents happened at that time and I was reading nothing but negative reviews on the car. That being December 2011 their first year and much hyped and big in public view, I think their sales at their time were WAY under what they thought they were gonna do at that time and the general public view was that the car basically flopped. Then they were hit with the fire incident, then the cold weather range problem, then GM stopped production of the vehicle because noone was buying and there was a huge oversupply - it was definitely NOT looking good. I guess this is why they were offering me a HUUUGE discount if I wanted to buy one. I think they were really really desperate to get to that 10,000 mark by the end of the year last year and they didn't even come close.
But now I guess they've fixed all their problems and are starting to get more positive reviews by people such as yourself. A quick google search seems to confirm this that people are indeed satisfied with it now after working through all the original quirks with the car. To me its still seems a little pricey for what you are getting. A base Model S really isn't too much more than a loaded Volt and its a totally different class of car. That makes me think the Volt should really be a lot cheaper than what it's sticker price is showing. Oh well.
I admit though the Cadillac does look pretty cool - I did look at it too but was immediately turned off when I found out that its basically the same as a Volt just with a different outer shell. I was hoping their it would be a totally different much improved electrical powertrain. But then again if all those problems are fixed then that's really good for the Cadillac. I hope their launch is much more successful that the Volt's was. I suspect it will be since all the issues should have been worked out by now using the Volt as lessons learned. IMHO $40k on a Chevy (on ANY chevy) seems pretty steep, but maybe consumers are more willing to spend +$40k on a Cadillac since it's a step above Chevy. HOWEVER, and that's a *BIG* however, I think their biggest problem is going to be pricing. If the Volt costs $40k, and the Cadillac EV is a class up in luxury, if they near $50k or even go over $50k, I do think it's going to flop even if it is a well built vehicle only because why spend $50k on the Caddy that gets ~35 miles on electric when you can spend $50k on the base Model S and get 160 miles on electric. I know they've said its going to be a bit of an improvement on range, but realistically whats that going to be ... 50-60 miles? Unless you need the extra range from the gas engine, the Model S is a much better deal, YMMV. The other way I look at it is if you have a gas engine + an electric engine - that's twice as many parts to break in a car when compared to one without the gas engine. Heh I guess thats me rationalizing again my decision for the Model S
I believe the official release of the Cadillac ELR is 2 weeks away - January 15th at the Detriot Auto Show. I will definitely be watching! (not that it makes a difference to me, I'm still getting the Model S
just curious what their pricing is going to be ) The rims looks really nice too http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f5/Cadillac_Converj_1_--_2010_DC.jpg
dennis
Model S Plaid
With the alternatives in the Volt price range limited to 100 miles or less in range (Leaf, Mitsubishi i, etc), an environmentally conscious consumer who can't/won't live with severe range restrictions can buy a Volt and significantly reduce their petroleum consumption. Until Tesla delivers Gen3 and provides a range-capable EV at the $30K price point, plug-in hybrids are a good alternative IMO. Volts have outsold Leafs 3:1 in 2012.
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You have to be careful when comparing pricing. The Volt at $40K is BEFORE the $7500 tax rebate, while the Model S 40kwh is $50K AFTER the rebate. The Volt has Nav standard, so you have to add $3750 to the price of Model S. And at $45K-$50K MSRP for the ELR, we can expect it to also include leather, parking sensors, lane departure, etc., all of which you can add to the Volt for about $2500. So on an apples-to-apples basis, you will be comparing the ELR to a $62K Model S that doesn't have access to the Supercharger network.
I'm not stating this to be critical of the Model S, just to show that the cars will appeal to different buyers. We have to assume that buyers opting for the 40kwh battery are cost conscious.
+1. My experience is that once you own a hybrid you don't want to buy a pure ICE car. And once you own an electric motor-powered car (PHEV or BEV) you don't want to buy a car with a transmission. So for many consumers it will be a progression that gets them to a pure EV.
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mknox
Well-Known Member
I agree. They seem way too complicated for what they are trying to accomplish. I rented a Prius a year ago in Vegas, drove to my brother's place in LA, drove around there for a week, then back to Vegas. After that, I knew I'd never buy one of those!
We bought the Volt over something like the Leaf because while we wanted to study EVs, we didn't want to leave employees stranded if they forgot to charge, drove beyond its range and so forth. The Volt's range extender engine sees to that.
I am also on a committee made up of Ontario's Ministry of Transportation, Ministry of Energy and a few other electric utilities looking into EV adoption and issues. (We have a "stretch" goal of 20% EVs by 2020 in the province). Hope to be able to provide some insights from this forum as time goes on. We've only met once this far.
At risk of continuing the off topic convo re: the Volt. I'll just say, the Volt is really a great car for what its supposed to be. It isn't for everyone (mostly due to smallish size). But it is solidly built, and quite a technical achievement. People who denigrate it are usually either misinformed or worse, politically biased. (Note I said "usually".) There's a reason that the Volt has more than 90% satisfied owners (the highest of ALL cars, for 2 years in a row). People who drive them regularly, find that they are great vehicles.
And to make this post Tesla relevant, it is as stated above, the perfect gateway car to an EV future. Anyone who dismisses the public feeling of range anxiety is looking at the EV world with seriously rose colored glasses. And while superchargers and 85 kWh batteries are one way to address it, the Volt's means is also effective. And to be honest, as a very satisfied Volt owner, I would say, it is the more effective way to do so TODAY (as it certainly was for the last 18 months). Perhaps it'll shift in the future, but not until we have more than a smattering of superchargers IMO.
And to make this post Tesla relevant, it is as stated above, the perfect gateway car to an EV future. Anyone who dismisses the public feeling of range anxiety is looking at the EV world with seriously rose colored glasses. And while superchargers and 85 kWh batteries are one way to address it, the Volt's means is also effective. And to be honest, as a very satisfied Volt owner, I would say, it is the more effective way to do so TODAY (as it certainly was for the last 18 months). Perhaps it'll shift in the future, but not until we have more than a smattering of superchargers IMO.
I have a Volt and it is my "gateway" drug, I mean "gateway" EV. That is why I am in line for a MS P85. Once I "tasted" EV, I can never go back.
Don't know if the figures still apply, but at one time a Caddy only cost about 20% more to build than a Chevy. Surveys established, however, that Caddy buyers preferred to keep the price about 100% higher -- as a barrier to purchase! They were buying exclusivity and status, and didn't want the hoi-polloi to get their grubby hands on them. I think it was about this time that the Caddy became the drug dealers' car of choice. Always thought those two things were related ... :wink:
If you are correct and that the majority of Volt owners follow up the volt with a pure EV, then I will be obliged to eat some serious crow. I'm just not as confident that this will happen but the concept of proving to folks that they don't need all that range capacity very often has merit in reducing range anxiety fears and perhaps this will translate to more EV purchases.
Cheers
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