HW2.5 capabilities

[lunitiks]

Might not mean anything, but on Model X the triple-cam harness for the rear view mirror got a new part number during the same period as well. (Model S doesn't seem to have this specific part no., might be part of something else on S. Haven't checked thoroughly.)

 

[BigD0g]

Beginning to suspect that hw2.5 was sneaked in around summertime this year.

Couple of reasons:

@verygreen noted a while ago that 2.5 should have somewhat different wiring. Electreks source in the 9-8-2017 article seems to corraborate this:


Anyway I've noticed that the part no. for the main dash/ip harness changed from "XXXXXXX-03-X" to "XXXXXXX-93-X" sometime between april/may and july 2017, both on the S and the X. Interestingly, this is the same period in which the "G"-revision of the ECU showed up in the parts manual.

@skilly's post here kind of supports my theory...

I'm no expert and don't pretend to be one on the internet, but I seem to recall the part numbers indicating which versions they are compatible with? If someone has access to the tech specs / docs and has the new part numbers, can't they see in the docs if it's compatible with the current part pre 2.5 hardware? Wouldn't that answer the question about backwards compatibility?

 

[lunitiks]

Sure, the parts manual often notes if a part is not compatible with an older version. Or when it's only supposed to be used with some particular "gen" car. In this case, neither the "G"-revision of the ECU, the new revision of dash/ip harness(es) or the Model X triple cam harness seem to rule out backwards compatibilty. They're simply just new parts numbers (revisions)

 

[verygreen]

Might not mean anything, but on Model X the triple-cam harness for the rear view mirror got a new part number during the same period as well. (Model S doesn't seem to have this specific part no., might be part of something else on S. Haven't checked thoroughly.)

Hm.I wonder if this is why they replaced my tri-cam cluster when they replaced my windshield for the first time, but not for the second?

ASY,HRN,MDLX,ALL,OHC,TRIPLE-CAM 1 (1082391-00-B)

 

[lunitiks]

ASY,HRN,MDLX,ALL,OHC,TRIPLE-CAM 1 (1082391-00-B)

Actually that's the old harness, the new revision is 1082391-00-C.

They've replaced your windshield twice?? Well if they did swap the tri-cam cluster first time around, it might be because of the pitch angle issue. They have a fix for this now (a plastic plate thingie), but they might've been lazy with yours and just installed a new block. Dunno when you had this done

 

[lunitiks]

Allright I went through the parts manual again and found out that these parts have changed since April/May 2017. The changes may or may not have anything to do with hw2.5 (Only Tesla knows). Please note that this is Model X, I don't have the time to go through both models.

Triple cam glare shield

Triple cam harness

Body harness

Dash harness, prem audio cars

Dash harness, base audio cars

Autopilot ECU 2.0

Central controller

Side repeater autopilot (LH)

Side repeater autopilot (RH)

Sensor encoder, small Drive Unit

Of course there's also a ton of other, non-autopilot changes - way too much to list. Anything from dash air vents, hoses, door latches, suspension parts, steering column control module, rear license plate lamps, clips/retainers + + +.

Just goes to show that the cars are indeed improving over time

 

[BigD0g]

I wonder what the changes are to the side repeaters that could be new / improved cameras or something else? Perhaps something to prevent the water?

 

[AnxietyRanger]

Just goes to show that the cars are indeed improving over time

Well, changing.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

I wonder what the changes are to the side repeaters that could be new / improved cameras or something else? Perhaps something to prevent the water?

Interesting was the earlier posted note that a certain new revision of the side repeater (there are several) cameras was mandatory for Korea.

 

[verygreen]

Actually that's the old harness, the new revision is 1082391-00-C.

They've replaced your windshield twice?? Well if they did swap the tri-cam cluster first time around, it might be because of the pitch angle issue. They have a fix for this now (a plastic plate thingie), but they might've been lazy with yours and just installed a new block. Dunno when you had this done

Oh well, no idea why the change then, I don't think the pitch was too bad since autopilot worked ok (I probably need to look into the logs how much did the yaw/pitch detected changed).
They changed it sometime at end of June.

And yes, replaced my windshield twice, once for ghosting (not really, there was a scratch in the tint so I asked for a replacement hoping for better ghosting), but on the second one the ghosting was much more extreme, so I asked them to change it again for the new partnumber and this time it's very good.

 

[verygreen]

So.... Feeling a bit stupid not noticing this earlier, but anyway found the other autopilot node hardware description and filesystem.

As of 17.28.103 (don't have 17.32 yet) the other node does nothing at all.

On the hardware front it looks like there are some cameras connected to it and overall hw-attached wise difference with the 1st node are relatively small, there's no display, no usb and a few more devices are also disabled, but I think nvidia gpu is there.

There are somewhat cryptic dd-npd and qd-npd devices that are new for HW2.5 that were not there in HW2

 

[CSFTN]

So.... Feeling a bit stupid not noticing this earlier, but anyway found the other autopilot node hardware description and filesystem.

As of 17.28.103 (don't have 17.32 yet) the other node does nothing at all.

On the hardware front it looks like there are some cameras connected to it and overall hw-attached wise difference with the 1st node are relatively small, there's no display, no usb and a few more devices are also disabled, but I think nvidia gpu is there.

There are somewhat cryptic dd-npd and qd-npd devices that are new for HW2.5 that were not there in HW2

I'm sorry - can you translate this into English?

 

[verygreen]

So I've been pondering the hardware description and could not really understand why would they get rid of a fan in hw2.5, makes no sense, right?

Well, I got to look at actual diagrams today from a very resourceful source. HW2.5 is liquid cooled so they don't need that fan. Additionally I do see the second parker chip added.

 

[stopcrazypp]

So I've been pondering the hardware description and could not really understand why would they get rid of a fan in hw2.5, makes no sense, right?

Well, I got to look at actual diagrams today from a very resourceful source. HW2.5 is liquid cooled so they don't need that fan. Additionally I do see the second parker chip added.

So is it 2x Parker SoC + 1x discrete GPU or 2x Parker SoC + 2x discrete GPU? Maybe we need another teardown thread for HW 2.5.

 

[verygreen]

So is it 2x Parker SoC + 1x discrete GPU or 2x Parker SoC + 2x discrete GPU? Maybe we need another teardown thread for HW 2.5.

Parker SoC already includes GPU is Nvidia to be believed: Introducing Parker, NVIDIA’s Newest SOC for Autonomous Vehicles | NVIDIA Blog

Yes, another teardown would be nice once we have a confirmed hw2.5 car

 

[lunitiks]

Yes, another teardown would be nice

 

[lunitiks]

So I've been pondering the hardware description and could not really understand why would they get rid of a fan in hw2.5, makes no sense, right?

Well, I got to look at actual diagrams today from a very resourceful source. HW2.5 is liquid cooled so they don't need that fan. Additionally I do see the second parker chip added.

This is huge in so many ways I don't know where to begin.

But I'll ask you this for starters:
- Do we know *how* it is liquid cooled? I.e. is this thing now hooked up to the cars cooling or HVAC-system somehow?
- Two Parker chips would mean Electreks "spokesperson" was outright lying, right?

 

[Alketi]

@verygreen Are you sure Tesla is not simply implementing nVidia's Co-Pilot technology with the extra card hardware, since we know that the Model 3 has an internal camera?

 

[verygreen]

This is huge in so many ways I don't know where to begin.

But I'll ask you this for starters:
- Do we know *how* it is liquid cooled? I.e. is this thing now hooked up to the cars cooling or HVAC-system somehow?
- Two Parker chips would mean Electreks "spokesperson" was outright lying, right?

I did not really ask about the cooling details, also this is for the Model 3 where they apparently colocated the ape and the ice in the same housing and then have it liquid cooled somehow. Not sure how all of this would work in X/S until we see a sample (unclear if current code even reflects such a setup or not).

The "spokeperson" words could be a lie or just them being misinformed. After all the dual parker might be considered a single GPU by some, just a different configuration of PX2, no?

 

[verygreen]

@verygreen Are you sure Tesla is not simply implementing nVidia's Co-Pilot technology with the extra card hardware, since we know that the Model 3 has an internal camera?

I have no idea. The second chip does not do anything at the moment in the firmware I have access to.

But the markings on the diagram actually don't support that theory and support the other theory of redundancy more.