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Wow! Thanks for putting together that comparison chart. That was a lot of work.
I was curious about the charge port. It should be CCS with two DC pins but in the photo there's a cover-like plastic below Mennekes type 2 AC port. What is that cover? Do we remove the cover when charging at CCS high power DC stations?GenevaView attachment 285496View attachment 285497View attachment 285498View attachment 285500View attachment 285501View attachment 285502View attachment 285503View attachment 285504View attachment 285496 View attachment 285497 View attachment 285498 View attachment 285500 View attachment 285501 View attachment 285502 View attachment 285503 View attachment 285504
Yes, a pretty common to have an additional over for the DC pat.Do we remove the cover when charging at CCS high power DC stations?
I was curious about the charge port. It should be CCS with two DC pins but in the photo there's a cover-like plastic below Mennekes type 2 AC port. What is that cover? Do we remove the cover when charging at CCS high power DC stations?
Yup. One extra headache non-Tesla EV drivers have to put up with. :-/
The Jaguar will get a 3x32A (i.e. 22kW) on board charger next year, made in Spain by the way
Well... I got to sit in both (there was a Model 3 at Geneva too). The IPacr felt quite a bit bigger.
Hi smac: where was the M3 at Geneva? I'm a bit gutted I missed it. I didn't think Tesla had a stand. Did you mean you saw one at Meyrin?
And apologies to those of you who have been to GIMS for my post just written implying that few of you had...
Jaguar doesn't include the £4,500 grant so it is £77,000 for first production vs £64,700 for base Model SI imagine I'm one of relatively few people on this forum actually to have sat in an i-Pace (at the Geneva Motor Show yesterday). I've also test driven an MX (one of the first in the UK to do so, so some time ago) and an MS (3 times). So, I think I have some valid opinions. (The M3 hasn't reached Europe yet, so I can't compare.)
The two main reasons I've never bitten the bullet and bought a Tesla is (a) the cost - thanks to Brexit and the plummeting £, it's now a really expensive car in the UK (£108K for a reasonably specced 7-seat X100D with premium, AP & FSD) and (b) the minimalistic, austere interior. This latter particularly influences my wife, who hates it, and also finds the S claustrophobic.
I was really wanting to like the iPace. I expected it to tick all the boxes re a relatively sumptuous interior compared with a Tesla, and to be comfortable and roomy without being quite so enormous on the outside (MS and MX are both very large cars in the European context).
However, I was very disappointed.
It does not feel roomy inside - I don't care what the measurements say, it just isn't a full 5-seater, at least not comfortably so for 5 adults. The middle 2nd row seat is very uncomfortable, has a bit of a floor hump (for cables, apparently!) and less headroom. There is not enough hip room on the seat for 3 sets of adult hips. The outer two get pushed out into the cubby space in the doors, which means you aren't sitting in the well of the seat, but on the edge. Worse, the tops of the door windows are low, below eye height for a long-bodied person (I am about 5ft11" or 1m81 but long body, short legs). It's better in the back than a MS, which is very claustrophobic with the low roofline, but not by much.
It's not much better in the front - again, a very low side roofline. If you adjust the seat high enough to (almost) see the front of the bonnet (sorry, hood), you have to bend down to look sideways.
The iPace is promoted as having a lot of cabin room because of the long wheelbase (overall length comparable with Macan but rear legroom more than Cayenne, I think they claim). The numbers mislead. The fundamental design compromise in an EV with an underfloor battery but needing a good CdA and hence low roof is that the height from floor to roof in the cabin is much less than you'd think. Sure, there is lots of knee room in the back, but only because your knees are way up high. You are sitting on the back of your bum (should that be ass to most of you?), not on the backs of your thighs. Recipe for sore bum on long journey.
The iPace also copies the Tesla's (IMHO) bad front seat design with integrated headrests. The forward view from either of the outer back seats is therefore horribly claustrophobic - no forward view at all, just a bit half-forward through the gap in the front seats, and duck your head to look out of the window.
There is no doubting that the general perceived quality of the interior is much better than Tesla (or at least than Tesla used to be - I haven't seen a recent one, and I understand they've got a little better). In an old-fashioned, stitched leather, lots of knobs and switches sort of way as well as the general "quality" of materials. You either prefer this or you don't. Personally, I think physical knobs for frequently required functions have to be better than trying to find a soft button on a touchscreen, but perhaps you get so used to the Tesla interface that you don't have to take your eyes off the road to open the window or whatever.
Other pros and cons have been discussed ad nauseam elsewhere. Tesla's supercharger network is an enormous plus. The AP tech is either a major USP or not something you'd trust. The dealer network is probably the opposite in UK and US - I have 3 Jag dealers within 35 miles, while my nearest Tesla Service Centre is 80 miles away.
It's difficult to compare prices properly, as the only iPace you can get for at least a year is the fully loaded "First Edition" which is, I think, around £82K in the UK (not sure if this is before or after the £4.5K PEV grant), which compares with £65.5K (after grant) for an absolutely base model S75D. But a bit of a meaningless comparison. The only thing these three cars have in common is that they are long-range BEVs; but would you choose between a rather peculiar (FWDs!) big 7-seater, a stylish performance 5-d coupé and a medium-sized crossover on the basis of price?
So, I'll go for a test drive in an iPace when I can (not until September, I'm told), but I don't see me buying one. Maybe an M3 when they get here next year - I've got 2 reservations! Or I can work on the boss to convince her that an MX is lovely inside...
... the only iPace you can get for at least a year is the fully loaded "First Edition" ...
That seems quite helpful, assuming it happens on schedule. I don't understand why they're offering the car without it this year, though. Will they be upgrading these cars once the new chargers are available?
It was over near the Hyundai stand at Caresoft's stand ( Automotive Benchmarking, Product Development, Cost Optimization, Manufacturing and Aftermarket )Hi smac: where was the M3 at Geneva? I'm a bit gutted I missed it. I didn't think Tesla had a stand. Did you mean you saw one at Meyrin?
And apologies to those of you who have been to GIMS for my post just written implying that few of you had...
Some info from a JLR rep at Frankfurt
• Production car will be unveiled in Q1,2018
• Prices will start from GBP 60K
• Magna Steyr's contract with JLR is for annual production of 12,500 units
• Jaguar has 25,000 confirmed orders with deposits
It was over near the Hyundai stand at Caresoft's stand ( Automotive Benchmarking, Product Development, Cost Optimization, Manufacturing and Aftermarket )
AFAIK it's the first one in Europe on public display.
They were good enough to let anyone get in and poke and prod at the car. It was obviously US spec (including licence plates), the VIN was covered.
My understanding is it's due for strip down / rebuild for competitive analysis purposes.