Karpathy leaves - what's next for AP/FSD?

[2101Guy]

One thing is crystal clear: Elon's word cannot be relied on nor trusted.
And THAT..is not a good trait to have as a leader.

 

[thinger]

The removal of radars last year should have pointed to vision-only being in a working state as well...

I think that they only removed radar to save money. When they finallt got vision on some level.

 

[2101Guy]

It's hard to blame EM for setting and missing the deadlines, but it's for sure easy to blame him for hostile DEV environment. The 40 hours in the office BS is lack of forward thinking from him. It's obvious that some people would do 200% better at home, if they can focus and not worry about time of the day, dressing up, public washrooms, etc, etc. Other would do better in the office because at home they have kids, wives, pets, loud neighbors, etc, etc. Treating your talented workforce, especially DEVs, as slaves that you happen to feed and give money to does not make sense. They will get poached.

Andrej should've been above those rules, imho. And if Tesla is on the final stretch and all they need is more fleet, DOJO and possibly V4 hardware then Andrej is simply wasting his time there and should focus on new horizons. Possibly join Hotz, those two together can change more things than EM ever did, imho.

Agreed Especially when various studies last year showed the productivity benefits of working remotely. Hes shooting himself in the foot..
Time for the board to select a new CEO to run the company..

 

[_Redshift_]

I see that same way. Tesla needs CEO who don’t spend time on Twitter giving false information. Musk did that was needed. Made EVs popular.

I see Elon as brilliant, but someone unable to build a company for the long term. It sounds a little harsh, especially since he is the reason Tesla is the number 1 EV maker today. It has taken them close to 2 decades to do that.

However, his focus tends to drift, and I don’t necessarily blame him. He has worked so hard for so long.

He should step down so someone else can take over the reins at Tesla while he continues to be on the board giving vital inputs when needed.

Otherwise, Tesla‘s leadership position might start eroding as customer loyalties will shift, due to increasing competition.

 

[Ptheven]

What's next? Not refunds, unfortunately.

 

[_Redshift_]

I also have not noticed any difference with regular AP/NoA as part of FSDb 10.12. The only gripe I have is aggressive accel/decel sometimes in bumper-to-bumper traffic, but that has been an issue for a long while and not specific to FSDb. I can't even remember the last time I had a phantom braking incident on the highway. I definitely empathize with people with degraded experiences though. There's too many anecdotes of that for it to be subjective.

While ‘slam on the brakes at 75 mph to slow to 35 mph’ phantom braking events are not there anymore, the slowing down in the free and clear carpool lane from 75 to 55 because adjacent lane has heavy traffic continues every day for me.

Also, like another poster mentioned, too many illogical lane changes.

Lastly, when will it drive defensively to let a car merge in front of it at an entrance ramp on the freeway?

 

[nvx1977]

While ‘slam on the brakes at 75 mph to slow to 35 mph’ phantom braking events are not there anymore, the slowing down in the free and clear carpool lane from 75 to 55 because adjacent lane has heavy traffic continues every day for me.

Also, like another poster mentioned, too many illogical lane changes.

Lastly, when will it drive defensively to let a car merge in front of it at an entrance ramp on the freeway?

Re: your carpool lane issue, yeah I don't think Tesla ever made an exception to that. A while back they added a feature to slow you down if adjacent lanes are slow. Usually this is a good decision, as some idiot inevitably tries to switch to your lane without looking, potentially causing you to rear-end them. I have a few of these incidents on saved dashcam. But agreed, it should ignore the slow lanes when you're in an HOV lane. My previous reply was to say that I haven't seen any 10.12-specific changes to AP/NoA.

Illogical lane changes have been the norm for me since NoA was released. I've long disabled that feature. I've also reverted back to having the car prompt me for lane changes. I still reject a lot of them.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

A while back they added a feature to slow you down if adjacent lanes are slow.

I’ve only ever noticed this when passing on the right (with chevrons showing in visualization in adjacent lane).

Though I invariably avoid using AP in heavy traffic with high speed differentials and I don’t use the carpool lane so I would have missed other cautious slowing behavior. That’s always a stressful situation regardless of whether AP or under manual control anyway.

 

[GalacticHero]

Elon said that Tesla's valuation depends on solving FSD. So Elon likely feels a sense of urgency in making FSD progress. But I think Elon might be pushing the FSD team too hard, demanding fast progress every 2 weeks. There is such a thing as pushing a team too hard to the point where people quit. And having your head of AI quit will hurt progress. So pushing your team too hard can actually backfire.

"The beatings will continue until morale improves." -- Far too many engineering managers

 

[jboy210]

Dojo supercomputer...crickets. Recent elimination of several hundred jobs on "labeling" team. Reintroduction of Enhanced Autopilot. Not positive signs for FSD progression. Karpathy contributed a significant vision to the team. Will be interesting to see how FSD evolves. Personally, seems like better hardware--corner/high mounted cameras for cross traffic are necessary.

I hope the FSD team gets a new leader and progress continues. But I have doubts-- not just Tesla's vision approach. City driving by a "computer on wheels" is a very difficult situation to solve.

I think EAP coming back is because they want the cash, and it does much of what people want.

I am unwilling to pay for FSD but bought EAP on my previous X and loved it. It did everything I wanted, and I miss features like turning on the turn signal and having the car see it was clear and then change lanes or take an off-ramp. I am trying to convince myself I need it on my 2022 X since I work from home and have not been visiting clients as much thanks to Covid.

 

[jboy210]

"The beatings will continue until morale improves." -- Far too many engineering managers

Yep. I remember hearing about how Steve Jobs would pit engineers against each.

 

[jboy210]

People change jobs all the time. Karpathy always impressed me as an academic type who pined to be a big shot Professor at either Cal Tech or Stanford.

Well, he was pretty brilliant even as PhD candidate at Stanford. His videos are really good and easy to understand.

 

[JulienW]

....the slowing down in the free and clear carpool lane from 75 to 55 because adjacent lane has heavy traffic continues every day for me.....

I was in the HOV lane behind another car and slow moving traffic in regular lanes and a car decided to pull into the HOV lane without looking. The car in front of me had to locked up their brakes and AP (pre Beta) and I (think AP beat me by a few milliseconds) also did the same. Unless the HOV have a protected barrier it should be treated the same.

 

[rhuber]

Narrator: "That, like all prior and subsequent statements about FSD, turned out to be untrue."

https://twitter.com/x/status/1126611407984779264

 

[rhuber]

HMU when I can join the class action lawsuit. I'm in for all three times I wasted money on this nonsense.

 

[jebinc]

HMU when I can join the class action lawsuit. I'm in for all three times I wasted money on this nonsense.

Same

 

[2101Guy]

Narrator: "That, like all prior and subsequent statements about FSD, turned out to be untrue."

https://twitter.com/x/status/1126611407984779264

consistent over years with his false statements..give him that.

but..brilliant..tweets like that sucked in tens of millions of money taken in for FSD purchases. People believed in Elon like they believed in Jim Jones.

 

[_Redshift_]

Re: your carpool lane issue, yeah I don't think Tesla ever made an exception to that. A while back they added a feature to slow you down if adjacent lanes are slow. Usually this is a good decision, as some idiot inevitably tries to switch to your lane without looking, potentially causing you to rear-end them. I have a few of these incidents on saved dashcam. But agreed, it should ignore the slow lanes when you're in an HOV lane. My previous reply was to say that I haven't seen any 10.12-specific changes to AP/NoA.

Illogical lane changes have been the norm for me since NoA was released. I've long disabled that feature. I've also reverted back to having the car prompt me for lane changes. I still reject a lot of them.

Yes, the lane changes make for a very busy workload. Better to drive yourself. For me, NoA is a problem because of that and needs to be turned off. Being on EAP, all I will miss is taking the exit ramp autonomously.

 

[Goose66]

I have "confirm lane changes" turned on as well in NoA in my "Production" profile. It makes it a much better system.

I have automatic lane changes in NoA in my "FSD Beta" profile, but that profile is only utilized when I am wanting to be in test mode - not on long trips or morning bumper-to-bumper commutes.

 

[Dewg]

I have "confirm lane changes" turned on as well in NoA in my "Production" profile. It makes it a much better system.

I have automatic lane changes in NoA in my "FSD Beta" profile, but that profile is only utilized when I am wanting to be in test mode - not on long trips or morning bumper-to-bumper commutes.

^this. Go into NoA settings and disable automatic lane changes for speed, and I have confirm lane changes off and set to "chime". It will stay in your lane until the route requires you to change lanes, even if your lane is moving very slow compared to other lanes. You can force a lane change by just using your turn signals, and it will stay in that new lane until the route requires it to change lanes.