wallet.dat
Member
Well, there is the new Acura NSX, which can be run without power to the electric motors up front. Of course the key difference there is that there aren't two separate AWD/RWD options for the platform as there is with the Tesla.
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1.21 Jiggawatts
Member
I will be ordering my model 3 with the "D" option without a doubt. Our weather can be pretty crazy here in Canada.
My question is how much will it cost to upgrade? Will it be the same 5k price like the model S70 was?
My question is how much will it cost to upgrade? Will it be the same 5k price like the model S70 was?
In my personal experience I prefer a RWD Model S over the AWD.
With good winter-tires they both handle very well in snowy conditions. They don't handle the same, but both models are very predictable and easy to drive.
Now there is no doubt that the AWD system is slightly more efficient because they shut down the big rear-motor and only run on the front motor at highway speeds.
But the AWD system adds a slight howling noise from the front engine which I really can't stand. It drives me completely up the wall. This combined with the pricetag made me go for the RWD version of the S85.
But I will say this about the standard "all-seasons" that come with the car: They are without a doubt the worst piece of rubber I have ever met. If conditions are slightly damp the tires let go. A little cold the tires let go. Within a month of taking delivery I had them replaced with Nokian WR3 AR winter tires and bought a set of Dunlop XL Sport for the summer.
It really is all about the tires.
Also what good is a pretty car if you can't make her shake her tail-feathers once in a while.
All this being said I hope they make the Model 3 in AWD and RWD versions. If they don't they will probably have to make it AWD only because it's what the "home market" believes to be necessary.
With good winter-tires they both handle very well in snowy conditions. They don't handle the same, but both models are very predictable and easy to drive.
Now there is no doubt that the AWD system is slightly more efficient because they shut down the big rear-motor and only run on the front motor at highway speeds.
But the AWD system adds a slight howling noise from the front engine which I really can't stand. It drives me completely up the wall. This combined with the pricetag made me go for the RWD version of the S85.
But I will say this about the standard "all-seasons" that come with the car: They are without a doubt the worst piece of rubber I have ever met. If conditions are slightly damp the tires let go. A little cold the tires let go. Within a month of taking delivery I had them replaced with Nokian WR3 AR winter tires and bought a set of Dunlop XL Sport for the summer.
It really is all about the tires.
Also what good is a pretty car if you can't make her shake her tail-feathers once in a while.
All this being said I hope they make the Model 3 in AWD and RWD versions. If they don't they will probably have to make it AWD only because it's what the "home market" believes to be necessary.
my current car (Audi A3) is actually set up similarly.
for default, it sends power in an 85-15 split to the front and rear wheels, respectively, which boosts fuel economy(range).
but if the computer detects any slippage, it can send up to 100% of power to any one wheel.
And yes, it's fun in corners.
so if it works on an ICE, I imagine it will improve handling on the Model 3.
in theory yeah. but a true AWD will always perform better. saying that it will send 100% power to one wheel is just punch lines for a brochure for you to buy the car, because it will never happen. I had a car a long time ago that has a similar function, acura RL with SH-AWD (Super Handling AWD), but in theory its still a front wheel drive biased system.
The AWD on the dual motor teslas are a whole different beast compared to this.
ModelNforNerd
Active Member
Yes and no.
In the Tesla, at highway speeds, it shifts to a FWD bias to increase efficiency and range. I concede your point at low speeds in the city, but they are fairly similar in behavior at highway speeds.
In the Tesla, at highway speeds, it shifts to a FWD bias to increase efficiency and range. I concede your point at low speeds in the city, but they are fairly similar in behavior at highway speeds.
MrBoylan
Member
You only need $1,000 (per car) on March 31. But budget $65K for a fully loaded Model 3, dual motor, biggest battery, auto pilot, super charger access, upgraded audio, whatever other cool stuff they come up with. Then if you "only" spend $50K, you'll feel like you're getting a deal! (btw, I just played around with a BMW 3 series configurator and got up to $62K pretty quickly, and they start at $32K).
ibdb
Any excuse for a road trip
I own a Model S 85D. I've had a RWD 85 as a loaner. I regularly use a short freeway on ramp, just off a rather sharp corner, that requires aggressive acceleration to get to speed before merging into traffic. I've never had my 85D get even a little bit loose on that ramp, even in very wet conditions. I can't say the same for the RWD 85. I couldn't believe easy it was to get the 85 starting to slide sideways and how far it got off line before I could catch it.
I didn't compare the tires of the two cars, and this was rain and not snow, but in a car with this much instant torque, having as much traction available at all times seems like a really good idea.
I didn't compare the tires of the two cars, and this was rain and not snow, but in a car with this much instant torque, having as much traction available at all times seems like a really good idea.
AWD adds safety only on acceleration, but not under braking or cornering (unless trying to accelerate out of a corner).
andrewschuyler
Member
I'd say that upgrade options will be similarly priced. I can't imagine they'd give ludicrous for any less than $$7k.AWD requires both hardware and software I don't see how they can cut significant cost out of options.
The software is (mostly) already done and paid for (that the point of starting with the expensive cars first).
The front-motor may be a new, smaller, lighter and less costly motor then whats in the front of Model S D's.
I do not expect the price of AWD to be half the price on Model 3 vs Model S, but I do expect it to be priced lower on the Model 3. And the same for some of the other options (but not all).
Red Sage
The Cybernetic Samurai
Remember, all that is necessary is that the individual options and options packages are profitable to Tesla Motors. Most likely, certain options will be rolled into a particular trim level. In times past, trim levels for Model S have been based upon battery pack capacity (thus, range [60, 70, 85, or 90]) and drivetrain (hence, performance [standard, +, or D]). That may not change for Model ≡.
Aside from Supercharger access and the Michelin tire upgrades (both originally included in S85 and up and optional on 60 - both now included on all Ss I believe,) what options were bundled with battery capacity?
I didn't really think Tesla was doing trim levels at all, or bundled options except for in the sense of omnibus packages like Premium and Tech.
Of course, as you say, Tesla might take a different course with the 3.
Walter
SureValla
Member
AFAIK, we don't. However, they're targeting the BMW 3-series as a reference platform/target, and they have a lot of experience (and portable software code) with RWD from the S, but none for FWD.
I think it's reasonable to assume the 2WD version is likely to be RWD until/unless we here differently from an informed source.
Walter
strider
Active Member
Guaranteed is a strong word. We'll know in a couple weeks. But Tesla has repeatedly stated the competition for Model 3 is BMW 3, Audi 4, etc series. They are all RWD or AWD. They have also characterized it as a sport sedan which would also point to RWD or AWD. Further, Tesla has no experience w/ FWD, why would they do it?
MrBoylan
Member
I agree. Battery is battery; options are separate. The Model S "P" version does include air suspension, which you'd pay separately for on a non-P model. And on the Model X, air suspension is "included" (required) on the 90D and P90D (but not required on the 70D, unless you get the tow package). But other than those things (and the red brake calipers on the P), I believe all options are available, independent of battery size. And I expect things to be similar on the Model 3.
Base model 3 will be RWD, and hopefully will have NAV and 4G connectivity for at least 2 years. I believe all of the cool stuff (AutoPilot, Supercharger access, dual motor, premium interior... and ???) will cost extra. Will be interesting to see if the 8-year unlimited warranty on battery and drive train carries over to the Model 3, or if they cut that a bit shorter.
3s-a-charm
Active Member
In typical snow conditions you can get away with RWD but when you park on a snow-covered street with an incline RWD is almost useless regardless of traction control and snow tires. AWD allows me to drive and park anywhere in the city and not get stuck which is very important to me.
Plus the improved performance.
Plus the improved performance.
I haven't had that many problems driving with my RWD car. It actually handles better than my ol' '81 Land Cruiser with 4WD. I figure the modern traction control helps more than the 4WD did. I rate AWD as nice to have, but not a deal killer.
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