Model S Software/Firmware Updates

[brianman]

Part of the reason for the random release of the software updates I was told yesterday is that ATT complained loudly to Tesla that they were overloading their data network with updates when too many were uploaded all at once.

If I bought this excuse, I would start downloading videos continuously over my unlimited AT&T plan just to force them to upgrade their network.

 

[andrewket]

AT&T isn't a startup and already has a reputation. A bad one.

 

[W8MM]

AT&T isn't a startup and already has a reputation. A bad one.

Roger that! AT&T's 3G data service is chronically under-provisioned. Instead of fixing it, they're building out their 4G network to take load off of 3G.

 

[swegman]

I've never had a problem with ATT in the DC area. Been with them since the original iPhone. My current iPhone 5 LTE data rate is consistently above 12 MBs, and many times much faster than that, As indicated by TestMy.net Broadband Internet Speed Test . They had issues years ago in NYC and parts of California, but I think they addressed those problems (aqt least in NYC, based on when I was there last).

 

[Goterps]

AMEN brother. hafta say this age of 24 second news cycles, realtime video blogs, over-the-air software updates, etc etc.. is making everyone manic. this is a huge undertaking tesla has... erm, undertaken, and they are doing a, dare i say, marvelous, job at it. on the one hand everyone complains features aren't propagated early enough, on the very other hand they all complain that there are too many bugs to deal with and telsa isn't propagating new firmware quickly enough. well, they go hand in hand (to complete the metaphor) and i really think people would benefit from sitting back a bit and letting tesla, who obviously know what they're doing, figure it all out. it will happen in due time. WE ARE EARLY ADOPTERS. you crowded in line to get the brand spanking new car with the brand spanking new technology... now deal with it. not to be harsh, but really. there are a lot of very indignant sounding posts on here, as if tesla is personally insulting the poster by not responding, or not updating their firmware or not rolling out their software feature of choice.... it's ludicrous. yes, we've all paid a lot of money. but we knew what we were getting. and getting in to. this is a NEW CAR COMPANY. of course they have ramp up and quality control and system design and part sourcing and all the rest of it issues to deal with..... please show a little restraint in flinging accusations and vitriol. patience is a virtue and all good things come to those who wait. i have taken to posting when i have good things happen if for no other reason than to offset the overwhelmingly picayune and entitled tone that much of this board seems sodden with at times. please gain some perspective here, and realize too that many prospective owners are hanging on our every word as early owners and what we say matters. not that real issues shouldn't be openly and plainly discussed, of course, that's why we're here, but... at the same time, a little perspective in managing expectations and, well.. manners, is in order.

my 2¢.

Yes, we should be patient and expect quirks and give Tesla a chance to address the problems, but better communications by Tesla would not hurt either. To drive a car and have different things not work properly and not know why and to get no responses from customer service is a bit frustrating. We should not have to spend hours searching for answers in these forums. I think this is a great car and a good company (and that is why I bought the car and invested in the company) but better communication would not hurt.

 

[arg]

My point is unless they get up every morning and flip a coin,

Why wouldn't they? If I were running this (which I'm not), the procedure would be something like:

• Each day, from the pool of cars eligible for the upgrade, select a number at random to receive the upgrade and attempt to send it
• If no significant problems after the first few days, increase the number of cars selected each day.
• Repeat until all done.

Random is appropriate for at least two reasons:

1. To give good coverage of all variables likely to affect the upgrade: car specs, geography, usage patterns etc. Since it's hard to predict which factors are relevant to showing up bugs, you can't readily pick a 'representative sample', so random is the best you can do.
2. Fairness. It would not be good for some cars to always be first to get a new upgrade and some last, especially as it's not clear which is most desirable - being early to receive a new feature might be seen as a benefit, but on the other hand the first to receive the update are effectively a beta test group and so more likely to suffer a bad experience due to bugs.

You could try asking customers which they prefer, but a self-selecting beta group defeats the objective of being a representative sample. It also gets messy as different features have different merit for different people - "you gave me all this 12V grief just for the sake of pop-out handles??? I never wanted pop-out handles in the first place!!!". So picking at random among the main bulk of customers is probably the best you can do.

There are probably other non-random factors at play, but they are likely to vary with time and circumstances:

• There almost certainly is a beta group before the main bulk of customers.
• They do have the facility to force the update on a particular customer when that customer has a good reason for asking for it - like the supercharger update where a few people reported that they said "we can't get home without the upgrade" and Tesla applied it within hours.
• After a buggy upgrade has been partially rolled out, it obviously makes sense to prioritize upgrading those customers who received the buggy version, rather than those that are still running a good version.
• When the main content of an upgrade is a specific fix or new feaure relevant to only a small number of customers (say a fix particularly aimed at cold-weather performance), it might make sense to prioritize those customers while still keeping some others in the mix in case it has unexpected impact.
• Some updates involve rolling back unsuccessful features. It's not clear that such updates are worth applying to cars that never had the unsuccessful feature in the first place.
• After a few buggy updates, confidence will be low and it will be seen as high risk to roll out at anything other than a very low rate (given that a problem upgrade might result in a ranger visit to every car impacted, and there aren't many rangers to go round).
• Once the update cycle has got in a mess where there are a range of different versions out there (due to not finishing one complete cycle before starting the next), there's lots of combinations to test - version 1.3 may work well when applied over 1.2 but fail when applied over 1.1. If this turns out to be the case, but 1.3 is an urgent upgrade, 1.3 may need to start rolling out to 1.2 cars, while 1.1 cars are held back pending a version 1.4 that has the 1.3 features and fixes the 1.1->1.3 transition issue.

This is all speculation, but if the real situation is anything like the above, obviously there is a degree of policy in place, but it would be hard to give a public statement of what that policy is other than "we try to do the best we can for all customers in the circumstances as they arise".

 

[dennis]

^^^ +1 to that!

 

[dlmorgan999]

Very well said arg!

 

[GeekGirls]

Why wouldn't they?

I can think of one reason: it means that, statistically speaking, you will always have some subset of your customer base that never gets upgraded at all. I completely agree with your rationale for trying out new releases in this fashion, but at some point you need to settle on a "last known good" release that all your customers with older versions should be on as a minimum.

 

[brianman]

I can think of one reason: it means that, statistically speaking, you will always have some subset of your customer base that never gets upgraded at all.

Not necessarily...

from the pool of cars eligible for the upgrade

As long as your daily push is greater than your delivery-rate-with-old-firmware, you'll eventually catch up. Unless, of course, you're churning out firmware revisions too often.

 

[GeekGirls]

Unless, of course, you're churning out firmware revisions too often.

Certainly new updates have been frequent enough so far that we have a lot of pre-4.0 folk here despite there being at least three updates in the 4.x series. They appear to stop rolling out updates once they reach some critical mass of known problems. Perhaps there simply isn't what they'd consider to be a stable release of 4.0 or 4.1. If that's the case, though, why are new cars arriving with 4.0/4.1?

 

[jerry33]

If that's the case, though, why are new cars arriving with 4.0/4.1?

The firmware was loaded before the new release came out. I'd guess the displays are programmed before being installed in the car, so there might be a couple of weeks worth of older displays going out after the update starts going out to the existing cars.

 

[GeekGirls]

The firmware was loaded before the new release came out.

I guess I wasn't clear. I was pointing out that Tesla seemed to have stopped updating vehicles from 1.15.x to 1.19.x because new releases were incoming (or in any case the update pace was insufficient to get all cars updated before a new release was ready to roll out.) That means that either: Tesla decided that owners are better off on 1.15.x than 1.19.x, which begs the question of why cars from the factory still getting 1.19.x installed? It's either that or the amount of time it takes to update all vehicles is longer than the time in between releases, in which case a random selection of vehicles to install will result in a number that simply never get updated at all.

 

[apacheguy]

Spoke to Tesla Ownership on Friday. They said they has stopped the rollout of the newer sw version, but I assumed he meant 4.1. 4.2 seems to have been out only a few days with no major issues reported so I'm not clear as to why they wouldn't be pushing the update to the remaining cars now.

I've had the car since October without a single update. While I don't want a firmware riddled with bugs, I sure would like to try out 4.2 as it seems that those that have it are pretty satisfied.

 

[Todd Burch]

This is the first time I've had to wait for an update and am now experiencing software update reception anxiety :biggrin:.

My garage has no 3G reception. Has anyone else received the 4.2 update even though their car is principally garaged in a location with no coverage?

I know it's supposed to download when you actually have coverage (like while at work), but can't remember hearing any anecdotes about that actually happening.

 

[Doug_G]

Reception in my garage is dodgy, especially if the door is closed. 4.1 (the .29 version) appeared one evening at the office. No sign of 4.2 yet.

 

[dsm363]

This is the first time I've had to wait for an update and am now experiencing software update reception anxiety :biggrin:.

My garage has no 3G reception. Has anyone else received the 4.2 update even though their car is principally garaged in a location with no coverage?

I know it's supposed to download when you actually have coverage (like while at work), but can't remember hearing any anecdotes about that actually happening.

Do you get wifi access in your garage? I realize that doesn't help yet though. Other option is one of those 3G range extenders for the home.

 

[Todd Burch]

Do you get wifi access in your garage? I realize that doesn't help yet though. Other option is one of those 3G range extenders for the home.

Yes, I'll be fine with wifi. I'd actually be fine with 3G if Tesla would tell me my car's phone number (I have an AT&T repeater in my house and get 5 bars on my phone, but need the phone number of the car for the repeater to boost it's signal as well.)

 

[AnOutsider]

I've had the car since October without a single update. While I don't want a firmware riddled with bugs, I sure would like to try out 4.2 as it seems that those that have it are pretty satisfied.

Agreed. I'd also like to be able to use the SC down in Dellyware.

 

[efxjim]

I would also like to add my S's phone # to my ATT microcell. It would help take the load off the cell towers.