Most efficient tire?

[3sr+buyer]

I don't understand Michelin….I've had Michelin Energy Savers AS tires on my Nissan LEAF and it was a great tire … Low rolling resistance and long lasting with great traction. Why don't they make this tire in a size that fits the most popular EV on the planet?

The Michelin Energy Saver is a less sporty line of tires, similar to the Michelin Defender. The Michelin Primacy and CrossClimate lines are a step up in sportiness. Another step up would be the various Michelin Pilot tires. Presumably, Tesla chose a version of the Primacy (and contracted Michelin to make a Tesla OEM version of the low rolling resistance MXM4) because the Energy Saver was not a sporty enough tire for the Model 3 in Tesla's viewpoint.

Of course, different customers have different preferences about the priority of sportiness (which affects safety aspects like braking and handling), efficiency (which affects range), comfort (noise and ride), tread wear, and cost in the optimal tire for them.

If efficiency and range are your top tire priorities, the OEM tires or tires made specifically with that in mind (e.g. Pirelli PZero ELECT, Hankook iON Evo) would be the tires to look at.

 

[DrChaos]

I don't understand Michelin….I've had Michelin Energy Savers AS tires on my Nissan LEAF and it was a great tire … Low rolling resistance and long lasting with great traction. Why don't they make this tire in a size that fits the most popular EV on the planet?

There is a 235/45R18 94V in Energy Savers but one is "HON" and the other is 'LEX' for presumably Honda and Lexus.

Since all the other sizes are lower (15",16",17"), I suspect that it's internal construction doesn't handle as high loads as other lines of tires.

Tread looks similar to MXM4.

 

[Dave EV]

The Michelin Primacy and CrossClimate lines are a step up in sportiness.

The CrossClimate is not good efficiency wise, though. At least 10% worse than the OEM tires in my experience. And they are louder than the OEM tires, especially at low to medium speeds where they sing a bit. But they do grip really well in wet and cold conditions! Sportiness? They are a bit squirmy in the corners, IMO. I very unlikely to get them again unless I knew I needed the snow capabilities.

 

[Michael24]

Never go cheap on tires. Pick the most efficient and proven.

 

[Wrenching Fool]

I’ve had 2 different sets of Michelin Energy Saver A/S tires (OEM tire on Chevy Bolt) and they are among the worst tires I’ve ever owned. The only good things I can say about them is that they are efficient and quiet, but they give up way, way, WAY too much grip. Even light acceleration (again, in the FWD Bolt) resulted in tons of tire slippage, to the point where you could not pull out into traffic on a rainy day without either lighting up the tires or relying heavily on the traction control to try and manage it. Wet braking was also quite poor. As for longevity, I got about 20k highway miles out of them. At that point, they were at around 5/32” which should have still been plenty, but they would hydroplane so badly even at 70mph in light rain that the car became basically unusable on freeways when raining. I’ve had tires on the wear bars with better hydroplane resistance. No way would I ever recommend those tires to anyone unless they were driving something with less than 100hp and only in dry weather. It’s a tire that prioritizes efficiency too much.

 

[XPsionic]

I’ve had 2 different sets of Michelin Energy Saver A/S tires (OEM tire on Chevy Bolt) and they are among the worst tires I’ve ever owned. The only good things I can say about them is that they are efficient and quiet, but they give up way, way, WAY too much grip. Even light acceleration (again, in the FWD Bolt) resulted in tons of tire slippage, to the point where you could not pull out into traffic on a rainy day without either lighting up the tires or relying heavily on the traction control to try and manage it. Wet braking was also quite poor. As for longevity, I got about 20k highway miles out of them. At that point, they were at around 5/32” which should have still been plenty, but they would hydroplane so badly even at 70mph in light rain that the car became basically unusable on freeways when raining. I’ve had tires on the wear bars with better hydroplane resistance. No way would I ever recommend those tires to anyone unless they were driving something with less than 100hp and only in dry weather. It’s a tire that prioritizes efficiency too much.

Same experience with the same tires on a Nissan leaf. Also had terrible experience in a rental in Europe on Continental eco tires, if it's damp the grip falls off to dangerous levels.

Personally after those experiences, I'd only get tires with efficiency as priority only if a 3rd party test results in great wet braking performance. Too many eco tires are designed to sacrifice safety in the name of efficiency.

 

[Transformer]

The CrossClimate is not good efficiency wise, though. At least 10% worse than the OEM tires in my experience.

Does that mean a 300 mi range became a 270 mi range when you replaced the MXM4 with these? Or 250 Wh/mi became 275? Or 10% of tire contribution to overall resistance (whatever it is, it doesn't increase with velocity squared)?

 

[DrChaos]

Same experience with the same tires on a Nissan leaf. Also had terrible experience in a rental in Europe on Continental eco tires, if it's damp the grip falls off to dangerous levels.

Personally after those experiences, I'd only get tires with efficiency as priority only if a 3rd party test results in great wet braking performance. Too many eco tires are designed to sacrifice safety in the name of efficiency.

Hankook iON evo vs Michelin Pilot Sport 5: New EV tire from Hankook!

In depth analysis of Hankook iON evo vs Michelin Pilot Sport 5 with dry, wet ,rolling resistance, noise & comfort evaluated

toptirereview.com

The Hankook iON evo summer tire exceeded the Michelin Pilot Sport 5 (EU test) in wet braking and smashed it in rolling resistance simultaneously. This is a spectacular result---up against the newest top of the line Michelin performance tire---as conventional tech has a strong tradeoff between rolling resistance and wet traction as you found and commonly reported. Not sure exactly why but I guess tread deformation is good for wet braking, while certainly bad for rolling resistance. It has a rare A/A/A rating on the stringent EU official tire label test.

I assume/hope that most of this technology is also in the all-season version found in USA/Canada.

The result is so good I would want another independent test of this and all season version, but so far anecdotal reports are that the all-season Hankook is excellent at everything except performance handling (it's a touring tire type).

 

[Dave EV]

Does that mean a 300 mi range became a 270 mi range when you replaced the MXM4 with these? Or 250 Wh/mi became 275? Or 10% of tire contribution to overall resistance (whatever it is, it doesn't increase with velocity squared)?

I'm only estimating, so either way. As I suggested, it's at least 10% worse for me. The difference seems to be bigger at higher speeds, probably because the tread is so chunky.

They do grip well in the rain and snow, though. Only limited time in the snow and I don't have much else to compare with, though. I honestly don't think I'd buy them again, though, without seriously looking for a more efficient alternative.

 

[rayrevolver]

Michelin Primacy MXM4 T1​	236Wh/mi​	​
Michelin CrossClimate2​	263Wh/mi​	​

From tirerack test:

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/testDisplay.jsp?ttid=298

I think that's 11% worse efficiency for their test for the CC2.

 

[DrChaos]

I honestly don't think I'd buy them again, though, without seriously looking for a more efficient alternative.

Hankook is making a 4 season version of their iON line, which looks like a clone of the Cross Climate in tread pattern. I think for Europe only so far.

https://www.hankooktire.com/us/en/company/media-center/media-detail.629429.html

It's unlikely it will be as efficient as a less snow-focused road tire like their evo/evo AS, there seems to be strong intrinsic physical tradeoffs. The flexing of high tread blocks contributes to lowering efficiency (which is why new tires are less efficient than moderately worn ones, and why the MXM4 Tesla comes with only 8/32" instead of 10/32", lowering its lifetime). But that seems necessary for snow and rain performance.

On the Hankook global site there is also an iON version of their winter icept tire (different from their regular icept winter), but haven't seen it in USA except here:

Buy Tires Online | Tirebuyer

Buy undefined undefined tires online. Wide range of undefined tires available. Fast, free delivery to a local expert installer near you.

www.tirebuyer.com

Note the code IW01. IH01 is the ion all seasons, IK01 the ion summer.

https://www.hankooktire.com/us/en/tirelist/vehicle/electric-vehicle.html

 

[DrChaos]

BTW a new Yokohama EV tire just released to US. It is UHP, so more of a competitor to Pirelli Elect I guess than the Hankook iON AS, and 55K mileage warranty. Tread depth starts at a very high 11/32". I bet not as efficient as MXM4s. The marketing message seem to be tuned more to long treadlife than low rolling resistance.

Yokohama Tire’s New ADVAN Sport® EV A/S Hits the U.S. Market

Yokohama Tire’s ADVAN Sport® EV A/S – an ultra high-performance all-season tire specifically designed for electric vehicles (EVs) – is now on sale in the U.S. Market SANTA ANA, CA – (Jan. 8, 2024) – Yokohama Tire’s ADVAN Sport® EV A/S – an ultra high-performance all-season tire specifically…

www.yokohamatire.com

 

[HyperionMark]

Have CrossClimates on our Model 3. I will attest that they are not great for efficiency. Pretty solid on occasional snow/ice though. Also, they are directional tires so you may lose just a bit of life by not being able to rotate them thoroughly.

 

[enemji]

One thing that's definitely true is that they have a thicker tread, 10/32" vs 8/32" on the factory MXM4 tire. The factory MXM has a lower tread to improve efficiency ratings, at the cost of longevity of course.

Given 790 revs is a standard, if the tread depth is more, it means the tire wall is thinner

 

[enemji]

Need new tires. Is the Primacy MXM4 still the most efficient all season tire? The two most important criteria for me are efficiency and noise? Also are all the Primacy's the same or do I have to ask for a Tesla spec to get the foam liner?

How about the 'MICHELIN Primacy™ Tour A/S tires'? I have them and loving them
MICHELIN Primacy™ Tour A/S tires

 

[enemji]

More like $1,280 installed for the Hankook Ion EVO AS at Discount Tire for my SR+ with 19” wheels. Or $1,450 installed for the O.E. Continental ProContacts.

I don’t think I’ve ever paid more than $130 per tire in my 27 years of driving. I guess there’s a first for everything

I have never paid less then 200/tire….

 

[enemji]

is hankook made in usa?

The Kinergy GT are stamped KR ie Made in Korea

 

[enemji]

some of the china comments were the dumbest *sugar* I’ve read in a while…. Given Michelin also produced tires in China and 26 other countries wtf did I just read

Reminds me of the Tv series Warrior where the Irish believe Chinese are worthless

 

[enemji]

There is a 235/45R18 94V in Energy Savers but one is "HON" and the other is 'LEX' for presumably Honda and Lexus.

Since all the other sizes are lower (15",16",17"), I suspect that it's internal construction doesn't handle as high loads as other lines of tires.

Tread looks similar to MXM4.

You can look up the specs on Tire Rack. Often times there is a max pressure difference which suggests different belts maybe used

 

[Msaman]

I am in the UK and got myself the Hankook Ion Evo summer. Better efficiency than worn out PS4 -214wh/m and the new Hankook at 210 and considerably quieter which was the main reason buying it. Grip in wet is superior to the PS4.
Next time will try the PZ4 at 68db.
I used to have Primacy on a 3 series BMW and at 20k miles they were like brand new ;*)