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Blog Musk Touts ‘Quantum Leap” in Full Self-Driving Performance

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A “quantum leap” improvement is coming to Tesla’s Autopilot software in six to 10 weeks, Chief Executive Elon Musk said a tweet.

Musk called the new software a “fundamental architectural rewrite, not an incremental tweak.”






Musk said his personal car is running a “bleeding edge alpha build” of the software, which he also mentioned during Tesla’s Q2 earnings. 

“So it’s almost getting to the point where I can go from my house to work with no interventions, despite going through construction and widely varying situations,” Musk said on the earnings call. “So this is why I am very confident about full self-driving functionality being complete by the end of this year, is because I’m literally driving it.”

Tesla’s Full Self-Driving software has been slow to roll out against the company’s promises. Musk previously said a Tesla would drive from Los Angeles to New York using the Full Self Driving feature by the end of 2019. The company didn’t meet that goal. So, it will be interesting to see the state of Autopilot at the end of 2020.

 
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Confidently figuring out which lane it's in (right or left turn only or straight, etc.) is crazy challenging IMO (even as humans sometimes).
Yeah, it's quite impressive, but I'm also interested in seeing if this is more of a behavior change on top of previous/current (2020.36.*) neural network detection or if the network improved in 2020.40.*. There's some more angled intersections here that Autopilot consistently gets wrong, but there's also some pretty complex situations that it gets right too.

I'm curious if the BMW implementation is actually doing relevancy or more of detecting multiple sets of traffic lights to fall back to just a display: "In a more complex intersection situation where, for example, different light signals apply to different lanes, a traffic light symbol is displayed in the instrument cluster." New BMW Urban Cruise Control recognizes traffic lights Anyone know where BMW owners might discuss this when it gets released?
 
This is huge. Every little update like this is a big deal. Essentially, Tesla is telling us that the car can confidently figure out which lane it's in, see the lights, and know which light applies to it.

Confidently figuring out which lane it's in (right or left turn only or straight, etc.) is crazy challenging IMO (even as humans sometimes).
And it follows their MO, release a bit, verify, remove restrictions iteratively, and do it again!
 
Makes sense, but even for simple features like staying within the lane, the Mobileye equipped cars are far behind Tesla.

Have you even tried looking up videos of other assistance? Supercruise 1, supercruise 2, VW Travel assist, propilot 2? Nio Pilot?

Why are you demanding others to provide info that you can easily access?

Travel assist for example

Great, show us some stress tests, like on a mountain road or something with sharper turns (there are 1000+ of these videos for AP)

and there are also 1000+ failed videos.
But here’s one stress test of Travel assist.

 
I'm curious if the BMW implementation is actually doing relevancy or more of detecting multiple sets of traffic lights to fall back to just a display: "In a more complex intersection situation where, for example, different light signals apply to different lanes, a traffic light symbol is displayed in the instrument cluster." New BMW Urban Cruise Control recognizes traffic lights Anyone know where BMW owners might discuss this when it gets released?

It is, eyeQ4 supports NN that outputs the relevancy of traffic light. That output is also crowdsourced and uploaded to Mobileye's REM HD map. However Its up to BMW to implement the control algorithm. I notice they didn't even include stop sign in this release.

You have to remember that these are old school traditional companies that still operate in old ways. For example, Although all cars produced from Q4 2018 had the same hardware and the same EyeQ4 chip. They only released their Driver Assistance 3D view that outputs what the EyeQ4 is seeing to post July 2019 models. However people on bimmerpost forums and the BMW community can easily code(hack) and turn on the feature. The feature exists in the software but is disabled.

This is the old way of forcing people to buy new MY year cars by excluding features from older cars although those older cars support it.

They are doing the same with traffic light recognition/response and urban cruise control. Its excluded from every car post july 2020. But actually you can code (hack) it on your 2018 car and turn it on. Infact the July 2020 software ALREADY has both features and people have turned it on since July on their 2018 cars. Its similar to how Verygreen turns stuff on that are disabled.

Here are some quotes

I've been using it for over 1k miles now and its really good, however it's not 100%. There are some complex scenarios where if there are multiple sets of lights, it will slow briefly for a set that has since changed to green if a subsequent set is on red. It's like it gets a little confused, but should be easily fixed and hopefully in i-step 11/2020.

From July 2020

- TLA is really good. It presents a red light 150 yards out, which you have to accept using the same button as used for the manual Speed Limit Assistant. It puts a tick and if the light stays Red then it slows to a complete stop. Once it changes to Green it resumes from stop/start and prompts to set off manually.
If you are closer to the light and it changes to amber (UK) and then Red, it stops automatically without having to accept.

TLA - love it. It only seems to need you to acknowledge the light in complex setups e.g. where there are multiple lights changing at different times. In simpler stop or go for all lanes scenarios it seems to stop automatically without driver input.
One scenario today - following a truck, the light was acknowledged and the truck went through at amber. The HUD displayed amber then red. i was a few metres from a the light, and the whole car lit up with flashing red lights and beeps, plus a very large red traffic light flashing. The car came to an abrupt but complete stop. Sweet.

I already have it on a MY19 but only via coding.

The interesting point about this press release is that they don't mention MY20 and earlier, implying it won't be made available to earlier models which sucks.

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Mobileye's REM HD Map

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i-step 07/2020.25 - new features including Traffic Light Assistant
 
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Man, you guys are hilarious. I can't find a single video or piece of evidence that these BMW traffic control systems have been deployed to consumers. All the videos or information I see is marketing and/or marketing demos.

I'd help a lot if you guys can provide videos of actual consumers showing off these features.

Based on these reviews not only was it available before Tesla.
It is ahead of Tesla because it doesn't require confirmation on green light to go through it nor confirmation to resume when light turns green. Its already ahead of Tesla and this review is based on the July build.
Who woulda thought of that?

- TLA is really good. It presents a red light 150 yards out, which you have to accept using the same button as used for the manual Speed Limit Assistant. It puts a tick and if the light stays Red then it slows to a complete stop. Once it changes to Green it resumes from stop/start and prompts to set off manually.
If you are closer to the light and it changes to amber (UK) and then Red, it stops automatically without having to accept.


TLA - love it. It only seems to need you to acknowledge the light in complex setups e.g. where there are multiple lights changing at different times. In simpler stop or go for all lanes scenarios it seems to stop automatically without driver input.
One scenario today - following a truck, the light was acknowledged and the truck went through at amber. The HUD displayed amber then red. i was a few metres from a the light, and the whole car lit up with flashing red lights and beeps, plus a very large red traffic light flashing. The car came to an abrupt but complete stop. Sweet.

Quick update. In certain 'simple' traffic light scenarios, the car will automatically stop for the red light, then when green will auto resume after a second or two. No input from the driver required.​
 
Based on these reviews not only was it available before Tesla.
It is ahead of Tesla because it doesn't require confirmation on green light to go through it nor confirmation to resume when light turns green. Its already ahead of Tesla and this review is based on the July build.
Who woulda thought of that?

It's not officially released yet (no press release, no articles, etc.). As for these people, I don't know who they are, where they're located, and how they're affiliated with BMW.

Again, feel free to provide some videos from actual consumers.

Edit: on further reading of that thread, it seems like these people are "hackers" / "tinkerers" installing different software versions on their BMW:

"Hi Ifr,

What software and the OBD2 connector needed for this coding?"

"Did you code the "no over taking at the left" - I don't get that option in the menus and can't find the codes anywhere to enable it. Its something my previous car (different make) had and was relatively useful, a gentle accelerator prod allowed you to pass.

I've added the lane change assist as that wasn't turned on either which works fine but as I'm still on a 2019/11 version of code I can't much else until I get the Nov update. TIA"

Edit edit: I find it sad that bladerskb is resorting to random msg board postings to make his case regarding traffic light features. Like I said, where's the official release article or any videos from consumers of the mfg release traffic control feature? Sadddddd

i-step 07/2020.25 - new features including Traffic Light Assistant
 
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How did you get the Assisted Driving View pictured in your original post? Did you code that yourself, or was it included in the iDrive update you mentioned?
Coded it myself.

In fact, I suspect mine was the first MY19 coded with ADV outside of BMW R&D
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i-step 07/2020.25 - new features including Traffic Light Assistant

Did bladerskb even read his on link? Here he is accusing me of being wrong all the time? So funny and sad

I don't know if bladerskb is an actual software engineer or not, but I do software and anyone in software knows that the last 20% of software takes 80% of the time. You can quickly build a piece of software to 80% completion, but the final polish and fixing of bugs takes the longest time. Like I said time and time again, there's a huge difference between "having" a feature and widely deploying it to consumers.

Ninety-ninety rule - Wikipedia
 
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How did you get the Assisted Driving View pictured in your original post? Did you code that yourself, or was it included in the iDrive update you mentioned?
Coded it myself.

In fact, I suspect mine was the first MY19 coded with ADV outside of BMW R&D
wink.gif


View attachment 595040

i-step 07/2020.25 - new features including Traffic Light Assistant

Did bladerskb even read his on link? Here he is accusing me of being wrong all the time? So funny and sad

I don't know if bladerskb is an actual software engineer or not, but I do software and anyone in software knows that the last 20% of software takes 80% of the time. You can quickly build a piece of software to 80% completion, but the final polish and fixing of bugs takes the longest time. Like I said time and time again, there's a huge difference between "having" a feature and widely deploying it to consumers.

Ninety-ninety rule - Wikipedia

@Bladerskb Did read his link.

I think you misunderstand. BMW has not yet issued the press release they will probably do that next month, they are waiting for the right time to announce it. The feature is going to unlock next month, without a software update. The software update went out in July.

So all of your talk about software completion and ninety-ninety rule is irrelevant, since the software is already finished.
 
I think you misunderstand. BMW has not yet issued the press release they will probably do that next month, they are waiting for the right time to announce it. The feature is going to unlock next month, without a software update. The software update went out in July.

Pleaseeee. Just let the dead horse die. BMW did NOT deploy this feature to consumers yet. Yes, maybe they are adding to their software updates to test it out somehow (like shadow mode), but it's clearly not activated yet. That's why you have these users "coding" it themselves.

Seriously, what kind of response of "BMW has not yet issued the press release they will probably do that next month, they are waiting for the right time to announce it."

This is BMW you're talking about. If they've actually deployed it, they're gonna make it known and widely publicized.

I'm done with this particular discussion. Anyone following it will see how desperate you guys have become.
 
Pleaseeee. Just let the dead horse die. BMW did NOT deploy this feature to consumers yet. Yes, maybe they are adding to their software updates to test it out somehow (like shadow mode), but it's clearly not activated yet. That's why you have these users "coding" it themselves.

Seriously, what kind of response of "BMW has not yet issued the press release they will probably do that next month, they are waiting for the right time to announce it."

This is BMW you're talking about. If they've actually deployed it, they're gonna make it known and widely publicized.

I'm done with this particular discussion. Anyone following it will see how desperate you guys have become.

You're right. I didn't say it was 'deployed/launched' yet. But they are pencils down on software development. It will be deployed next month and publicized then.
 
Rewatching Tesla's Full Self-Driving video from last year, looks like the visualizations were stitched together from multiple camera views. In this case, the curb seems to be drawn from the fisheye wide camera and the right repeater. The curb should be continuous and straight, but here and consistently throughout the video, adjacent curbs are rendered further away when the repeater camera sees it:

camera stitching.jpg


This should be something solved by the rewrite as the neural network outputs a single straight curb as it has been trained to predict reasonably shaped curbs instead of having software 1.0 stitch together individual views. And driving behavior built on top of a unified 3D view should indeed be a quantum leap better.
 
It's not officially released yet (no press release, no articles, etc.).

It will be officially released literally in 26 days.

As for these people, I don't know who they are, where they're located, and how they're affiliated with BMW.

Do you make the same comments when someone from this forum (TMC) or reddit or twitter leaks an upcoming feature? Ofcourse not.

Edit edit: I find it sad that bladerskb is resorting to random msg board postings to make his case regarding traffic light features. Like I said, where's the official release article or any videos from consumers of the mfg release traffic control feature? Sadddddd

It sad to see such bias. Again do you make the same statements when it comes to Tesla. Do you call leaks and discussion by verygreen and others on TMC or reddit, "random msg board postings"?

Did bladerskb even read his on link? Here he is accusing me of being wrong all the time? So funny and sad

You clearly did not understand what you are quoting. Your quote was talking about the Assisted Driving View feature which was released in 2019 for MY2020 cars but was excluded from MY2019 cars even though they have the exact same hardware (EyeQ4).

Hackers/Coders were able to enable it for MY2019 and gave everyone instructions on how to do it.
Why does BMW do that? because they want to FORCE you to buy a new model year car.

I don't know if bladerskb is an actual software engineer or not, but I do software and anyone in software knows that the last 20% of software takes 80% of the time. You can quickly build a piece of software to 80% completion, but the final polish and fixing of bugs takes the longest time. Like I said time and time again, there's a huge difference between "having" a feature and widely deploying it to consumers.

Ninety-ninety rule - Wikipedia
I'm glad you said that because TESLA is known to release half-baked software in "beta".

Therefore you can't just compare the official customer release date and claim one person is ahead of another, you have to compare feature maturity date. Look at the failure and mistake rate of traffic light recognition and then later stopping when it was first released. Or how bad and non functioning NOA was when it was first released in October 2018. It barely worked and was practically useless. So when for example NIO's Navigate on Pilot comes out in one week. You can't say they were 2 years late for example. You have to compare their version to the version of Tesla when it became matured and was actually functioning with sufficient success or great deal of success.

Based on NIO's CEO, NOP will be better than NOA


Pleaseeee. Just let the dead horse die. BMW did NOT deploy this feature to consumers yet. Yes, maybe they are adding to their software updates to test it out somehow (like shadow mode), but it's clearly not activated yet. That's why you have these users "coding" it themselves.

Maybe? Every single car from July 2020 has the software but its disabled.

I'm done with this particular discussion. Anyone following it will see how desperate you guys have become.

Desperate? Because your narrative has been debunked?
  • What if i told you that BMW had traffic light recognition released to customers before Tesla?
  • What if i told you that BMW had red light warning released officially to customers in 2019 before tesla?
  • What if i told you that BMW had traffic light, give way and stop signs warning released officially to customers before Tesla?

Yes they did. But just in some markets (EU). Fanfare or hype doesn't mean progress or leadership. People confuse the marketing that elon/tesla does about AP to mean that they are ahead. This is absolutely not true as have been proven.

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It will be officially released literally in 26 days.
  • What if i told you that BMW had traffic light recognition released to customers before Tesla?
  • What if i told you that BMW had red light warning released officially to customers in 2019 before tesla?
  • What if i told you that BMW had traffic light, give way and stop signs warning released officially to customers before Tesla?

Not only that but as you posted earlier, they actually have options that lets you customize the behavior. In Tesla's AP, it's all or nothing. Want adaptive cruise control? Then you will get all the ghost braking caused by other features that are not enabled, but still active as well. Want dumb cruise control? Sorry you can't...
 
In 2020.36.11 (with HW3 and FSD), AP can see crosswalks and stop for pedestrians.


What worries me about this sort of thing is that it lulls the driver into a false sense of security. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. Until it's 99.99999% reliable it's dangerous.

We need a phrase for this. It's like the uncanny valley, as you get close to perfection it gets more dangerous until you reach extremely high reliability and it's safe again.
 
What worries me about this sort of thing is that it lulls the driver into a false sense of security. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. Until it's 99.99999% reliable it's dangerous.

We need a phrase for this. It's like the uncanny valley, as you get close to perfection it gets more dangerous until you reach extremely high reliability and it's safe again.

Disagree. Drivers currently hit pedestrians and bicyclists all the time. Don't have any numbers but my take is that when when it gets provably better than people currently are, I'm all for it.
 
Disagree. Drivers currently hit pedestrians and bicyclists all the time. Don't have any numbers but my take is that when when it gets provably better than people currently are, I'm all for it.

Just because drivers are bad and hit pedestrians, does not mean it is ok for autonomous cars to hit pedestrians too. I think the standard should be a lot higher than that. A L5 autonomous car should have enough sensors to always detect pedestrians and cyclists all the time and in all conditions. And autonomous cars never gets distracted or tired. Also, autonomous cars should have the proper algorithms to anticipate the future behavior and path of pedestrians and cyclists. Lastly, autonomous cars should have the proper driving policy to drive conservatively around pedestrians and cyclists and give them plenty of space. So autonomous cars should be a lot better than humans at not hitting pedestrians or cyclists. It should be extremely rare for an autonomous car to hit a pedestrian or cyclist.