Opinion: FSD, Why you should not buy it.

[tvad]

It says that Tesla hopes that by raising the price they will lure people in to buy, out of a fear that the price will continue to rise.

A powerful force FOMO is, Young Luke.

 

[linux-works]

Or you could just wait for flying cars.

funny, I see job postings for 'kitty hawk' (flying car company in my neck of the woods) all the time. gee, I wonder if they can self-drive? lol

 

[huangm777]

I’m just waiting for when FSD features can be bought a la carte. Out of the current set the only thing I really want is auto lane change. I mildly want NoA, and don’t care at all about the rest.

I’d appreciate the auto park if I still lived where I once did without a garage and had to parallel park on the street. I suck at it and my previous Prius Prime’s ability to auto parallel park really did come in handy. But if I was in that situation I wouldn’t have bought a Tesla, so...

I have no use for Summon at all.

For me auto lane change would be worth it at $1k, NoA for $2k. I probably wouldn’t buy it if it was much more than that.

 

[dave999z]

When I bought my car in 2018 there was no basic autopilot, it was EAP for $5k or nothing. So without paying $5k you didn’t even get TACC much less auto steer. So I forked over the $5k.

Then during the sale last spring I paid another $2k for FSD. Decided to do that mostly to get the HW3 chip, which I think will improve the performance of all autopilot features.

If I were buying today, and the car came with basic autopilot already and already has the HW3 chip, there is no way I would buy FSD. Forget $7k for it, I wouldn’t pay more than about $3k. In my opinion, auto park is way too slow to utilize in a realistic situation when a car is behind you and you need to parallel park quickly. Summon is a gimmick. Automatic lane changes without confirmation in NoA mode is terrifying. The Model 3 will never be fully autonomous (at least in the next 5 years) — there’s just no way it’ll handle edge cases such that it will ever be legal. Thus, it will not drive me home from the bar with me passed out in the back, nor generate revenue as a taxi while I’m not using it (not that I want randoms riding around in my car unsupervised doing god knows what in it). So all you really get with FSD that’s actually useful is the ability to change lanes with auto steer engaged by just using your blinker. Yes that’s nice. It’s not worth thousands of dollars. Hopefully they’ll roll out more useful features soon, but I wouldn’t purchase it based only on that hope.

I kind of think Tesla is on the wrong track with its approach to FSD. 90% of my driving is the same exact route to work and back. I should be able to program that in, including where all the stop signs and stop lights are (it should take images of it and let you show it where the actual light is, kind of like the way you draw in motion detection zones on a home camera), and which lane I want to be in at different points, and what path to follow on off ramps when the lanes widen and it gets confused, and what speed to set at various points. Sure it’d be great for the car to perform well in any environment/route just using its sensors and neural net processing. But that’s not how I and most people drive.

 

[LongRanger]

It’s a good thing that there are posts on features that may or may not be fully developed, or even worth the money. Tesla won’t be immune to getting something wrong.

Turning the features into individually-priced software updates (for example the £2k performance upgrade) could be a more balanced model for the future.

I’m not sure I want fully autonomous cars, I enjoy driving too much and don’t really want to give the authorities more excuses to have us all in huge convoys at 50mph on all major routes.

Would prefer to see Tesla concentrate on range, handling, ride quality and build quality - plus their USP of menu-Selectable OTA updates/upgrades. FSD may not be necessary for them to remain an innovator long term. It’s also unlikely to be faster/more accurate than a switched-on driver, and from my point of view I don’t really want a computer deciding when to switch lanes for me, it is a constant variable based on my interpretation of road conditions - something a computer needs rules for and road situations don’t always follow rules.

I’ve just done 22k miles in a large BMW before selling it ready for the Model 3, and it’s “autonomous driving” with auto lane change and lane keeping was bloody awful. Like being chucked down a bowling alley. When I test drove the M3 with standard autopilot it was pretty similar for lane keeping and phantom braking was downright terrifying, so even more autonomy is not for me - but it’s just an opinion.

FSD will work for some/many folks but it’s OK to not want it....

 

[azred]

Definitely get autopilot. Buy FSD only if you will own the exact same car for at least 4 years. If there is any chance that you will trade or sell the car in 2 years then don't get FSD, it's too expensive. Look back at the last few cars you owned, did you keep them for 4+ years? Very useful FSD features will definitely be here in 3 years. Possibly much sooner. FSD was $6K before, now it's $7K. What does that say?

It says your research is selective. I think I paid $2000 during the sale a year or so ago. I think Musk later expressed regret but Tesla likes so called demand levers.

 

[vinnie97]

$8K for EAP/FSD in 2018 was one of the more idiotic purchasing decisions I've ever made. FOMO got me good. I shudder to think if I'd fallen for the max $13K screw job a few years prior to that.

 

[jimmym1981]

I am in the same position about FSD as most are. We have our AWD Y locked in with the only upgrade being 6K FSD for 58K. I’m the tech guy in the family and the wife is the speed gal (lucky me.) I want FSD so bad, but only because the promise of it, but also FOMO of it going to 8-10K in the future. Me and the wife's argument is I can edit my order and get a full P for just 3.9K more and then add on FSD later.

To me, I understand that you are paying for the development and testing of FSD by purchasing it now. What I just cant seem to get past is all of the people that bough it in 2016+ that still do not have it, but at that time “It was coming really soon.” Yes, some are OK with the current features for 6K and some think its was a terrible decision. To each their own I guess.

I think and know Tesla will have it down sooner than later, but I also wonder who else will as well. My current Volvo has Pilot Assist II and I think its amazing, the auto-park being one thing that I just cannot fathom how Tesla hasn’t done it yet. It handles the interstate pretty good, but parks 100% of the time perfect. If Volvo can get this down with just 1 camera, Tesla should be able to do it even better.

The more and more I see the common consensus that “its just not worth it right now” the more I want to drop it and make the wife happy. LOL

 

[jfinephilly]

I am in the same position about FSD as most are. We have our AWD Y locked in with the only upgrade being 6K FSD for 58K. I’m the tech guy in the family and the wife is the speed gal (lucky me.) I want FSD so bad, but only because the promise of it, but also FOMO of it going to 8-10K in the future. Me and the wife's argument is I can edit my order and get a full P for just 3.9K more and then add on FSD later.

To me, I understand that you are paying for the development and testing of FSD by purchasing it now. What I just cant seem to get past is all of the people that bough it in 2016+ that still do not have it, but at that time “It was coming really soon.” Yes, some are OK with the current features for 6K and some think its was a terrible decision. To each their own I guess.

I think and know Tesla will have it down sooner than later, but I also wonder who else will as well. My current Volvo has Pilot Assist II and I think its amazing, the auto-park being one thing that I just cannot fathom how Tesla hasn’t done it yet. It handles the interstate pretty good, but parks 100% of the time perfect. If Volvo can get this down with just 1 camera, Tesla should be able to do it even better.

The more and more I see the common consensus that “its just not worth it right now” the more I want to drop it and make the wife happy. LOL

Make the wife happy now. Take the $7k and put it in an index fund. In 2-3 years or whenever Tesla figures out what “soon” means you can divest and that can probably get you to $8kish after 2-3 years. If you were willing to dump that cash into an incomplete technology now I would assume you won’t be hurting if those funds were slightly less liquid.

When we bought our LR AWD 3 in December we didn’t give FSD a moment’s thought. Given the current technology and the historical lack of improvement despite increases in cost it just seemed like a foolish splurge. But that is a decision out of pure self interest. If you are down with using your excess funds to help fund the technology that your vehicle may never fully utilize you are a better person than me.

 

[linux-works]

reading one of the other threads, where a 2nd hand car buyer received a car with fsd at purchase, then tesla 'noticed it' and stripped it, POST SALE, and now he's left hanging.

this tells me that FSD is an expense, not an investment. if you sell your car with fsd, expect it to be STRIPPED, no matter how you sell your car. if the owner changes, tesla in their total lack of wisdom is pissing off customers left and right with this bad behavior.

I'm very unmotivated to spend a single dollar more with tesla, if I'm not able to retain *some* value from the purchased options (even software based options) at resale time.

tesla, you really expect people to pay $7k and then LOSE IT when the car gets transferred to another buyer?

stupidest thing I've heard of in a long time.

 

[LongRanger]

I hadn’t realised the car doesn't stay with it’s “factory” software spec when sold. That is not great business sense from a customer trust point of view if really the case.

Monthly subscription then becomes a real opportunity for Tesla in the future. I.e. you rent what features you would like the car to have - like renting cloud services etc.

 

[jfinephilly]

reading one of the other threads, where a 2nd hand car buyer received a car with fsd at purchase, then tesla 'noticed it' and stripped it, POST SALE, and now he's left hanging.

this tells me that FSD is an expense, not an investment. if you sell your car with fsd, expect it to be STRIPPED, no matter how you sell your car. if the owner changes, tesla in their total lack of wisdom is pissing off customers left and right with this bad behavior.

I'm very unmotivated to spend a single dollar more with tesla, if I'm not able to retain *some* value from the purchased options (even software based options) at resale time.

tesla, you really expect people to pay $7k and then LOSE IT when the car gets transferred to another buyer?

stupidest thing I've heard of in a long time.

Considering Tesla doesn’t prove terms snd conditions for the purchase does anyone know if this is legal? As an aside, I find Tesla’s lack of transparency to be baffling given it’s a publicly traded entity.

 

[linux-works]

see this long thread:

Tesla YANKED FSDC option without notice - Class Action lawsuit? Any Lawyers here?

 

[tvad]

Monthly subscription then becomes a real opportunity for Tesla in the future. I.e. you rent what features you would like the car to have - like renting cloud services etc.

Jeebus, that's all we need. More monthly subscriptions.

 

[Kevy Baby]

TACC and Autosteer is already fraught with errors now, so there's no way I'd pay today for something that promises to work tomorrow.

Wow is this wrong. Both of those technologies pretty damned good. I use AP on a daily basis with nary a problem as do many others. Is it perfect? No, but it safe and reliable.

 

[jimmym1981]

Make the wife happy now. Take the $7k and put it in an index fund. In 2-3 years or whenever Tesla figures out what “soon” means you can divest and that can probably get you to $8kish after 2-3 years. If you were willing to dump that cash into an incomplete technology now I would assume you won’t be hurting if those funds were slightly less liquid.

When we bought our LR AWD 3 in December we didn’t give FSD a moment’s thought. Given the current technology and the historical lack of improvement despite increases in cost it just seemed like a foolish splurge. But that is a decision out of pure self interest. If you are down with using your excess funds to help fund the technology that your vehicle may never fully utilize you are a better person than me.

Pretty much just sealed the deal with my decision and you bring up a great point about using the money go make money and buy it later, essentially at the same cost with profit made.

 

[daniel]

funny, I see job postings for 'kitty hawk' (flying car company in my neck of the woods) all the time. gee, I wonder if they can self-drive? lol

So-called "flying cars" would be either airplanes or helicopters. The term "flying car" is useless. None of the "flying car" concepts could actually be driven on the road, so they're just airplanes or helicopters. And as such, either you need a pilot's license to fly them, which puts them out of reach of the supposed market, or they'd have to be autonomous.

When I bought my car in 2018 there was no basic autopilot, it was EAP for $5k or nothing. So without paying $5k you didn’t even get TACC much less auto steer. So I forked over the $5k.

Same here. I mostly wanted TACC, but soon fell in love with autosteer as well. I've never regretted my purchase of EAP.

To me, I understand that you are paying for the development and testing of FSD by purchasing it now.

I'll be happy to help finance Tesla's work on FSD. Float a bond issue with a good interest rate and I'm in! I already own some TSLA so if owning their stock helps them then I'm doing that. And I own some Solar Bonds, which is now Tesla, so I'm helping them there. But I'm not buying something that doesn't exist.

 

[dave999z]

reading one of the other threads, where a 2nd hand car buyer received a car with fsd at purchase, then tesla 'noticed it' and stripped it, POST SALE, and now he's left hanging.

this tells me that FSD is an expense, not an investment. if you sell your car with fsd, expect it to be STRIPPED, no matter how you sell your car. if the owner changes, tesla in their total lack of wisdom is pissing off customers left and right with this bad behavior.

That is not what happened in those examples, so please be careful spreading this.

If you buy FSD from Tesla and sell your car, it will not be stripped from the new buyer. Have you seen any example of this?

The examples from that thread are cars that mistakenly had FSD. If you have FSD by mistake and never paid for it, then sell someone your car representing that it has FSD and don’t mention oh by the way you never actually paid for FSD, that’s your misrepresentation, not Tesla’s. The other examples are a little weirder, where Tesla sells demo or trade in vehicles at auction to a dealer, did not represent that they had FSD (so the dealer did not think they were paying for it as part of the price), but Tesla didn’t actually disable the software yet, then the dealer sells it as a car that has FSD, then Tesla strips it. Again that’s the dealer’s misrepresentation (trying to resell something they didn’t pay for).

If you buy a used Tesla that you understand has FSD, make sure you see FSD on the sticker or get it in writing from the seller.

But you do not have to worry that if you buy FSD and sell your car the FSD will disappear so all the value is out the window. That just doesn’t happen. It’s a transferable license that conveys with the car. But you do have to have bought the license in the first place.

 

[LowlyOilBurner]

I ordered my Y with FSD. I also spent $3,200.00 on the Bowers & Wilkins Soundsystem in my XC60. I think the $6k on FSD might be a better waste of money than a fancy stereo. Albeit, that Bowers & Wilkins system does sound excellent, but it doesn’t get better with software updates. At least AP/FSD could.

 

[holmgang]

Wow is this wrong. Both of those technologies pretty damned good. I use AP on a daily basis with nary a problem as do many others. Is it perfect? No, but it safe and reliable.

Brake-checking someone behind when TACC dramatically drops from 90mph to 50mph because the mapping engine suddenly has no speed-limit data is not safe. Or reliable.