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PG&E EV2A rate went up by 20% March 1
- Thread starter sorka
- Start date
I was thinking driving this morning about an EV. So challenge for someone. Put together a cost list comparing a new EV, average cost, not the cheapest, to my 100% paid off ice car. I drive like 200 miles a month, but make it 1000 miles a month. Put down ALL the cost for each, purchase price, insurance, cost to install a level 2 charger, etc. And lets so the real ROI for an EV.
My brother in law did one of those Fiat 500 $99 / month leases and got onto EV2A. He was saving something like $200 / month on his PG&E bill even with the charging so he basically got the car free for 3 years and a lower PG&E bill. I doubt that scenario can be replicated now with the cost of gasoline and the skyrocketing prices of cars.
Again, for all those folks who say NOW, it saves lots of money, bring on the numbers. And I already have way more solar than I need, so basically the electricty if 100% free. But, I hardly drive anywhere.
thats not the right analysis. No new car has an ROI compared to driving a paid off car. The comparison is if you need (want) to buy a new car, compare the lifetime cost of EV that meets your needs to ICE that meets your needs.
Fuggetaboutit. E-9A Summer Off-Peak Baseline was $0.03855/kWh total rate in Jan 2014. We also got $0.31083/kWh for Summer solar during Peak that started at 2pm! Aaah. Those were the days...
But this is NOT what I read from folks! But, you are 100% right.
Now, when I do go to buy a new car, it will be another ICE mini van. I have to have the room and distance for that car. May cost more, but if something does not meet my needs, who cares.
aesculus
Still Trying to Figure This All Out
I was on E7 then and much the same but only peak (12-6) and off peak. The goal then was to keep you in the 101%-130% of usage. So I just put enough solar to make sure it brought my monthly usage into that range.
Who are you reading that is explaining an EV purchase as an incremental decision versus a paid off car? By that token, you'd never buy a new ICE car because the paid off ICE car is cheaper than the potential new ICE car.
Your comments about lack of interior space and "midget design" seem more for shock value. They don't seem representative of you having gone out of your way to test vehicles. Have you driven an Audi e-tron or Pacifica plug-In? Go check out a T8 Volvo XC90; there's no way that car is "too small". There are a lot of emergent options out there. The government shouldn't have to hand you money for you to have EV's enter your short list of considered vehicles.
Most people buy new cars to get access to something that is more reliable, safer, better on the environment, or just having the latest tech/jonses. Since you seem to be exclusively a minivan buyer, maybe an EV isn't right for you at this time if the Pacifica doesn't get you excited. But there are more and more coming out as the industry shifts.
As a completely tangential topic, since you have paid off your car, you should consider depositing a fixed monthly savings stream into some brokerage/savings account in anticipation of a future car purchase. Assuming you will eventually be in the market to replace that mini van of yours that has a solar panel on the roof, save what you can now, and then use that savings to buy your desired new whip when the time comes. And when the time comes, go weigh some options and do your math between those future possible purchases.
Pacifica quality reviews I have read are very poor, so yep look at it.
For me, adding dealing with charging, range is just a non starter!!!!!!!! IMO, i just do not see EV's being the solution for the future! Charging, is just not going to work for masses.
Was interesting was at the hospital today, and I see bunch of Tesla's. 4 are hooked up for charging, but the 5th had no space. Now, if they assumed they could plug in, and cannot, now what do they do? No thanks!!
Is your hospital over 150 miles from your house?
Those people were probably just trying to sneak in some free suds on the hospital's dime. You already got your SGIP batteries and mega-solar at home bruh.
Merrill
Merrill
I’m very surprised that you think this way being on this forum, first of all why would you want to support the fossil fuel industry. Second is that charging is easy, most of it you do at home. Third believe it or not you would be helping the environment. Fourth if you look at the 10 year cost of ownership you save money.
EVs are not for everyone. As a commute car they are great. As a trip car not so much. But most households have 2 cars. We've had 2 EVs, but without one now as we turned it in from lease. No commute right now, so no compelling reason to get another one now. Main car is a hybrid anyway (Acura MDX Hybrid). When we had the EV, it was the commute car and there was never any range issue. My wife had a consulting business in the Bay Area and there was no where she could not go because she would need to charge before returning home. It was refreshing never to have to go to a gas station. Plugging in at home took 1 minute. No oil changes, no plug changes, no fluid changes, no hose changes. Brakes never need replacing. Its a huge difference that you don't realize until you own one. The only maintenance we had was software updates.
Yes, that's what I meant by loadshifting peaks, EV2-A is the obvious choice for Powerwall users, nuff said! Question is, for a rate that purported benefits EV users in some way, is it actually cheaper for EV users or anyone not using paired storage.
Well, I guess I figured I'd do the calcs for my own. What I was missing is that if I drove a lot more miles, the added EV usage eventually pushes E-TOU-C out of the baseline, so incremental off-peak charging on EV2 goes from being only $0.04-0.09 cheaper to being $0.13-0.18 cheaper per kwh. At the bare minimum I'd need about 2500 kwh more EV charging, or about 10,000 miles of Tesla driving, per year for EV2 to start making economic sense.
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
Getting way off topic but…
FWIW we love our Pacifica Hybrid. It’s a total champ and given our duty cycle of mostly around town driving and charging at home we usually get ~1500 miles to a tank of actual gasoline.
Seems ideal for your use case of having lots of extra solar generation to potentially stuff somewhere vs selling back to PGE for essentially nothing, but also the convenience of a regular ICE for when you just don’t want to deal with EV charging.
1 BEV + 1 PHEV is the holy grail for us. Reduces our gasoline consumption by ~90% while maintaining all of the benefits of the “get in and drive” ICE mentality when we want.
Were the Tesla's really in need of charging?? Probably not and just taking advantage of free or very low subsidized rate at hospital with typical short time limit (eg 4hr max). Too much hassle for what it is worth.
Been driving Tesla EV for 8 years...straight away cost of charge vs gas has always been cheaper on the EV side when comparisons with similar high performance cars. My prior ICEs were getting like 11 MPG, and would even pony up for the 110 race gas at $9/g when was normally 1/3 that cost for premium unleaded. Not exactly apples to apples, but when I switched to EV... purely gas vs EV charge difference was about $400 month in my pocket going about 10k miles per year (not calculating the race gas $$). Different $$ now with PGE compared to LADWP, but still significantly cheaper.
What no one mentioned above is the difference in routine service charges for that ICE vs EV.
Again, type of cars used for comparison matter...but with performance ICEs, could easily spend few thousand a year for routine tune-ups, oil changes, brake pads / rotors. In past 8 years, spent less than $500 total in "routine" service for the 2 Teslas and never had to replace brake pads prematurely (with regenerative breaking...brakes last long time unless tracking the car). Knock on wood...never been stranded on side of the road due to engine failure (?yet)...unlike my experience with ICEs over the prior decade.
Much more detail in other parts of TMC forum to go thru other than just the solar
In the last 10 years, I probably spent 1000 on tires, oil change and one gas injector. Insurance dirt cheap. Keep digging.
