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Phantom braking without self-driving features?
- Thread starter VoltWagon
- Start date
zoomer0056
Active Member
Be careful in TACC mode when you pass the car ahead that has just turned off into a side road. It tagged me for a collision warning and torpedoed my near-perfect safety score. This matters bc it added about $4 to my Tesla insurance premium!
zoomer0056
Active Member
FirstInTown
Member
Interesting question. I'm going to say way reduced for us. But don't drive as many miles in the dark as daytime. Others notice less in the dark?
We just did our first road trip in our 23 MY, 3rd time using cruise control, and 10 mins in it slammed on the brakes at 80mph down to 40 in maybe 1s before I heavily accelerated back to speed as I had just overtaken a truck and trailer moments before and he was in the back of my mind. Luckily there was about 3s of space left. I'm sure the trucker was wondering wtf just happened. Wife is deathy afraid of this vehicle and asked me at least 6 times if it's going to do that even w/o cruise.
Because of the misinformation found in the forum here, I thought phantom braking only affected autopilot. Those people spreading this information have no idea what they're talking about and should just delete their posts.
Because of the misinformation found in the forum here, I thought phantom braking only affected autopilot. Those people spreading this information have no idea what they're talking about and should just delete their posts.
smogne41
Active Member
TACC is just Autopilot with the auto-steer turned off. It will PB exactly the same. Just to clarify though, your PB events were with TACC (cruise control) enabled, correct?
zoomer0056
Active Member
Autopilot is a set of features. Two of those features are Traffic Aware Cruise Control (TACC) and Autosteer. If TACC is on, then Autopilot is on. Here is a snippet from the 2022+ owners manual.
Someone proves me wrong but after a few researches I get that Tesla does not have "normal dummy" cruise control - means only do speed controlling for you. It's actually TACC (Traffic Aware Cruise Control), means that it can make braking/accelerate decisions based on the traffic around you which sucks, cause yes, PB can happen when you're on cruise control only, not Autopilot/Autosteer/FSD. I learned it my hard way too. My partner used to work in self driving car company that was backed by GM, they compete with Waymo. We don't understand why people are very comfortable trying Tesla's FSD beta features, we just can't. Thinking that with cruise control and Tesla cars can still have random mistake then what can happen with FSD? Don't get me wrong, I still like the car but I'm not at the point where I can completely trust their technology.
zoomer0056
Active Member
Yes, TACC and Autosteer are features of Autopilot. If you've set Autopilot to engage only TACC, the car can react with PB.
Yeah I mean there is no option to even opt out TACC, like I just want dumb cruise control just like the one on other cars, do I understand correctly?
alstoralset
Man from another place
I briefly enabled the FSD trial back in 2018, and became an ex-user after getting flipped off due to phantom braking. Best I can tell, there have been no significant improvements with TACC wrt PB over the last 5 years.
It is absurd that the option to enable "dumb" cruise control is not available. It works just fine on my 2018 M3 - much easier to use than typical cruise control IMO since you can use the jogwheel to dial in the target speed. I have not purchased AP/EAP for this reason.
It is absurd that the option to enable "dumb" cruise control is not available. It works just fine on my 2018 M3 - much easier to use than typical cruise control IMO since you can use the jogwheel to dial in the target speed. I have not purchased AP/EAP for this reason.
zoomer0056
Active Member
That's right, no plain cruise control like ICE cars.
I must say basic Autopilot is ONLY for controlled access roads, meaning highways. TACC works great for stop and go traffic like in congested Los Angeles highways.
I said autopilot when I meant FSD, but yes I see on the manual it defines TACC under AP.
I'm thankful we didn't drive the Y on our last trip just a couple months prior on the same route b/c we had snow and ice. That'd be a quick and shitty way to end it all
I feel like a lab rat seeing that TACC is listed as a beta feature in the manual after experiencing this. If that's the case there should be a warning you have to accept when enabling TACC that says Vehicle can unexpectedly and aggressively enable the brakes whether or not there is a real immediate danger and I can and will send your luggage, your snacks, drinks, and any pets hurling towards the front seats
They need to add an option to set the cruise mode when not using any other auto driving features since this problem has been ongoing for many years already
I'm thankful we didn't drive the Y on our last trip just a couple months prior on the same route b/c we had snow and ice. That'd be a quick and shitty way to end it all
I feel like a lab rat seeing that TACC is listed as a beta feature in the manual after experiencing this. If that's the case there should be a warning you have to accept when enabling TACC that says Vehicle can unexpectedly and aggressively enable the brakes whether or not there is a real immediate danger and I can and will send your luggage, your snacks, drinks, and any pets hurling towards the front seats
They need to add an option to set the cruise mode when not using any other auto driving features since this problem has been ongoing for many years already
smogne41
Active Member
That is correct, if you have AP (standard on all Teslas made in the last few years) you ONLY have TACC as a cruise control option. Before some time in 2019 (I think) Autopilot was $2k option, and if you did not option it you go a (fantastic) dumb cruise control. But if you 'upgraded' to AP later you forever lost the dumb option. I am forever grateful that I did not option AP when I bought the car, because I really like the dumb one that Tesla provided.
Especially frustrating since there is a basic 'dumb' cruise control already coded into the software, they just don't give you a way to access it. If you have AP, you are lock out from it.
Yes. I picked up my car 5 hours away from my house and drove it back at night. Happened twice on the 5 hour drive home. One was enough to notice and the 2nd one was an attention getter. The 2nd one scared the *sugar* out of me and my passenger. Both happened on a straight away with no traffic.
It happens to me randomly. The most recent was driving to work again on a straight away with a car following me. I felt bad for the car following me because my Tesla decided it was time to brake check them. Pushed on accelerator to stop the hard brake hoping to get through what ever it 'saw' that wasn't there to brake for and it didn't want to resume. I had to turn AP (I have EAP but wasn't using it) off and drive a few miles with it off.
Another annoyance is if a car turns through your lane and is at the right distance the car will hard brake to avoid hitting them even if the car is well gone out of your lane. I'm talking a car 75-100yards maybe? Car passes through the lane in 1/2 second and is gone. Tesla see's the car a full second later and hard brakes to avoid that car. I just push the accelerator to override and let it resume. I'm getting more and more used to that but still an annoyance.
