Garlan Garner
Banned
Ahhh... I see.
You are extremely fortunate to be able to pay cash for an MS. I always wondered what it would be like to be able to do such a thing.
Good for you.
-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
random chitchat
- Thread starter AnOutsider
- Start date
-
- Tags
- Off Topic
- Status
You are extremely fortunate to be able to pay cash for an MS. I always wondered what it would be like to be able to do such a thing.
Good for you.
Really? Either you are ignorant of how much money most people make and how they live and are out of touch with most of society, or you know and are just being a douche. Not sure which is better.
Garlan Garner
Banned
I didn't want to say it.....glad you did.
You are right. I really don’t care what other people make or how they live. The fact that I can pay cash for a Tesla Model S, or most any car for that matter, is really nobody's business. That's not the issue. To assume anyone here is financing a Tesla is stupid. Many, many here can pay cash for a Model S. I think there are a lot of people here that maybe have their priorities mixed up. A smart person doesn't buy a new car that costs 3-5 times the price of an average car ($33,560) and also have a mortgage (let alone 2nd or 3rd loan against it), and probably finance the purchase. If they can afford more than the average price of a car, they must be doing alright, especially if they're going to "load" the car with options. Let's see? I believe it was "Ludicrous" all the way.
A few here know nothing about working hard, saving money, investing, or financing. One has to be a "douche" as you say to have a car loan that approaches one's mortgage payment. If you don't have six months to a year’s worth of salary in the bank account to ride out the next recession, potential layoff, and nothing for savings or retirement, you have no business buying an $80+ car and you are probably also a “douche”. However, do as you will.
Early in life, I lived in poor neighborhoods, struggled to put myself through college and held down a full-time job at the same time. When I was putting myself through college, most in my neighborhood rented their apartments or houses but always had a new car in the driveway and the largest 20” color TV in their crappy 9’X10’ den. A new car was more important than having a home you owned, were paying for, saving for the future or retirement. At the time, I owned a "beater" car that I also paid for with "cash". Nothing was given to me. I had to work for it.
After almost 50 years, I have no wants and no worries about living out my life or having most whatever I want, and I still pay cash for my cars. Don’t take my response personally. It’s all about business, being smart and NOT being a “douche”.
Genshi
Member
Okay a few things guys...
A: I'm not a moderator but calling people douches is just out of line. So Shark was able to pay cash for a car - we don't know his circumstances so calling him an ass for having money is totally out of line. And that's coming from a guy who's in debt and has a LOT of concern about the income gap.
B: Shark isn't wrong about priorities and judgment and taking on a high dollar car loan on top of a mortgage or debt. It sucks that I can't buy a Model S, but at the same time that's not Sharkbait's fault. And he doesn't owe anyone an apology or explanation for the why/how he has been able to.
C: The model S, and the model ≡ aren't affordable for some people - and they likely never will be. At least not in our lifetime. Regardless of how they're both defined in the US market, they are both - to a large majority of the world population - Luxury items and always will be. To treat them as anything more than a luxury is a disservice. In 5 years, there may be cheaper and more accessible BEV's, but for now they simply aren't there yet. Unless you leased a spark when they were still selling as compliance cars and managed to snag one of those $100/month leases. Or you bought a used Leaf for ~$6-10k or something.
D: Lighten the heck up here... we're talking about a pie-in-the-sky prediction by Tesla to be able to crank out 500k cars per year by the end of 2018. If they pull it off, that'll be unprecedented in the history of automobile manufacturing. For that reason alone, a healthy dose of skepticism IS warranted. I'm all for them hitting that goal, and I'll be happy if they even make it to 400k/year. But let's take a step back and realize that we're just flinging darts at the board right now. Just because someone else's opinion differs from yours doesn't make them either wrong or stupid. It just means they're weighing the many, many, many, many variables differently than you are.
A: I'm not a moderator but calling people douches is just out of line. So Shark was able to pay cash for a car - we don't know his circumstances so calling him an ass for having money is totally out of line. And that's coming from a guy who's in debt and has a LOT of concern about the income gap.
B: Shark isn't wrong about priorities and judgment and taking on a high dollar car loan on top of a mortgage or debt. It sucks that I can't buy a Model S, but at the same time that's not Sharkbait's fault. And he doesn't owe anyone an apology or explanation for the why/how he has been able to.
C: The model S, and the model ≡ aren't affordable for some people - and they likely never will be. At least not in our lifetime. Regardless of how they're both defined in the US market, they are both - to a large majority of the world population - Luxury items and always will be. To treat them as anything more than a luxury is a disservice. In 5 years, there may be cheaper and more accessible BEV's, but for now they simply aren't there yet. Unless you leased a spark when they were still selling as compliance cars and managed to snag one of those $100/month leases. Or you bought a used Leaf for ~$6-10k or something.
D: Lighten the heck up here... we're talking about a pie-in-the-sky prediction by Tesla to be able to crank out 500k cars per year by the end of 2018. If they pull it off, that'll be unprecedented in the history of automobile manufacturing. For that reason alone, a healthy dose of skepticism IS warranted. I'm all for them hitting that goal, and I'll be happy if they even make it to 400k/year. But let's take a step back and realize that we're just flinging darts at the board right now. Just because someone else's opinion differs from yours doesn't make them either wrong or stupid. It just means they're weighing the many, many, many, many variables differently than you are.
Garlan Garner
Banned
Well, maybe the name was out of line, and it certainly wasn't directed at sharkbait because they have the money to buy an S in cash. I said that in response to them basically saying "Huh? Have a mortgage? Why? And why would you finance a car? People do that still? Just pay in cash, so much easier that way."
It wasn't because they have the money, it was because of their attitude towards people that have less money. Not all people that are rich are that way because they are smart, and not all poor people are that way because they are stupid or were wasteful. Income inequality is and will continue to be a serious problem in this country, and appearing to have this attitude that all poor people are stupid and should have just made better choices like all the rich people have, is not helping the problem.
No, I'm not advocating everyone spend too much on a car and a house and be way over their head in debt, but there is a huge gap between that and owning a house without a mortgage and buying a car in cash. There are plenty of people who can have a sensible house and car payment and not be stupid.
I'm in my thirties, and my only debt is on my house, and we own 1 car and have almost paid off the other in a couple months. We save over a third of my income and in some years even more than that depending on lots of factors. We have a good emergency fund and a good size retirement account going for someone our age. I consider myself fortunate to be in that situation. Partly it is due to me working hard in school and getting a graduate degree and getting a good job, but it's partly due to me being lucky to have parents that taught me well and grandparents that helped me out with undergrad costs that scholarships didn't cover.
When I'm 70 and retired or ready to retire, hopefully I won't have a mortgage and can buy an expensive car with cash too. But to expect that everyone can and should do the same seems a little silly. I can easily afford to buy a fun car and finance at a really low rate, so why not? Should I wait another 5 years and drive a less fun car even longer in the meantime just so I can avoid a few thousand in interest? I don't want to spend my whole working life counting every penny, so that I can wait until retirement to have fun. You can be smart and have a little fun too.
Should I take money out of investment accounts to avoid a 1 or 2% rate on a car loan, when I can make more interest than that by investing? Not all financing is stupid. Some yes of course, but not all.
Since this is off topic and turning into a financial discussion, I will leave it at that.
I apologize to sharkbait for calling him a name, it was out of line.
It wasn't because they have the money, it was because of their attitude towards people that have less money. Not all people that are rich are that way because they are smart, and not all poor people are that way because they are stupid or were wasteful. Income inequality is and will continue to be a serious problem in this country, and appearing to have this attitude that all poor people are stupid and should have just made better choices like all the rich people have, is not helping the problem.
No, I'm not advocating everyone spend too much on a car and a house and be way over their head in debt, but there is a huge gap between that and owning a house without a mortgage and buying a car in cash. There are plenty of people who can have a sensible house and car payment and not be stupid.
I'm in my thirties, and my only debt is on my house, and we own 1 car and have almost paid off the other in a couple months. We save over a third of my income and in some years even more than that depending on lots of factors. We have a good emergency fund and a good size retirement account going for someone our age. I consider myself fortunate to be in that situation. Partly it is due to me working hard in school and getting a graduate degree and getting a good job, but it's partly due to me being lucky to have parents that taught me well and grandparents that helped me out with undergrad costs that scholarships didn't cover.
When I'm 70 and retired or ready to retire, hopefully I won't have a mortgage and can buy an expensive car with cash too. But to expect that everyone can and should do the same seems a little silly. I can easily afford to buy a fun car and finance at a really low rate, so why not? Should I wait another 5 years and drive a less fun car even longer in the meantime just so I can avoid a few thousand in interest? I don't want to spend my whole working life counting every penny, so that I can wait until retirement to have fun. You can be smart and have a little fun too.
Should I take money out of investment accounts to avoid a 1 or 2% rate on a car loan, when I can make more interest than that by investing? Not all financing is stupid. Some yes of course, but not all.
Since this is off topic and turning into a financial discussion, I will leave it at that.
I apologize to sharkbait for calling him a name, it was out of line.
Last edited:
No harm - no foul. Let's all worry about Tesla service when there are 500,000 of them on the road. My local service manager just emailed me, asking about the repair they did last Friday and if I had anymore problems (front-facing camera replacement). No problems. So Buena Park service is damn good. I've never had a manufacturer SM follow up on service directly. How can you beat that and they're only 13 miles away.
good for you!
however you don't seem to understand that the vast majority of people do not share the level of finacial resources that you apparently have are not in a position to be able to make such sizable purchases without taking out loans to finance those purchases.
he wasn't referred to in derogatory terms because he has the ability to pay cash for major purchases. He was chastised for his arrogance, for his being tone deaf to reality that 99% of people are not as fortunate as he is.
Arrogance huh? I suggest we're headed for another financial meltdown because once again people are taking money out of their mortgaged homes for frivolous things like vacations and cars they can't afford. I'd also suggest that anyone here buying a Tesla that doesn't already own their home is an idiot. Maybe they should be looking for a Chevy Bolt or saving for retirement. I could care less.
1. The proper term is "I could not care less".
Because if you could care less, that means that you do care at some non-trivial level now.
2. If you couldn't care less, then why are you here patronizing and antagonizing the "poor" people on the Tesla forums?
Meh, sorry if my use of the language ruffled your feathers. Hopefully, you still got my point. I suppose the next thing we'll hear is that the well-to-do folks, folks that worked hard and saved all their life, should be subsidizing Teslas "for the poor" (along with their free power, healthcare, housing, food stamps, smartphones, etc., etc., etc.).
And, if you find and go back to the very beginning of this discussion (perhaps somewhere else), it was another forum member that inferred I took out a loan that was as big as his mortgage. It's very wrong to assume anyone here has a mortgage on their home let alone the inability to pay cash for a car, even a Tesla.
I saw where it started, but I think you have a very skewed perception of the general Tesla population. (I don't mean this as an insult, just an observation).
There are a lot of Tesla owners who are younger, don't have paid off mortgages, and who can not pay $100k in cash. It's one thing to cut a $100k check when you're 70 and retired and have $2M in your IRA/401k, it's another to do so at 25/30/40/50/etc when you have kids to put through preschool/school/college, a mortgage to pay off, etc.
Also those same people might not have $100k in liquid cash laying around, and might think that a person who does is an idiot. Those same people could have $500k in equity in their house, but still have a mortgage. Those same people might own 3 rental properties with over $1M in equity, but not have $100k in the bank to buy a car. Those same people might have $100k invested in stocks, and think it makes more sense to take a loan out on a car at 1.49%, etc.
It CAN be argued that those same people would be better off in putting that money into an IRA or paying off their mortgage and driving a beater car. But it's not your, or my, place to argue that point. Everyone has a right to chose how, when and where to spend their money. Someone might a bigger house, a nicer car, or vice versa someone might want the bare minimum but to retire at 50. Everyone has decisions to make, and to each their own. But no one is an idiot for doing what they think is a good financial decision for themselves. They might not agree with your school of thought, but that doesn't automatically make them wrong.
And while it was an assumption/mistake for the poster to say that you took out a car loan as big as your mortgage, your response was far more condescending stating that people are idiots for taking loans on depreciating assets.
/soapbox
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
Too much common sense for one day! (Definitely not random chit-chat)
Garlan Garner
Banned
I'm not sure if religion is allowed in here but.
Jesus wasn't wrong when he stood alone in the face of adversity - even death. So...the that reduces the "majority rules" statement to "a possibility".
There have been many times where I stood alone and was right. And I'm going to continue.
Don't be a false prophet. There are Christians who still think you are wrong.
Matthew 7:4 - Stop complaining about Tesla when you got what you paid for.
Matthew 18:16 - Gonna find one or two more Christians that think you are wrong and throw you out as a pagan.
Proverbs 24:33 - If you could bother yourself to spend 30 minutes researching before dropping $100k, you would know how Tesla works.
So you are equating being unhappy about your car options to being our Lord and Savior?
Um, enough of the religion stuff. There are plenty of reasons why it's a terrible idea to reference it here, and I'm sure you all know why.
The majority of the "general Tesla population" that answered one poll here expect to pay over $70K for their Model 3. Over $70K is way over the average price of car, so what can one assume, especially when many buyers are being drawn to a Model S as we speak? I would submit that Tesla buyers, at least until cheaper models are produced, are fairly well-heeled. I suspect many here have paid cash for their Tesla (all models). C'mon, how many will actually acquire a Model 3 (stripped) that costs less than the average price of a car sold today? Few I doubt.
However, a smart buyer doesn't pay a higher interest rate on an auto than what he can get on an investment unless somebody wants to offer no interest financing for say, five or six years. That will not happen on a Tesla purchase. I respectfully retract that they are "idiots". However, these folks have a lot to learn about money and finance.
If you're in your 30's or 40's and financing a Tesla, you should first look to see how much money you will need to live 30-40 years down the road and how much you've saved already. It's an eye opener. Sadly, many here also live for the moment, Carpe Diem, and to hell with tomorrow.
Perhaps those who will finance will read this article:
Are you the 61 percent? Most Americans remain ill-informed about personal finances
Even then, only 1 out of 6 will pay cash for their autos. I suggest the rest also throw in gap insurance to cover their unexpected lost in the event that occurs. I also wish them luck.
- Status
Similar threads
