Range Loss Over Time, What Can Be Expected, Efficiency, How to Maintain Battery Health

[AAKEE]

If you use the carefree approach and only follow Teslas basic tips you’ll be fine.
It might cause more than nessesary degradation though.

If you like to keep range and minimize the degradation:
- Smaller cycles causes less degradation than bigger one does.
- The lower in the charging range/SOC the cycle is placed the lower the degradation.
-The lower SOC when the va
car is not used, the lower degradation.

60 to 40% twice is better than 70 to 30%.
50 to 40% causes leds degradation than 70 to 60%.
Over the night, 30% is better than 90%.

The kind of degradation often seen in the forum, low miles but high degradation is most probable from calendar aging and not from driving. This is caused by high average SOC in most cases.
SOC x Time x Temperature causes calendar aging.

 

[jjrandorin]

(moderator note)

I wanted to send a shout out "THANK YOU" to all of the tesla veterans that take the time to answer new owners "range" questions that get put into this thread. I realize that its the same basic answer over and over (with different numbers based on their specific questions), but really appreciate those of you who still go out of their way to answer these questions.

I am sure those new users also appreciate the info.

Thanks again, you all know who you are

 

[MaxRSM]

The kind of degradation often seen in the forum, low miles but high degradation is most probable from calendar aging and not from driving. This is caused by high average SOC in most cases.
SOC x Time x Temperature causes calendar aging.

I charged 40-60% for 99% of the time, charged to 100% only once , car always in garage, at home and at work, 6000 kwh on AC 10 Ampere and 300 kw on DC chargers.
And even if i have babysitting the battery still the battery has lost 7.8 Kwh in 2 years and 20000 km.
First year i have seen no loss of course, 499 km as new and 499 after a year, because BMS was hidding the loss .
So of course some behaviours are better than other for the battery , but in the end you need luck.

 

[AAKEE]

I charged 40-60% for 99% of the time, charged to 100% only once , car always in garage, at home and at work, 6000 kwh on AC 10 Ampere and 300 kw on DC chargers.
And even if i have babysitting the battery still the battery has lost 7.8 Kwh in 2 years and 20000 km.
First year i have seen no loss of course, 499 km as new and 499 after a year, because BMS was hidding the loss .
So of course some behaviours are better than other for the battery , but in the end you need luck.

All batteries degrade. More or less depending on the things I stated.
All research reports(theres a lot) agrees on the degradation. There is also quite a few research reports using Teslas NCA-batteries. In most cases 18650, more or less the S/X-cells.

Maybe there is one part of luck but it is not possible to outmanouvre the laws od battery degrading of today; how NCA-cells degrade from cyclic and calendar aging).
If you are unlucky and get a fast degrading pack, if you do the things that hurt, it will degrade more.
If you are lucky and get a low degrader, and do nice things to the pack, it will degrade less.

 

[USCGDAV]

i bought my model 3 in aug 2018. After the software upgrade I only got 316 miles when charged to 100%. Last night I got only 312 miles from 5% SOC to 100%. A 4% degradation within 10 months? Have others degraded similarly?

The answer should be: Why do you care? They warranty the battery for how long? Will you drive 300+ miles today? If so, find a super charger and suck down some cheap watts. The real issue is more psychological than anything else. My 18 long range gets 275 on a full charge and Tesla mechanics told me nothing is wrong with the car it's my driving habits. Well I'm not changing how I drive and I certainly could give a crap about extending my range by shutting off parts of the car and reducing creature comforts. I get home and plug it in and guess what? It's right back up to 275 when I get back into in the morning.

 

[AAKEE]

I’ve used lithium batteries for a while to….18650 led flashlights, lipo RC heli’s etc.

That would be interesting to see if there are any differences in power. There’s got to be some out there running 2018’s in the 1/4 still lol. Dragtimes posted a video on a p100d that was over 3yrs old and had 100k miles. The 1/4 mile Et and trap speeds were slower….and I think he estimated about 50hp loss.

Yes, I will look into that vid.

I think scan my tesla could be usefull to see if the [battery power] goes down

N54TT, Aircraft reg or ?

 

[N3vik]

First post here, so hopefully I don't anger the mods.

On Sunday I bought my first Tesla, a used 2018 Long Range Model 3 with 24k miles on it. Last night I charged it to 100% for the first time and the estimated range is only 281 miles. I thought the Long Range was supposed to have a range of 353 miles? I know the range is supposed to decrease slightly over time but a 20% decrease in 3 years seems a lot. Is that expected or could it indicate something is wrong?

 

[Tam]

First post here, so hopefully I don't anger the mods.

On Sunday I bought my first Tesla, a used 2018 Long Range Model 3 with 24k miles on it. Last night I charged it to 100% for the first time and the estimated range is only 281 miles. I thought the Long Range was supposed to have a range of 353 miles? I know the range is supposed to decrease slightly over time but a 20% decrease in 3 years seems a lot. Is that expected or could it indicate something is wrong?

I also have Model 3 LR but it's rated 310, not 353 miles. What does you Monroney Sticker say?

I don't think there's not much you can do until it goes below 70% to claim your battery warranty.

 

[RayK]

I too have a 2018 LR RWD. It has just over 20K miles. I've been charging the car to 90% and I typically get 276-277 miles. That works out to about 308 miles at 100%. Brand new, I believe the car was rated for 311 miles. For a couple of times back in 2019 (?) I did get a 100% charge of 323 miles. That was when a firmware release was supposed to bump the mileage to 325. That's the most that a 2018 LR should ever get as far as I know.

 

[ry-ballz]

The 2018 AWD LR had a range of 300 miles when new.

 

[talkingevs]

The 2018 AWD LR had a range of 300 miles when new.

I don't think he said AWD, just LR. The RWD LR had 310 mi and ours with 35,000 miles just reduced from about 297 to 287 when at 100%. So the OP seems to be right where they should be

 

[talkingevs]

Best advice I can give, just switch it to % and don't worry about the miles it shows. It's not very accurate usually anyways and will make you stop staring at it all the time

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

The 2018 AWD LR had a range of 300 miles when new.

2018 LR AWD was rated for 310 miles (76kWh+ will show this)

The 2018 LR RWD (the topic here) was rated for 310 but then updated to 325, with a capacity unlock (76kWh+ will give this range).

 

[ry-ballz]

2018 LR AWD was rated for 310 miles (76kWh+ will show this)

The 2018 LR RWD (the topic here) was rated for 310 but then updated to 325, with a capacity unlock (76kWh+ will give this range).

The AWD car was sold as 300 when new. There was a software update in early 2019 which changed the rating to 310.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

The AWD car was sold as 300 when new. There was a software update in early 2019 which changed the rating to 310.

Again, this is incorrect.

This document has a date, just to be clear when this rating was publicized.

Basic Search | Document Index System | US EPA

iaspub.epa.gov

There were efficiency updates in early 2019 which likely effectively improved the range of 2018 and 2019 vehicles to 322 or even 332 rated miles (but the 332 mile number was never advertised, even though it happened in a test in late 2019, and the 322 was only advertised in 2020, and thus was not displayed in the car until that year).

 

[AAKEE]

There were efficiency updates in early 2019 which likely effectively improved the range of 2018 and 2019 vehicles to 322 or even 332 rated miles (but the 332 mile number was never advertised, even though it happened in a test in late 2019, and the 322 was only advertised in 2020, and thus was not displayed in the car until that year).

What range would a 2019 LR AWD show today, if no degradation ( > 76kWh) ?
310mi/ 499km?

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

What range would a 2019 LR AWD show today, if no degradation ( > 76kWh) ?
310mi/ 499km?

310mi/499km. Maybe 311mi/500km when charged fo “101%”.

2018 and 2019 AWD were the same range.

Note that there were vehicles documented as starting at 78kWh. And FPWN value for them is 77.8kWh.

 

[Candleflame]

Best advice I can give, just switch it to % and don't worry about the miles it shows. It's not very accurate usually anyways and will make you stop staring at it all the time

rated miles is incredibly accurate at showing you how many kwhs you have left in the battery - afterall, the BMS doesnt allow you to take more power out than it thinks the battery has.

 

[KenC]

What range would a 2019 LR AWD show today, if no degradation ( > 76kWh) ?
310mi/ 499km?

As many of you know, my 2018 LR-AWD has always shown approx. 310 miles since I got it in Dec 2018, mfr'd Oct 2018. Here's today's Stats chart:

Up until about 15k miles, the chart shows seasonality, since the Stats developer was using the SOC api that didn't factor temps. I think it was January of this year, when he finally switched to the other SOC api that did factor in temps, so you no longer have the seasonality swings due to temps. So, from 15k onward, I've been pretty much flat on 310 miles of estimated range.

Not sure why there seems little to no aging; presumably the deg is so slow it hasn't used up the top buffer yet.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Not sure why there seems little to no aging; presumably the deg is so slow it hasn't used up the top buffer yet.

I’d say that is likely. It would be interesting to see, if you had SMT! Maybe you started at 79kWh and you also won the capacity loss lottery (in addition to your generally cool battery). And yes it seems very likely you are still over 76kWh.