Should EVs Make Artificial Sounds at Low Speeds?

[Lloyd]

Lets be more proactive!

Why not offer free Bluetooth transmitter/smartphone app to all that feel that they need to have noise making for all cars around them. This would include all the blind and impared or others. Then when they come in proximity of any moving vehicle it will trigger the vehicle to make the appropriate noise AND warn the driver that there is someone impared in proximity that they need to be aware of! The transmitting device/smartphone could also vibrate to warn the impared person that there is a car in proximity.

 

[Terra117]

The whole "electric cars are dangerous because you cannot hear them coming" FUD was started by the oil companies as part of their campaign to keep electric cars from gaining any foothold in the market.It was only a matter of time before they purchased the legislation mandating noise pollution. The proof that the need is wholly unfounded is that it applies solely to electric passenger cars.There are communities where people license their electric golf carts and drive them on public roads. Apparently, electric golf carts are not dangerous. Neither are forklifts, bucket lifts, nor electric motorcycles. Ditto for luxury ICEs.Its a shame I have to bother my Representative and Senators to get them to oppose this ridiculous rule. The country has so many real things that need their attention, rather than this nonsense.

 

[rogbmw]

I think my Tesla has one of those noise makers already installed! The on-off switch is located in the middle of the big round thing in front of me when I drive....I think it is called a horn!

 

[scottm]

Bicycles have bells to help with pedestrian awareness, because bikes are near-silent too.

I like it when I'm walking on shared paths and bikers use them coming up from behind me.

It bothers me when some whiz by, not using them, and I see they have a bell on the bike, but chose not to use it.

 

[DEinspanjer]

I think a nifty hack rather than disabling the noise would be to offer a small add-on speaker that output the inverse of the noise to cancel it out. The car is still making its prescribed noise at the prescribed level.. It just happens to be making an additional noise as well... >

 

[wk057]

It's going to be one of those things where when a new customer asks a sales rep about "the EV noise" the sales person will talk about this stupid law.... then casually mentions that everyone tends to get it disabled anyway.

 

[Gizmotoy]

I think my Tesla has one of those noise makers already installed! The on-off switch is located in the middle of the big round thing in front of me when I drive....I think it is called a horn!

Do people actually drive up behind pedestrians and honk the horn?

 

[wk057]

Do people actually drive up behind pedestrians and honk the horn?

Yep. I've tapped it in parking lots where people have no idea I'm behind them and stupidly walking in the middle of the street.

This has nothing to do with any safety issue, just people being stupid.

 

[Gizmotoy]

Yep. I've tapped it in parking lots where people have no idea I'm behind them and stupidly walking in the middle of the street.

This has nothing to do with any safety issue, just people being stupid.

Did you scare the crap out of them? Horns are ridiculously loud. I can't imagine ever honking at a nearby pedestrian save to alert them to some danger.

 

[AmpedRealtor]

Finally, remember that not everyone has full hearing capacity. Silent cars pose a danger to anyone that is blind or has severe sight loss.

And ALL cars pose a danger to deaf people, so how do we address that particular situation? What are deaf people supposed to do? If this law was enacted, in part, to help those who are hard of hearing, then why did it ignore those who are deaf and have full hearing loss? The new rule is not consistent. If the issue is that pedestrians may not be aware that a car is heading towards them or about to move, then an all-encompassing solution must also consider the needs of the deaf, not just the blind. And this is just one example of why such rules are ridiculous.

Does anyone think this could potentially affect sales? I mean, what if you don't like the sound emitted by a Model S? Will that push you towards a Porsche or Audi EV (hypothetically, of course, since none exist yet) if those cars had more pleasant noise makers?

The stupidity of this rule seems to be endless.

 

[brianman]

Perhaps the right answer is to follow the path laid out for us by television dads when they catch their kids smoking...

Before the regulations go into effect, be "proactive" by adding an artificial sound that complies with the regulations. Do it, like, tomorrow. Artsci?

I think after about a week of this in major cities where EVs are prominent, the public backslash will be tremendous.

 

[DavidB]

Although it seems unlikely that we can convince legislators to strike down this bill, I think we should try.

Who are the legislators most likely to be sympathetic to our letters?

 

[CharlesJR]

Well, if they've done it in Japan...

Seriously? What kind of justification is that? I can almost hear every parent in the world saying something like "If Japan jumped off a bridge..."



Every car on the road fits that description.



Just how loud a noise does a car have to make to be heard by a deaf person?

I apologize. My intent was to say "blind" not "deaf". Clearly I was mistaken with that comment.

As to the Japan comment, I was pointing out that the United States is not "new" with this ruling ... its something that is happening in most countries because it really does cause a problem.

I'm not commenting on the wisdom of regulating behavior. I'm pointing out that this is a new technology that is truly disruptive ... hundreds of years of conditioning tell most pedestrians to listen as well as look. Its why things like video games have surround sound. Its why your fancy home theatre system does too: sound is a key part of our lives and experiences.

I stand by my point: people are usually genuinely startled when my car starts to move because they aren't expecting it because the normal, audible cues, aren't there.

BTW: its the same reason I installed new pipes and a bigger horn on my motorcycle: its better to be HEARD then seen when on a motor vehicle.

I like my silent Tesla. I just think is a little silly to assume that these concerns have no merit.

CharlesJR

 

[dsm363]

A pedestrian horn is enough.

 

[stopcrazypp]

its something that is happening in most countries because it really does cause a problem.

So far the countries haven't proven with statistics that the silent cars cause significantly more pedestrian injuries than regular cars. I believe NHTSA did a study, of hybrids being involved in more accidents with pedestrians, but that study didn't control for the area the cars are used it (obviously cars used in places with more pedestrians have a higher chance of accidents).

I stand by my point: people are usually genuinely startled when my car starts to move because they aren't expecting it because the normal, audible cues, aren't there.

I see this repeated often, but being startled and being injured are two completely different things. The speed at which the car is silent enough to startle someone is so low that there is plenty of reaction time for the driver to see the pedestrian, and even if hit there is a much lower probability of injury. The only valid place this does not apply is when reversing (where the driver might not be able to see the pedestrian).

 

[MsElectric]

Okay so I have the perfect solution. They should mound this at the front of the car. You'll never have to worry about anyone or anything getting in front of your car.

http://gizmodo.com/what-is-the-lrad-sound-cannon-5860592

 

[derekt75]

Bicycles have bells to help with pedestrian awareness, because bikes are near-silent too.

I like it when I'm walking on shared paths and bikers use them coming up from behind me.

It bothers me when some whiz by, not using them, and I see they have a bell on the bike, but chose not to use it.

As a cyclist, I have a different perspective: I hate that some people feel like they can just walk across a traffic lane if they don't hear something coming. If you step in front of me when I'm pedaling at 25 mph, there's a real chance that we'll both wind up in the hospital. Road bikes behave very predictably, can be seen coming from a good distance away, and don't make sudden turns. but they're quite dangerous if you rely only on your ears. I was hoping EVs would disabuse people of that dangerous habit.

I wonder how long the noisemaker law would last if it applied to all bicycles, too.

In related news, I wish shouting "On your left!" didn't result in people looking over their left shoulder and inadvertently wandering into the traffic lane.

 

[saladman]

As a cyclist, I have a different perspective: I hate that some people feel like they can just walk across a traffic lane if they don't hear something coming. If you step in front of me when I'm pedaling at 25 mph, there's a real chance that we'll both wind up in the hospital. Road bikes behave very predictably, can be seen coming from a good distance away, and don't make sudden turns. but they're quite dangerous if you rely only on your ears. I was hoping EVs would disabuse people of that dangerous habit.

I wonder how long the noisemaker law would last if it applied to all bicycles, too.

In related news, I wish shouting "On your left!" didn't result in people looking over their left shoulder and inadvertently wandering into the traffic lane.

+1 +1

 

[doctorwho]

As a cyclist, I have a different perspective: I hate that some people feel like they can just walk across a traffic lane if they don't hear something coming. If you step in front of me when I'm pedaling at 25 mph, there's a real chance that we'll both wind up in the hospital. Road bikes behave very predictably, can be seen coming from a good distance away, and don't make sudden turns. but they're quite dangerous if you rely only on your ears. I was hoping EVs would disabuse people of that dangerous habit.

I wonder how long the noisemaker law would last if it applied to all bicycles, too.

In related news, I wish shouting "On your left!" didn't result in people looking over their left shoulder and inadvertently wandering into the traffic lane.

Yes, what annoys me as a cyclist is people saying "I didn't see you" as if that is an excuse for nearly killing me. What is needed is education to teach people to look, not just to listen and that applies to pedestrians, drivers and cyclists.

 

[AustinPowers]

I.e., the smart ED's noise generator makes the car sound like a Star Trek vessel going to warp when you slam the accelerator.

Really? I might consider buying one after all. ;-)

- - - Updated - - -

Did you scare the crap out of them? Horns are ridiculously loud. I can't imagine ever honking at a nearby pedestrian save to alert them to some danger.

Ahem, it's standard practice over here and has been ever since I can remember, to honk your horn when you have to warn someone who doesn't realise that you are coming. You can't imagine how many idiots even I with my (by no means silent) Diesel ICE car had to warn by honking my horn - especially in parking lots or when they had their earphones on or were distracted by other things like playing around with their mobile phones, chatting to someone walking beside them etc.

I think blind people would be the ones benefitting the least from this legislation, as they seem to be far more alert to all kinds of noises anyway (even as quiet as wheel noise from a slow moving BEV), due to their natural senses being calibrated differently as a consequence of their blindness.
I am far more concerned about all the other people who are "blind" (i.e. oblivious) to the world around them due to all kinds of distractions like the ones mentioned above as well as in other postings in this thread.