Wiki Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software

[cpa]

@cpa - So nice to see you back . You were missed.

Thank you, Droschke. I've been lurking about. There really has not been much in the advancing of our cause over the past several months, so did not feel that I could add anything of substance. It seems that we are just treading water until the lawyers make their decisions whether to settle or forge on with trial.

I'm not holding my breath with this extension to mid-December. COVID is raging again throughout California as it is elsewhere. Our current situation will more than likely postpone any meaningful discussions until spring, assuming a vaccine becomes available to the hoi polloi and has been embraced by a large percentage of the population.

 

[Droschke]

Thank you, Droschke. I've been lurking about. There really has not been much in the advancing of our cause over the past several months, so did not feel that I could add anything of substance. It seems that we are just treading water until the lawyers make their decisions whether to settle or forge on with trial.

I'm not holding my breath with this extension to mid-December. COVID is raging again throughout California as it is elsewhere. Our current situation will more than likely postpone any meaningful discussions until spring, assuming a vaccine becomes available to the hoi polloi and has been embraced by a large percentage of the population.

Thank @cpa - I've asked multiple times if any owner has their capacity loss restored. Don't remember any positive response.

It's getting worse now ... so much for the 80% threshold. Yesterday, I AC charged my car (at 240 volt 24 amp) from 42% to 50%. My pumps started to run loudly.

Trying to repeat the same, today I AC charged (at 240 volt 24 amp), this time from 44% to 50% SoC. For the entire duration of the charging session my pumps/fans were running loud. This is very concerning.

 

[InternetDude]

I still check in on this topic from time to time since I sold my 85D earlier this year. I feel for you guys but I wanted to share that although I don’t overly like buying hundreds of liters of gas for my Lexus, there is a lot less stress & waiting & drama now. You couldn’t pay me to buy another vehicle from Tesla given how they’ve handled so many issues so poorly. If this issue really has you down, I encourage you to move on and take your business to a more respectful company. I wasn’t about to try and push this issue with them because it is so hopeless. Good luck.

 

[BigNick]

It's getting worse now ... so much for the 80% threshold. Yesterday, I AC charged my car (at 240 volt 24 amp) from 42% to 50%. My pumps started to run loudly.

It isn’t universal, however. I charged to about 97% thinking I would be driving about a 200-mile round trip. Those plans fell through so I just drove down under 90%.

Thursday night I parked at 88% SoC. The car is sitting at 86% SoC right now, roughly 60 hours since parked. The garage temperature is about 60F.

Could the BMS be doing occasional pack evaluations and changing rules based on its findings? Or is it due to driving and parking at 80+% SoC that it’s not running the pumps rather than a “charge to 80+% SoC but not driven” scenario?

My pumps aren’t broken as they did run when charging to 97%.

 

[Droschke]

Could the BMS be doing occasional pack evaluations and changing rules based on its findings?

Could be, and I was thinking about the same. it's really a shame that none of these ever get communicated to us.

 

[Droschke]

... although I don’t overly like buying hundreds of liters of gas for my Lexus, there is a lot less stress & waiting & drama now ...

That's for sure. I have not recovered any of my capacity loss yet, and that's why I keep asking if anyone on this thread has!

 

[faughtz]

That's for sure. I have not recovered any of my capacity loss yet, and that's why I keep asking if anyone on this thread has!

I have, but have not looked at max cell voltages, or max kW performance.

 

[Droschke]

I have, but have not looked at max cell voltages, or max kW performance.

View attachment 610900

So, you lost ~36 miles when they capped you and have gained ~24 miles of it? Am I correct?

 

[Droschke]

Normally I only charge up to 80% SoC. But I can monitor the range @100% as Teslafi extrapolates it even when the charging session stops earlier.
The 100% charge I mentioned above was AC. I cannot find a correlation to AC or DC in my data. But due Corona I'm charging AC mostly.

I extracted the recent charge log for you:
Regaining Range with 2020.20.17 and 2020.24.6.11

@Guillaume,

How many Km range did you lose per capping and how many Km have you gained? Thanks.

 

[faughtz]

So, you lost ~36 miles when they capped you and have gained ~24 miles of it? Am I correct?

Roughly.
I have not looked at max current or max kW.

 

[Droschke]

Roughly.
I have not looked at max current or max kW.

Would you give us those numbers? Miles, kW, amps lost/gained? Thanks.

 

[mymagiccarpet]

It isn’t universal, however. I charged to about 97% thinking I would be driving about a 200-mile round trip. Those plans fell through so I just drove down under 90%.

Thursday night I parked at 88% SoC. The car is sitting at 86% SoC right now, roughly 60 hours since parked. The garage temperature is about 60F.

Could the BMS be doing occasional pack evaluations and changing rules based on its findings? Or is it due to driving and parking at 80+% SoC that it’s not running the pumps rather than a “charge to 80+% SoC but not driven” scenario?

My pumps aren’t broken as they did run when charging to 97%.

funny you mentioned this. I recently took mine in to SC. They updated SW, even though I had updated it just the weekend before (?!?) and i thought that was interesting.
Told them about pumps. Long conversation. They want to follow up on that.
A few days later i charged to 90%, drove for a bit, and parked at home. Pumps were on, however, the next morning, charge was not below 80%, but only a few miles off from when i parked it. This is the first time this has happened in a year at least.
Made me really think, what SW update did they put on, and i still do think they updated it to some different version. Unfortunately, I did not take a screenshot of the FW I "upgraded" to the weekend before - i literally do every time, except of course, this time.
Too many "funny" things happen with this company and this car. I literally doubt everything I am told, and am always looking how am I being fooled. You don't have to go beyond this thread and recent letter about extending MCU warranty to see it. Why were they allowed to extend the warranty on something that can leave you stranded. Under no circumstances the issue with MCU should be anything other than recall.

 

[mymagiccarpet]

That's for sure. I have not recovered any of my capacity loss yet, and that's why I keep asking if anyone on this thread has!

Mine went from 239 to 208 at worst, except, it would not really charge beyond 201 at that time.
Now max shows 224, but I haven't attempted to charge beyond 205 so I do not know if can "get there". However, I do know when I set it to 90% recently, it charged to 202, so at least it thinks that's its 90%. That said, see my previous message. Not sure I believe it...

 

[marvin72]

Hi!

No range back in reality, but with 2020.36.11 it seems that theoretically I would get 208mi/335km at 100% shown as typical range. So it seems to me, the typical range calculation adopted to show more without actually increasing capacity.

I've driven with 2019.12.1.1 until a couple of weeks ago, I was able to charge to 100% soc, nominal capacity was 72,7kWh and max brick V 4,2V. Needed to update (story below) and with 2019.40.2.3 charging went, as we all know, way slower to max 96% and stopped, nominal capacity down to 67,1kWh and max brick V 4,1V. Yesterday I've driven the car down to 0km/% and brick min 2,87V, max 3,05V, the CHAdeMO charger started for 2 minutes with 1-2kW before going up to normal speeds. So basically, not only my brick voltage is limited and the charge rate is crippled, my new 100% is in reality 96% and brick max 4,1V is reached below 90%, thus dropping charge rates and only topping the brick min blocks until they reach 4,1V either around 96%ish.

Ah, of course the pumps are now running after charging, I left the car in the driveway and over night temperatures went a bit below 0°C while the car is set to range mode and the 12V battery is externally charged so the car did not loose to much, is still at 87%/181mi/291km typical range.

Why did I upgraded into chargegate/batterygate?
A couple of weeks ago I've got the 12V Battery needs replacement Warning. Also the MCU handling seemed more sluggish then it should be (Loek's emmc change in January) and spotify login needed repeated switching between radio and spotify before showing my stored songs. So I charged my 12V battery with my ctek 3600 through the nose cone connectors for a week at least overnight, with the Warning present. All together, I've decided to reset the car to factory settings. Which succeeded partially, the MCU showed a message that the factory reset was done, but no LTE/3G Data connection. And every time the car went into energy saving or after a soft reset it rebooted twice and showed the successful factory reset message again, lost all settings, profiles etc. My VIN showed as "VINISEMPTY". So what happened? It seemed one of the emmc partitions was full, showed 0MB free space. Perhaps due to error logging, I am not sure. After setting the APN manually I've regained data connection, but the next energy saving state and all went away. After a second factory reset, the VIN was back and it started to clear more and more free space, still loosing settings. A third reset to factory settings brought no further help, so while the free space increased an update to 2019.40.2.3 was pushed to the car and later installed. This broke the factory reset loop and also set all necessary data, phew... Since a mobile service appointment was set for the ccs upgrade, I also updated the car to 2020.36.11 which is running fine so far, except, you know, limited...

BR!

 

[Battpower]

Too many "funny" things happen with this company and this car. I literally doubt everything I am told,

As I was reading your post, these exact ideas were starting to form for a reply.

 

[Battpower]

range calculation adopted to show more without actually increasing capacity.

From the (few) numbers I have seen posted, this is exactly what I suspected could be the case. More confidence gone up in smoke and mirrors!

With newer cars retrospective code tweeks show maybe 5-10% more range and as far as I know little if any real performance change.

 

[qwk]

Of course the tweaks were to the range algorithm. Only a fool would believe that they would give you any significant range back. The packs are capped for a reason.

 

[DJRas]

The capacity restoration algorithm was first released in 2020.8.1.1 in March 2020.

Hi!

No range back in reality, but with 2020.36.11 it seems that theoretically I would get 208mi/335km at 100% shown as typical range. So it seems to me, the typical range calculation adopted to show more without actually increasing capacity.

I've driven with 2019.12.1.1 until a couple of weeks ago, I was able to charge to 100% soc, nominal capacity was 72,7kWh and max brick V 4,2V. Needed to update (story below) and with 2019.40.2.3 charging went, as we all know, way slower to max 96% and stopped, nominal capacity down to 67,1kWh and max brick V 4,1V. Yesterday I've driven the car down to 0km/% and brick min 2,87V, max 3,05V, the CHAdeMO charger started for 2 minutes with 1-2kW before going up to normal speeds. So basically, not only my brick voltage is limited and the charge rate is crippled, my new 100% is in reality 96% and brick max 4,1V is reached below 90%, thus dropping charge rates and only topping the brick min blocks until they reach 4,1V either around 96%ish.

Ah, of course the pumps are now running after charging, I left the car in the driveway and over night temperatures went a bit below 0°C while the car is set to range mode and the 12V battery is externally charged so the car did not loose to much, is still at 87%/181mi/291km typical range.

Why did I upgraded into chargegate/batterygate?
A couple of weeks ago I've got the 12V Battery needs replacement Warning. Also the MCU handling seemed more sluggish then it should be (Loek's emmc change in January) and spotify login needed repeated switching between radio and spotify before showing my stored songs. So I charged my 12V battery with my ctek 3600 through the nose cone connectors for a week at least overnight, with the Warning present. All together, I've decided to reset the car to factory settings. Which succeeded partially, the MCU showed a message that the factory reset was done, but no LTE/3G Data connection. And every time the car went into energy saving or after a soft reset it rebooted twice and showed the successful factory reset message again, lost all settings, profiles etc. My VIN showed as "VINISEMPTY". So what happened? It seemed one of the emmc partitions was full, showed 0MB free space. Perhaps due to error logging, I am not sure. After setting the APN manually I've regained data connection, but the next energy saving state and all went away. After a second factory reset, the VIN was back and it started to clear more and more free space, still loosing settings. A third reset to factory settings brought no further help, so while the free space increased an update to 2019.40.2.3 was pushed to the car and later installed. This broke the factory reset loop and also set all necessary data, phew... Since a mobile service appointment was set for the ccs upgrade, I also updated the car to 2020.36.11 which is running fine so far, except, you know, limited...

BR!

 

[mymagiccarpet]

Mine went from 239 to 208 at worst, except, it would not really charge beyond 201 at that time.
Now max shows 224, but I haven't attempted to charge beyond 205 so I do not know if can "get there". However, I do know when I set it to 90% recently, it charged to 202, so at least it thinks that's its 90%. That said, see my previous message. Not sure I believe it...

I should probably follow up on this...note that these numbers are all based on Tesla's algorithm which is subject to change. I did not measure battery capacity so for all I know, it's the same (or different) than after capping.

 

[Chaserr]

Of course the tweaks were to the range algorithm. Only a fool would believe that they would give you any significant range back. The packs are capped for a reason.

If the reason was "we could have gotten away with it if not for you kids and scooby doo" they would give it back as the lawsuit exposed their real face behind the mask. Or, if the mask is staying on the reason could be "We thought every battery was going to catch fire, but realized it was only some and maybe we already replaced most of the really bad ones. With the heat on maybe we can cripple the rest in less obvious wats as they come to our attention". There are lots of reasons to return what they took - all of them having to do with the fact that they have no other choices and time is running out.