You couldn't be more wrong and you've obviously never been in a P85D from a 0 MPH launch otherwise you'd realize just how idiotic your statement is. There is no universe where 3.1 seconds vs 4.2 seconds isn't astronomically different. In the past, this has been the difference between $100K cars and $million dollar cars. Not only that, it's the P85Ds 0-30 that is the most impressive as it does it even faster than the 918 spider which is the fastest production sports car on the planet doing 0-60 in a mere 2.2 seconds. The P85D is even faster than it up to 30 mph pulling 1.3 g's on a 90% charge.
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You couldn't be more wrong and you've obviously never been in a P85D from a 0 MPH launch otherwise you'd realize just how idiotic your statement is. There is no universe where 3.1 seconds vs 4.2 seconds isn't astronomically different. In the past, this has been the difference between $100K cars and $million dollar cars. Not only that, it's the P85Ds 0-30 that is the most impressive as it does it even faster than the 918 spider which is the fastest production sports car on the planet doing 0-60 in a mere 2.2 seconds. The P85D is even faster than it up to 30 mph pulling 1.3 g's on a 90% charge.
From a performance standpoint, 0.5sec difference is clearly noticeable, and a 1 second difference is huge. That is why the P85D's 3.1 0-60 feels so truly "insane" compared with the 85D's 4.4. But 4.4 is so still much faster than 5.2 sec - and that's why it's so easily recognized during a test drive.
*** OT: wasn't the 85D supposed to get some software upgrade to get the 0-60 down to 4.2?? (At least that's what my sales person told me...)
siucity
Button Pusher
I think that's the key. You have to test drive the 2 to notice the difference. If you don't test drive the 2 models, then it's hardly noticeable.
kuttakamina
Member
Totally disagreed. The real world range difference is 20-30 miles.
85D will have to stop at every SC that 70D will, unless you have SC's every 30 miles.
85D will leave the SC 7 minutes before 70D will, which is hardly a difference since 70D charges faster than you can take can do a tea-pee operation.
Unless you are trying to set some end to end speed record, practically speaking you're not going to even notice the 7 minutes.
Look at it this way, if range is your main concern, and you think 70D is going to be tight - then probably Tesla is not the right car for you. That extra 20-30 miles isn't earth changing. And in a real pinch (which will never happen), plugshare will patch you in for the difference.
The acceleration - sure that I can see. Some people MUST have that.
For me, the 70D has far more power than I'll ever use.
But I guess thats why we have choice, some will want 85D, some will want 70D, some P85D.
tinm
2020 Model S LR+ Owner
For me it's a no brainer. Range beats power. 85D beats P85D. Quick jump starts and speeding is fine and faddish but gets old fast, especially when one notices what it does to one's battery SOC. I'll pick range over power any day. So, of the 70D, 85D, and P85D, 85D wins every time.
And for me the P85D wins. It's a blast to drive, and rarely does the difference in range between the 85D and P85D matter. It is possible to drive the P conservatively. It really has multiple personalities. If cost is a concern, then to me the 70D makes much more sense than the 85D.
I'm not really sure who the 85D is marketed to now.
I'm not really sure who the 85D is marketed to now.
Ames
Member
I would say people (like me) who want the longest range possible and don't think the extra acceleration from 0-60 is worth $20,000. By taking a quick look at our delivery spreadsheet it seems that the 85D is the most popular model. This is what we have so far:
Q2: 70D: 77
Q2: 85D: 114
Q3: 70D: 25
Q3: 85D: 32
Alex.
I would consider the RWD S85 the best value proposition in the line up. More frunk space, same range as the 85D (or close enough not to matter) and cheaper than the 85D. However I live in Scandinavia and AWD is not really required for driving here. If you live in the mountains I would consider the 85D like the OP.
scott jones
Member
Some good points here!
I had an S85 until I crashed it on April fools day! (totaled)
I HAVE SINCE DRIVEN ALL THE VARIANTS.
I drove all 3 on the same day, within an hour of each other. All were close to a full charge.
I drove, the S70D, then the P85D, then the S85D.
Regardless of the drive, I prefer the mileage you'll get from the S85D, as I have several cities that are 110 miles away with NO superchargers at the destination.
So, the round trip of 220 is doable with spirited driving in the S85D. In the S70D and P85D, it's not, or barely possible.
The price is also FAR cheaper than the P85D, but not too much more than the S70D.
NOW TO THE DRIVE.
The S70D felt like my S85 in terms of acceleration, off the line.
It was in dry conditions, so the S70D would likely be better in wet conditions.
At highway speeds, the S70D felt a bit slower than my old S85. Still it had plenty of acceleration for most people.
Now to the P85D. I thought I was prepared for the speed, given all the videos, etc. Still it was a bit of a shock it was so fast off the line!
All my change came flying out of my slacks. That "yank" was addicting, BUT to me, it's not worth the big price difference, especially
considering the loss of mileage so many have reported.
Now the S85D. This was a month or two ago when the software update was just being released to take the S85D to 4.4 seconds from 5.2ish.
The Tesla rep didn't even know it was downloaded in the car. I first drove it alone, and said... this thing is a lot faster than 5.2, and I think
it has the software update. He didn't think so until he went for a ride with me. It really PULLS off the line. We confirmed, it did have the new software.
At highway speeds, the acceleration felt very similar to the P85D.
SO THE S85D WOULD BE MY CURRENT CHOICE OF THE CURRENT VARIANTS.
I personally think there will be another BIGGER battery within a year that will allow all 691hp to be realized and far better mileage. 110D?
I'm waiting for something like that, with better fit & finish, and the ACTUAL lane keeping/changing, etc to be realized before buying again.
I currently drive a Genesis, which is good enough, although I HATE gas stations!
I just wish there was some switch on an S85D (if I were to buy) where I could CHOOSE to drain the battery faster and give me
that P85D acceleration when I wanted it, without spending $25,000 more.
Scott
bdy0627
Active Member
It's interesting how variable the opinions are on these vehicle options. I'll chime in with mine. I am coming from a background of fairly modest vehicles: Toyota Corolla to Toyota Land Cruiser to Audi Q5. The Q5 felt sporty to me. When I first test drove the 70D, I was amazed at the acceleration and handling. It was incredibly thrilling compared to all of my prior experiences driving a vehicle. Driving the 85D, the acceleration was to the point of causing just a brief moment of light headedness and brief nausea! My girlfriend preferred the 70D because she did not like the experience of the acceleration in the 85D. The 70D was thrilling to her without causing the lightheadedness/nausea. I ended up buying the 85D because I felt that with the 70D I would sometimes wish I had the extra power, especially at higher speeds. The extra range is nice as well given that I live in the upper midwest where long drives without charging options are more common. I just took delivery on my 85D yesterday and we are on our first road trip with it in an area where there are very limited charging options. We will be away from home for 5 days. There are no superchargers up in this area, just a few 240 volt options. I'm glad to have as much range as possible and I'm really enjoying the acceleration. I think I would love the 70D as well but I would focus on the fact that I saved $10,000 and didn't really "need" the additional acceleration and range. With the 85D, it doesn't take much for me to forget about the additional $10K spent over the 70D. I didn't seriously consider the P85D since it was so much more expensive than the 85D and the acceleration was already borderline nauseating at times in the 85D. Plus it did not extend the range beyond the 85D. I think a lot of this comes down to how much you value acceleration vs range vs money. All of us here must have a substantial amount of money but there is undoubtedly a huge variation in Tesla owner's wealth. For some, $20K is probably barely noticeable. For others, it is a serious consideration. I fall into the latter category. I love my new 85D and I can't wait to get driving again today!
mikeash
Active Member
Same here. I got an 85 this spring and although this was before the 70D happened, that was basically my thought process and I'd do the same again. I don't need AWD (not a whole lot of winter in Virginia) and the 85 already has far more power than I could ever need, but more cargo space is really nice to have. I hope they keep a RWD option around in the long term.
Opinions on this fly all over the place. It is so individual. I test drove the P85D and realized (as cool as it is), I can't justify the extra money (and almost as importantly) the loss of range for that violent party trick. I knew I wouldn't use it often, so the 85D was the perfect sweet spot for me. I'm in an area where there are very few superchargers, so the extra range really helps for sure.
For one, the 70D is the perfect sweet spot. Others, nothing but the most powerful and fastest will do.
I like Tesla's lineup!
For one, the 70D is the perfect sweet spot. Others, nothing but the most powerful and fastest will do.
I like Tesla's lineup!
I personally think 85D is the sweet spot and I would be 100% satisfied. However the wife completely rejected it (on cost considerations) so we ended up with 70D, with which I am 90% satisfied. Basically the car is still very quick at regular driving speeds and definitely can accelerate from a stop and pass on road without any issues and handles very well. The noticeable weakness is accelerating beyond 70mph... This reduces some driving pleasure but the fact is I personally would rarely use that function anyways since my lifetime duration spent driving beyond 80mph is probably less than 4 hrs (I am a pretty conservative driver on the highway and get passed all the time even though I have almost always driven pretty capable cars...). Basically when I do get on highway, it's set cruise control to 72 and just let the TACC handle any slow-downs and accelerations... I like that.
Would I want the feeling of strong acceleration say between 65 and 80? ya, but do I really need it? No. For that, I saved 10k and made wife happy, so it's all good.
Would I want the feeling of strong acceleration say between 65 and 80? ya, but do I really need it? No. For that, I saved 10k and made wife happy, so it's all good.
BoldSharpe
Member
All variants have their merits but I'm extremely satisfied with my 85D. Range is crucial around where I live for 200 mile round trips without SuperCharging (we really need one somewhere north of Milwaukee).
bdy0627 - Good to see we're getting more Teslas in the area. If you ever need a quick top off, my HPWC is on PlugShare on the north side of Oshkosh.
I agree wholeheartedly with JMG's comments. I considered it, and the extra money for the P85D would have been immaterial to me once I had decided to buy, but the extra range of the 85D for me trumped the extra acceleration, given certain trips I regularly make and the climate where I live. Now if through some magic the P85D could match the range of the 85D I probably would not have hesitated one bit in buying the performance model. But realistically, the launches are just a party trick which I would rarely perform - there are not many opportunities in my day-to-day driving where I would have a safe chance to do so, and even when I did I think honestly it would grow old after awhile. I would also certainly have "debadged" a P85D if I had gone that route - while I was puzzled at first when I read about some people doing that, I can see now that every kid in a souped up Honda or BMW always wants to try to race if given a chance, and I imagine that would be even more so if I had a P85D. So I would definitely go the stealth route, without the red calipers and the red "P" and "D".
I thinks all of the comments in support of the different models is a great testament to how Tesla actually nailed the line-up. I was uncertain at first how everything all fit in when the 70D was announced, but it is obvious now that the different models each fit the needs of different people, and fairly evenly too.
I thinks all of the comments in support of the different models is a great testament to how Tesla actually nailed the line-up. I was uncertain at first how everything all fit in when the 70D was announced, but it is obvious now that the different models each fit the needs of different people, and fairly evenly too.
I think it highly depends from which car you're coming from. For me? I was coming from a non-luxury non-sports sedan. So the 70D is the "best" value. I would want the 85D more for range than for speed, and $10k for 30 miles wasn't worth it. Even in the 70D I almost never floor it, and when I do it's just to get a reaction out of my kids or passengers.
If you drive pedal-to-the-metal all the time, I can see the 85D being a great value or the P85D. If you're coming from an M5 or RS7, I can see the 70D being slow.
YMMV
If you drive pedal-to-the-metal all the time, I can see the 85D being a great value or the P85D. If you're coming from an M5 or RS7, I can see the 70D being slow.
YMMV
davidc18
Active Member
Drove them all at one of the double diamond events and we would have had the P85D if money was not a concern, but, in the end we compromised on getting the 70D. We are waiting to see what happens with the S after the launch of the X.
Two additional thoughts...
I would take a 70D over any other car currently on the market with one exception: my 85D. There isn't any vehicle other than another Model S that I would cross-shop. The test drive ruined other cars for me.
21" wheels + Cincinnati road maintenance = no P85D for me. I've fought that battle before and not willing to live with the pain.
I would take a 70D over any other car currently on the market with one exception: my 85D. There isn't any vehicle other than another Model S that I would cross-shop. The test drive ruined other cars for me.
21" wheels + Cincinnati road maintenance = no P85D for me. I've fought that battle before and not willing to live with the pain.
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