Tesla needs to refresh the Model S, asap.

[whitex]

I have a good reason why current owner should not be all that eager for Tesla to refresh Model S/X. If they do, parts for the original S/X will skyrocket as the only supplier will be scrap yards (just like trying to buy executive seats or even plus suspension parts - the latter was sold by Tesla from 2012 to 2015, no longer manufactured in 2018).

 

[emmz0r]

I disagree with this. My coworkers (very well paid tech workers) back in Cali are the cheapest SOBs. Even though they can charge at home they go out to lunch every other day near an SC and charge (or complain when the SC is full and then stop by there on their way home) for free.

Free SCing will kill Tesla. Electricity prices will only rise. No ICE company gives away free fuel. Do what everyone else does and give away service or extend the warranty or something else that you have control over. Not electricity.

Haha, they will enjoy the nerfing of the charging speed then

 

[cityberty]

I wonder if the S is just going for interior redesign based on those leaks last year and keeping almost everything else the same.

different MCU, HVAC, Seats, door pockets etc

 

[Farmer]

The constant pairing of the S and the X, both on this forum and perhaps in the minds of the decision makers at Tesla is unfortunate in some ways, especially as it pertains to the different needs of a sedan versus an SUV. I'd like to buy an X, but I occasionally pull trailers and of course that really cuts range with an electric. A 100KW battery is fine for an S and maybe a lot of present X owners even doing road trips as I do, but a 120 or 125KW pack would make a world of difference when pulling a trailer, especially in cooler weather. If being able to offer another 20 or 25 percent capacity takes the newer 2070 battery form, I would see that as a good thing for the X, if not the S. It's not going to happen any time soon I agree, but at some point, Tesla's upper end SUVs and the pickup will be needing more than 140-150 mile range with a trailer. Hopefully the S won't continue to hold the X back in this area.

 

[strider]

The constant pairing of the S and the X, both on this forum and perhaps in the minds of the decision makers at Tesla is unfortunate in some ways, especially as it pertains to the different needs of a sedan versus an SUV. I'd like to buy an X, but I occasionally pull trailers and of course that really cuts range with an electric. A 100KW battery is fine for an S and maybe a lot of present X owners even doing road trips as I do, but a 120 or 125KW pack would make a world of difference when pulling a trailer, especially in cooler weather. If being able to offer another 20 or 25 percent capacity takes the newer 2070 battery form, I would see that as a good thing for the X, if not the S. It's not going to happen any time soon I agree, but at some point, Tesla's upper end SUVs and the pickup will be needing more than 140-150 mile range with a trailer. Hopefully the S won't continue to hold the X back in this area.

People lump them together because Tesla lumps them together. They use (effectively) the same chassis. So any drivetrain changes to X also affect S. So if they offer a 120kWh pack for X, why not offer it for S too? The more that is shared between models the cheaper it is for Tesla. Everyone is doing this. Volkswagen's MQB platform is used in like 30 models from Audis to Seats.

I don't understand why you think that Model S is holding back Model X. If Tesla thought they could profitably sell cars with more range they would do so. As I said above, if the competition starts getting close in rage, Elon will probably demand larger packs, even if it doesn't make economic sense.

Also, they could switch S and X to PMMs like Model 3 which would give them some efficiency (range) gains without changing the pack size at all.

Lots of options, we'll just have to wait and see what they do.

 

[DocZ]

I wonder if the S is just going for interior redesign based on those leaks last year and keeping almost everything else the same.

different MCU, HVAC, Seats, door pockets etc

I think this may be it. They are in many ways capital constrained, so maybe upgrading batteries in the S isn’t a priority at this point given the upcoming products.

I see maybe a cell chemistry change but at this point retooling hardware is probably not in their plans.

 

[shellderp]

This thread is so weird. As someone planning to buy soon, I don't think it needs any changes and is still the best car you can get. The design is beautiful and hopefully they don't make the interior more like the 3 any time soon

 

[Notso Fast]

I don't care. My heart beats faster every time I get in it, after it backed itself out of the garage and I mildly drive down the street to the corner, turn right and step on it!

Top three: battery, battery, battery

 

[AMPd]

This thread is so weird. As someone planning to buy soon, I don't think it needs any changes and is still the best car you can get. The design is beautiful and hopefully they don't make the interior more like the 3 any time soon

Why is this thread weird?

 

[bluestreak]

I Kinda look at the model S like I look at a Jaguar. Styling really hasn’t changed that much in 20 years. Maybe some minor tweaks and interior upgrades.

Agree 100%, Model S is a relatively timeless design, bit of Aston Martin, bit of Maserati, both of which have a style line that has been consistent for ages. Model S will still look contemporary in 2025 IMHO.

 

[SO16]

Although the drop in model S/X demand can be attributed to buyers opting for the model 3. I think it’s buyers who are waiting for a refresh.
Besides the front fascia update and slight rear bumper difference along with seat changes, the model s is very much like the 2012 model

I think there are many people waiting for a new model s, a redisigned S.
It’s been over 6 years!

Funny. When people get into my “old” 6 year design of my Model S, they all say “this is like getting into a spaceship!!”. Especially at night.

It may look outdated to some Tesla owners but as soon as this Tesla owner gets into another manufacturers vehicle, I think to myself: “and I’m thinking my Model S design is old?”

 

[SO16]

Totally agree. I am dying to buy a Model S and have been holding out for about a year now. Not dropping a single penny while I know that the 3 has a better battery pack. I need more range, hopefully Tesla can release a 400 mile S.

I would like to one day swap out my 90 battery pack with a 200. Probably won’t be possible. In the meantime, my 294 range is plenty. At least I get to enjoy it now.

 

[Twiglett]

Why is this thread weird?

Is demand falling for S & X ?

 

[AMPd]

Is demand falling for S & X ?

Yes

 

[bob_p]

The biggest improvements Tesla needs to make in S/X is battery packs using the 2170 batteries (which could possibly reduce cost or increase range), V3 supercharger support (likely needs the 2170 battery packs), continuing to mature the EAP software, starting to rollout FSD features (in driver assist mode), and adding some form of screen mirroring (Apple CarPlay/Android Auto or alternative).

None of these requires a refresh of S/X.

If Musk/Tesla really believe they will have FSD available in the next several years, it makes more sense for them to wait until they are close to achieving that before doing a refresh, because a vehicle with FSD will de-emphasize the driving function, and likely would increase emphasize on what the person in the "driver" position and the other passengers are doing while the vehicle drives itself (possibly even automatically connecting to chargers). That could require a major redesign of the cabin - and add features like video display while driving, mobile hotspot, …

Until then, it's always possible Tesla will release smaller improvements or some tweaking of the S/X design, though with their resources focused on new vehicles - Y, pickup, semi, Roadster 2.0 - seems unlikely we'll see any major redesign to the S/X in the near term.

 

[Twiglett]

Yes

Proof?

 

[FreqFlyer]

The biggest improvements Tesla needs to make in S/X is battery packs using the 2170 batteries (which could possibly reduce cost or increase range), V3 supercharger support (likely needs the 2170 battery packs), continuing to mature the EAP software, starting to rollout FSD features (in driver assist mode), and adding some form of screen mirroring (Apple CarPlay/Android Auto or alternative).

None of these requires a refresh of S/X.

If Musk/Tesla really believe they will have FSD available in the next several years, it makes more sense for them to wait until they are close to achieving that before doing a refresh, because a vehicle with FSD will de-emphasize the driving function, and likely would increase emphasize on what the person in the "driver" position and the other passengers are doing while the vehicle drives itself (possibly even automatically connecting to chargers). That could require a major redesign of the cabin - and add features like video display while driving, mobile hotspot, …

Until then, it's always possible Tesla will release smaller improvements or some tweaking of the S/X design, though with their resources focused on new vehicles - Y, pickup, semi, Roadster 2.0 - seems unlikely we'll see any major redesign to the S/X in the near term.

True, the most important vehicle right now to Tesla is the Y. The new Y and 3 will be the products going forward paying the bills for Tesla.

 

[jrwaters1]

Although the drop in model S/X demand can be attributed to buyers opting for the model 3. I think it’s buyers who are waiting for a refresh.
Besides the front fascia update and slight rear bumper difference along with seat changes, the model s is very much like the 2012 model

I think there are many people waiting for a new model s, a redisigned S.
It’s been over 6 years!

I have an S that is 1 1/2 years old. Several times a week. strangers will walk up (most do not know what kind of car it is) and tell me it is the most beautiful car they have ever seen. I think it would be hard not to screw it up.

 

[sandpiper]

The biggest improvements Tesla needs to make in S/X is battery packs using the 2170 batteries (which could possibly reduce cost or increase range), V3 supercharger support (likely needs the 2170 battery packs), continuing to mature the EAP software, starting to rollout FSD features (in driver assist mode), and adding some form of screen mirroring (Apple CarPlay/Android Auto or alternative).

None of these requires a refresh of S/X.

If Musk/Tesla really believe they will have FSD available in the next several years, it makes more sense for them to wait until they are close to achieving that before doing a refresh, because a vehicle with FSD will de-emphasize the driving function, and likely would increase emphasize on what the person in the "driver" position and the other passengers are doing while the vehicle drives itself (possibly even automatically connecting to chargers). That could require a major redesign of the cabin - and add features like video display while driving, mobile hotspot, …

Until then, it's always possible Tesla will release smaller improvements or some tweaking of the S/X design, though with their resources focused on new vehicles - Y, pickup, semi, Roadster 2.0 - seems unlikely we'll see any major redesign to the S/X in the near term.

I think you might be mistaken about whether the revised cells require a refresh. The Model 3 pack is very different, structurally and in the way that it is cooled/heated by the car. Some of this is just Tesla learning how to do packs better, but I suspect that some of it has to do with the fact that the 2170 has a different surface/volume ratio, and so heating and cooling requirements will be different.

It takes a lot of engineering and testing work to design a new pack and to make it durable. If Tesla is going to commit to a new pack for the S/X they don't want to do it twice. And so that may mean requiring a revision to the rest of the car systems to make them capable of integrating well with the pack. And when you do that, you require revisions to various of the structural elements to mount the revised hardware. And then of course the software. And so, maybe they are holding off on the new pack for a bit.

Of course I'm just speculating here. But things that sometimes appear simple just aren't, once you get down into the weeds.

 

[AMPd]

Proof?

Tesla to cut production hours for Model S and X | Reuters

“Tesla Inc said on Wednesday it is reducing production hours for higher-priced Model S and Model X cars, just days after saying it would cut jobs as the electric carmaker looks to make more affordable versions of the Model 3 sedan.”

It’s not unreasonable to assume demand is slowing when production hours are cut and people are laid off.