It does one thing very well, it educates people about electric vehicles, I know the argument is that it's a hybrid but the public views it as electric when they find out it plugs in. I get the range question all the time and my response, "nope it has an onboard generator". That gets a conversation going every time. Next thing you know we are talking about how I charge with solar and have no fuel bill whatsoever, and how much more smooth the electric drivetrain is, etc., it gets me talking about Tesla too! That said, I would buy an electric truck, but probably be less likely to buy a truck with a volt like set up but probably in the minority on that. Anyway, FWIW, when gen 3 comes out, the volt gets replaced unless we can pick up a used ms for a decent price prior to that. The focus nor the leaf can not get me from Roseville ca. to Tahoe or the coast.
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Tesla Pickup Truck
- Thread starter AnOutsider
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But how often would do you really drive a pickup truck over 100 miles?
I really think Tesla could leverage 2 60kWh packs, or a single 120kWh pack and make a killer pickup. Torque, and towing would be easy for an electric motor. Putting the right frame together would be the only problem.
I just don't see where people are going to pay ~$80k for a pickup. I know a LOT of people that pay $40-60k for a pickup. And with fuel savings an $80-90k pickup wouldn't be much different in total cost over 5-6 years. But I would think convincing people to pony up for an $80k pickup will be much harder than for say a luxury sedan.
I think the real entry point for Tesla would be fleet sales to power companies. I am sure if they could find something cost competitive with their gas/diesel fleet that is electric they would switch in a heartbeat.
Believe it or not... fairly often, but that isn't the biggest concern. 100 miles empty range is 50-60 miles of range with a boat/snowmobile. Depending on the weight and the aerodynamics of the load you can have a significantly more energy usage.
Now while the adage for "most people only drive xx number of miles per day", that phrase makes sense for most commuters, but I didn't buy my pickup to be a commuter (even though 90 percent of the miles are going to and from work). On those trips where i am not going to work, I am getting out of the city to go fishing, camping, snowmobiling and all those destinations can be very far (100 to 400 miles typically). Just 2 months ago i drove to Baudette MN to go ice fishing (yes that place from the Acura commercials) and that was a 5 hour drive (we may or may not have hit 95 mph on the way back). I may personally use my truck more than most city folks, but trucks do get used and around MN they get used for outdoor activities a lot.
1. Annual trips towing boat to Lake powell, AZ
2. Hunting in Montana at least annual
3. Hauling stuff to kids in San Diego and Oregon
4. Annual fising trip out of San Diego
Thats about 4 x per year that I use my truck more than 100 miles with a load.
I think ELSupreme's idea of targeting the power companies is probably the best idea yet. Not a huge mini truck fan, but here this may make sense at least as a starter truck. Along with the power companies there are a ton of large construction companies that also provide mini trucks to their supervisors. Many county building inspectors drive them also, city and county utilities workers too. This seems like a large pool of eager buyers to me. The other advantage to this, perhaps it could be built on the gen III platform?
bollar
Disgruntled Member
Some states (even Texas) give incentives to or require fleet owners to have part of their fleet powered by an alternative fuel source. We have lots of natural gas fleets here, but it could be EV.
Frankly, I think an EV on a Sprinter-like platform would be a killer application and would get attention from delivery companies.
Although I think that, just as 2/3s or 5/8s of squidge-all SUVs never, ever see conditions necessary to shift into 4WD, many of these posters are correct in writing that, for the most part, larger-sized pickup trucks do far more massaging of testosterone than they do heavy- and long distance-hauling,
nevertheless it remains true that especially in the Big Country states, like Texas and Montana and here in Alaska, most pickups much of the time are doing plenty of both. As I've written before, it is the exciting exception for me that I can turn the keys for my current alternative vehicle - a close-to 50mpg TDI Golf - just because I don't need the Heavy Hauler to get to/from town (400 or 600 mile r/t). Without at least an F-250, I'm sunk. And this is also absolutely true for many, many tradespeople who absolutely have to be able to carry large volumes and large weights, often in reasonable or terribly difficult driving conditions, day after day.
So, while total ownership numbers of BigTruckWannabees, as well as those who, as above, need that grunt only a handful of times each year always will far outweigh the rest of us, we still remain a sizable (and more price-inelastic, too.........) community.
Bollar - I also agree that the Sprinter-style platform is absolutely worth strong consideration.
nevertheless it remains true that especially in the Big Country states, like Texas and Montana and here in Alaska, most pickups much of the time are doing plenty of both. As I've written before, it is the exciting exception for me that I can turn the keys for my current alternative vehicle - a close-to 50mpg TDI Golf - just because I don't need the Heavy Hauler to get to/from town (400 or 600 mile r/t). Without at least an F-250, I'm sunk. And this is also absolutely true for many, many tradespeople who absolutely have to be able to carry large volumes and large weights, often in reasonable or terribly difficult driving conditions, day after day.
So, while total ownership numbers of BigTruckWannabees, as well as those who, as above, need that grunt only a handful of times each year always will far outweigh the rest of us, we still remain a sizable (and more price-inelastic, too.........) community.
Bollar - I also agree that the Sprinter-style platform is absolutely worth strong consideration.
I think the Tesla truck would be for the majority of pickup truck drivers that want to drive a pickup truck but rarely if every use it to its full capabilities. It is just a 'car' for them to drive around and go to work like a lot of people.
For those that need a serious truck for work, if Tesla could prove it performs well and is 4 times more fuel efficient, they could easily make a business argument to buy the truck on fuel savings alone. Range would probably not be an issue assuming it is over 250 miles. This is all a guess on my part of course. The market would decide.
The third group is people who hate anything that smacks 'green' and need the diesel V10. Tesla would never sell to that group unless gas hits $8 a gallon then finances trump ideology.
For those that need a serious truck for work, if Tesla could prove it performs well and is 4 times more fuel efficient, they could easily make a business argument to buy the truck on fuel savings alone. Range would probably not be an issue assuming it is over 250 miles. This is all a guess on my part of course. The market would decide.
The third group is people who hate anything that smacks 'green' and need the diesel V10. Tesla would never sell to that group unless gas hits $8 a gallon then finances trump ideology.
Good point. Couldn't they install high power chargers at work sites? That way during idle time at construction or job sites people could grab extra range. I don't think the Tesla pickup truck would be positioned to replace a Ram 3500 hailing multiple tons for 300 miles but more of a light duty/commuter truck or job site work.
I would think a 120kWh battery pack would be needed. You could get ~350 miles unladen. And about 150 towing a trailer. Probably between 200 and 250 with a full bed. I deal with contractors a lot, and they regularly drive their trucks ~100miles in a day, but rarely drive much above that. I think a vehicle that could get you ~40kWh Model S range, while towing a medium/light load would be a sweet spot. Towing something like a 5th wheel I don't think will work for a long time with an EV.
Obviously an electric truck isn't going to get you to your vacation house out in the boonies, much better than an electric car would without a trailer.
But even the lakes, around Atlanta at least, aren't much more than 150 miles away from the further suburbs.
And Georgia Power has hundreds of pickups. They would probably love to have 80% of them be electric, if not more.
By the time the truck comes out the Supercharger network should be pretty built out.
Delivery actually make more sense than building cars for the public in a lot of ways. Sell hundreds or thousands at a time to businesses that have delivery vehicles in the morning leave a facility, drive a precisely predetermined route and return at night. It's what EVs are best at and there are Post Offices, UPS, FedEX and a million small businesses that would love to put solar up on the roof and reduce their drive-every-day-all-day fuel bills to nothing.
Delivery actually make more sense than building cars for the public in a lot of ways. Sell hundreds or thousands at a time to businesses that have delivery vehicles in the morning leave a facility, drive a precisely predetermined route and return at night. It's what EVs are best at and there are Post Offices, UPS, FedEX and a million small businesses that would love to put solar up on the roof and reduce their drive-every-day-all-day fuel bills to nothing.
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Selling a Tesla pickup truck in America is almost unbelievable. You know the mentality of the people that never actually use the "truck" part of their truck. Good luck with that.
Service trucks like UPS/Fedex however, and more than reasonable. I would seem almost trivial for Elon to negotiate this. UPS trucks drive only specific hours, basically you could size a battery to last only a specific number of miles, getting guaranteed charge/discharge cycles that are computer ahead of time by a master algorithm. The cost savings would be _dramatic_ for a company like UPS. You could even build one without resizing the existing Model S parts.
Service trucks like UPS/Fedex however, and more than reasonable. I would seem almost trivial for Elon to negotiate this. UPS trucks drive only specific hours, basically you could size a battery to last only a specific number of miles, getting guaranteed charge/discharge cycles that are computer ahead of time by a master algorithm. The cost savings would be _dramatic_ for a company like UPS. You could even build one without resizing the existing Model S parts.
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
There was already FedEX/UPS style walk in vans using Tesla batteries 3 years ago:
http://www.greencarcongress.com/201...van-chassis-debuts-at-ntea-work-truck-sh.html
http://www.greencarcongress.com/201...van-chassis-debuts-at-ntea-work-truck-sh.html
Al Sherman
It's about THIS car.
Guess I'm not following? I would think acceptance might be a little slow but eventually these are the exact people that would jump all over a Tesla pickup? What am I missing?
There is a huge gap between perception and reality in most owners. In Europe for instance, it is typical to tow large RV's on very small vehicles. Europe is able to this very successfully due to higher regulations and lower speed. In America the marketing has been centered that you need a very big vehicle to tow relatively small items. Most cars in the US don't have even have tow ratings anymore.
This behavior is enforced when every time there is a big 3 pickup article written, they do 0-60 testing with 10,000 lbs trailers up 15% grades. Only after passing these incredible and unfeasible worst case test does the magazine then say this is the best pickup truck around. At that point selecting your truck is a bragging right so people can feel good about their purchase, when in actuality a Subaru Outback could have probably towed their boat just as safely.
Now saying that I think with time perception can be changed if you hit the right triggers. For instance a pickup that can do 0-60 mph in 5 seconds with high torque could be a very good selling point provided the other numbers don't suffer too terribly (mostly range with acceptable fast DC charging in remote area's). If gas prices rise, the TCO factor can seep into the truck buying public very quickly, especially if days continue to be like yesterday when it took $100 to fill my f150 for 3 days of driving.
I don't think anyone can do 3 DAYS worth of driving in anything for $100. I can do 8 hours of driving for that price and I do not have a gas guzzler but I do use premium gas.
I think three days worth of typical driving activity. So... commuting to work, errands, etc.
Al Sherman
It's about THIS car.
Points well taken. However, I'm still not sure what AWDtsla is getting at. I can show you at least a 100 people in our small town that use their truck to haul things in the bed. They never tow anything.They never drive more than 100 miles in a day and get 12 mpg at 4 bucks a gallon. Their trucks are anywhere from 40-60k new.The Tesla truck would be ideal for these folks. Work trucks.
If you're wanting to tow the boat, or trailer to the lake 700 miles away without stopping to charge it wasn't ever gonna work.
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