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Tesla replacing ultrasonic sensors with Tesla Vision
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Removing the USS (or any other functionality, for that matter) from new cars is bad but the customer has informed choice - they can always not accept delivery (I know that this is grossly simplified).
Removing functionality from existing fleet is a whole other matter because the change happens after customer made the decision. I am not a lawyer but at some point the product becomes substantially different and the customer could make a case that would have materially impacted their decision to buy it - the infamous “bait and switch”.
BTW: if you follow the used cars sites there are already questions about the Tesla firmware, implying that there is some preference to older firmware. The closest case I could think of is Sony using OS update to disable the ability to install Linux on PS3. PS3 consoles with older OS were selling for higher amount than those with newer OS.
Removing functionality from existing fleet is a whole other matter because the change happens after customer made the decision. I am not a lawyer but at some point the product becomes substantially different and the customer could make a case that would have materially impacted their decision to buy it - the infamous “bait and switch”.
BTW: if you follow the used cars sites there are already questions about the Tesla firmware, implying that there is some preference to older firmware. The closest case I could think of is Sony using OS update to disable the ability to install Linux on PS3. PS3 consoles with older OS were selling for higher amount than those with newer OS.
LOL. Back to the futureI guess I'm going to need to hang a tennis ball in my garage so I can park my upcoming Model Y.
Here's a question that I'm not sure anyone know the answer to, aside from Tesla Vision, are there any other tech, car or not that does this technology that Tesla is going to achieve with Tesla Vision? Radar is tried and tested, there are limitations of course.
Right now, with both camera and USS, the car can't even do 360 view. I'm trying to figure out how, with the same camera, less hardware (USS) will Tesla Vision be able to do the same if not MORE than what it can currently do. Is there some magic software that Tesla is building that is out of this world?
Right now, with both camera and USS, the car can't even do 360 view. I'm trying to figure out how, with the same camera, less hardware (USS) will Tesla Vision be able to do the same if not MORE than what it can currently do. Is there some magic software that Tesla is building that is out of this world?
Some may recall that, years ago, Tesla filed for FCC waiver for an in-cabin radar (different from the exterior radar), which were primarily being used to detect children in the vehicle.
Based on the FCC filing, these in-cabin units “may be able to scan up to 2 meters (approximately 6 feet) outside of the vehicle”.
I wonder if Tesla is planning to use these in cabin units to help replace USS functionality.
Based on the FCC filing, these in-cabin units “may be able to scan up to 2 meters (approximately 6 feet) outside of the vehicle”.
I wonder if Tesla is planning to use these in cabin units to help replace USS functionality.
Virtually no chance. Tesla's design philosophy is to simplify the car by removing parts that can be made redundant. It makes the car less expensive to build and improves reliability. Adding radars (or any other new sensors) to camera assemblies goes against that philosophy. Time will tell if they are correct in this case.
You would think that if the car is less expensive to build, the price would be cheaper but it's the other way around. Reliability is a nicer angle to push tho. In terms of the reality of banking on cameras to do all these features, I'm still on the fence.
CharleyBC
Active Member
Yes, though I'm not sure how simple it would be in fact. But Sentry Mode costs battery, so this proposed functionality would be similarly expensive. Already Sentry won't initiate if the charge level is below 20%. If they still imposed that 20% cut-off for Watching-For-New-Stuff-While-Parked Mode, then I suppose when you go to start the car after returning, it could give a message like, "Please walk around your car before departing." Which people would ignore. Unless it made sure you got out of your seat and watched you make a circuit. Weird.
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
The technology is right in the announcement:
"Along with the removal of USS, we have simultaneously launched our vision-based occupancy network – currently used in Full Self-Driving (FSD) Beta – to replace the inputs generated by USS."
Tesla Vision Update: Replacing Ultrasonic Sensors with Tesla Vision | Tesla Support
More details on occupancy network in this post:
Tesla replacing ultrasonic sensors with Tesla Vision
Pictures of what is possible with this technology (second picture is from Tesla bot, which may be more what the occupancy network at slow speeds may show):
In the latest update, there is evidence Tesla is already testing out replacing the USS data with occupancy network data in the cars without USS.
Tesla replacing ultrasonic sensors with Tesla Vision
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stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
I don't see the need for that, given the USS sensors were not designed to prevent running over low objects in the first place. People that curbed the front of their car on parking blocks should be well aware of this. It also won't prevent you from running over a crawling child for example, as the detection is for objects above about 8 inches, as per the limitations:
Model 3 Owner's Manual | Tesla
The USS are designed for the car approaching large stationary objects (like walls or other vehicles).
When you are backing out, you have the rear facing cameras. Going forward is the only case that something can slip in, but I doubt anyone really relies on USS pings before driving forward. You see what is in front of your car when approaching it.
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USS also provides zero coverage between the front and rear wheels (if the concern is dynamic objects moving into the car's path).
There are USS inside the Falcon Wing Doors, and on the roof. Probably not much help with parking, but they are there.
Who knows? The problem is we are hearing and speculating about all these different hardware and software changes. So, if I order a car today will it be the same car if I order it in 6 months? There is NO consistency. It's all a moving target
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
I do, but I park pulling in (so occupancy network can use object permanence to judge distance to cabinets in front in that scenario). I rarely park backing in (the only case where pulling forward from car asleep would apply, as per comment I was responding to), but when I do, I don't envision a scenario where the front USS pings would matter (especially given the limitations described).
The pull forward from sleep scenario that I would most commonly encounter is a 90 degree parking spot I backed into. But in that case when I approach the car, I can see what is in front of it, I'm not relying on USS pings to tell me.
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