Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[jerry33]

Here is the official Ford announcement:

FORD EV CUSTOMERS TO GAIN ACCESS TO 12,000 TESLA SUPERCHARGERS; COMPANY TO ADD NORTH AMERICAN CHARGING STANDARD PORT IN FUTURE EVS

Adapter is supposed to go into production next year.

It is sounding like use of that adapter will be limited to Fords, and that anybody can't just buy the adapter and use it with another brand. So Ford must be paying Tesla something to allow access to the entire Supercharger network to the vehicles that they sell.

1. I thought that the NACS was open to all. Tesla will charge by the kW as always. Tesla will have to supply the software to Ford.
2. Now that Ford has broken the ice, expect others to follow.

 

[T3SLAROD]

Tesla will be in business for a long time

Expect Ford to build a future light pickup for Tesla

 

[MD70]

How much profit could Tesla make from each charge by a non Tesla vehicle?

 

[Webeevdrivers]

Many believe it will eventually hurt Tesla car sales. As the charging network is typically in the top 3 of reasons to buy a Tesla.

Hard to say. We are pretty loyal tesla custumers and they have treated us good. But with this news I’m thinking that next week we’ll be taking a ford lightning for a test drive… just for giggles and grins.

 

[MP3Mike]

1. I thought that the NACS was open to all.

The NACS connector standard is open to all, anyone can use it. The Supercharger network is not open to all, even if your vehicle has a NACS connector.

 

[T3SLAROD]

How much profit could Tesla make from each charge by a non Tesla vehicle?

Not sure but I am sure there is profit from the adapters, software and future Fords using Tesla charger port

 

[replicant]

1) You gotta download the Tesla app to use the charging network.

Will that still be the case once the Ford partnership is in place?

 

[Webeevdrivers]

So it’s not clear. Will ALL superchargers be open to fords or just select superchargers?

 

[uscbucsfan]

The NACS connector standard is open to all, anyone can use it. The Supercharger network is not open to all, even if your vehicle has a NACS connector.

That's pretty recent, though. Previously when "all Tesla patents were open", there was a huge catch that the company using them had to share their IPs to Tesla. Basically, none were open.

 

[Ogre]

The Ford owners and many others I see online are saying...why would anyone buy a Tesla now? But, Ford or Tesla isn't for everyone. I do think it will slightly reduce sales of Teslas in the future.

They haven't been paying attention to Tesla's mission then.

The idea that Tesla would lock up their Supercharger network in order to secure a competitive advantage for their auto-business is against Tesla's core principals. I know a lot of people don't "Get" this, but it is very much part of the culture at Tesla from top to bottom.

Besides... Tesla gets to buy power at $0.08 - $0.20/ kWh and sell it at $0.35 - $0.60/ kWh and lots of it. How can people not see this is also profitable?

 

[bkp_duke]

There are lots of reasons everybody won't switch to buying a Ford instead of a Tesla. How many vehicles did Tesla sell last quarter? How many did Ford make?

Maybe because they don't like Ford? Maybe they don't like the EVs Ford offers? Maybe they don't want to pay a dealer tax to buy an EV? Maybe Ford can't make enough to meet demand, and they can't wait?

Heads are exploding over in the MachE forum (don't go there, trust me).

Some feel betrayed. Some are delighted. Some that were complaining that Ford needed a better charging network but hated Elon are just flat out pissed off.

Overall, well-received, but it's so damned funny to watch the tribalism (like a certain thread here). People get what they want, but are pissed off about who is Santa Claus.

 

[bkp_duke]

Simple.

1) You gotta download the Tesla app to use the charging network. now you have the Tesla logo on your phone always and subconsciously admit it's good/useful.

2) Tesla now has a bunch of data on you and can sell you on its cars with discounts/deals.

3) Tesla gets more IRA $$$$ if a critical mass switch over to NACS.

4) Puts other charging networks out of business and results in Tesla basically becoming the EV gas station monopoly over the entire country.

5) You're at a Supercharger network and talk with Tesla owners while the car charges now.

Twitter spaces specifically it was noted that Ford has Tesla Supercharger API access and is programming their app so that Ford owners will be able to charge at superchargers with their own app.

 

[MP3Mike]

1) You gotta download the Tesla app to use the charging network. now you have the Tesla logo on your phone always and subconsciously admit it's good/useful.

Will that still be the case once the Ford partnership is in place?

No, it sounds like they can just use the FordPass app.

• Mustang Mach-E, F-150 Lightning and E-Transit customers will be able to access the Superchargers via an adapter and software integration along with activation and payment via FordPass or Ford Pro Intelligence

 

[uscbucsfan]

Most Ford's still won't be able to use Tesla Chargers without taking up 2 spaces. The chord isn't long enough.

 

[MP3Mike]

So it’s not clear. Will ALL superchargers be open to fords or just select superchargers?

Well the announcement says more than 12,000 Superchargers in North America. So it sounds like all of them. (Compared to the over 3,500 that Tesla said they would open to all, likely with the MagicDock, by the end of next year.)

• Starting early next year, Ford EV customers will have access to more than 12,000 Tesla Superchargers across the U.S. and Canada, in addition to the over 10,000 DC fast-chargers that are already part of the BlueOval Charge Network. This will give Ford EV customers unprecedented access to fast-charging

Most Ford's still won't be able to use Tesla Chargers without taking up 2 spaces. The chord isn't long enough.

Maybe the adapter will be a cable long enough to resolve that.

 

[Todd Burch]

How much profit could Tesla make from each charge by a non Tesla vehicle?

I remember now that I think Elon said that the goal for Supercharger margins will be in the 20% range...am I remembering that right?

 

[Ogre]

People get what they want, but are pissed off about who is Santa Claus.

Maybe my favorite quote in this thread for a while. So many there likely bought a crappier car to avoid giving Musk money and now they will be regardless.

 

[MikeC]

Tesla will have a near monopoly on fast charging and can raise prices at will. How can being the de facto standard of the fuel of the future not be a good thing? Tesla was never going to sell 100% of EVs.

Just as important is this validates legacy using Tesla tech. We haven’t had that since the RAV4 and B-class so many years ago. If Ford is going to use the Tesla chargeport they might as well use the battery, power train, and autopilot, too.

 

[Todd Burch]

It might go a long way if Elon sent a Tweet out clarifying how this will benefit TSLA shareholders--without spilling what are obviously private details. We know Tesla will profit from this deal, sure. But if Tesla is aiming to just make a little bit of a profit, the loss of the Supercharger moat could hurt more than help overall. Especially since TSLA shareholders have been rubbed in the dirt the last 1.5 years, it would be nice to get a little bump.

 

[bkp_duke]

Maybe my favorite quote in this thread for a while. So many there likely bought a crappier car to avoid giving Musk money and now they will be regardless.

This quote from over there pretty much sums up their conflict:
"
Honestly, I am both "the Tesla supercharging network is excellent," and "Do I really want more of my money funding Elon Musk and the hateful things he says and does?"

From a tech standpoint, this is a smart move. The Tesla connector is smaller, lighter, and more streamlined than CCS connectors. But from a moral standpoint, I get why some people are very disappointed in this move."