Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[FreqFlyer]

I think it’s not going through cause it’s a billion dollars a mile and slow, not fast.

And NIMBYs, apparently no one wants a clean mode of transportation (though noisy) in their backyard.

California’s Bullet Train Goes Off the Rails

"California had its own unique problem: intransigence from a small but vocal set of opponents. The high-speed rail project has been under a mile-by-mile assault. Cascading lawsuits and NIMBY-like resistance to the train’s presence dragged out the timeline, which just through inflation and surging land costs increased the price tag. It’s been a familiar two-step: opponents use available tools to grind projects to a halt, thereby ballooning costs. And then they complain that the projects cost too much."

Like I stated, ironic, isn't?

Just Google it.

 

[RobStark]

I think it’s not going through cause it’s a billion dollars a mile and slow, not fast.

A large part of the reason it is slow and expensive is NIMBYism.

People don't want the sound going through their neighborhoods forcing proposed train to slow down.

Endless lawsuits and forced changes to route adding cost.

 

[keydiver]

I may have to eat a little crow here - they're giving free supercharging for life, OR the 2 free options.

I believe the free lifetime supercharging is only for S and X, right? I was only promised 2 years of free supercharging if I took delivery of my Model 3 before 10/1.

 

[StealthP3D]

Agree. Rich ppl/nations are doing more damage to environment than the poor.

That's only true when measured per capita. Working-class people comprise the vast majority of pollution overall because they comprise most people.

 

[Pezpunk]

You don't have to be affluent to be a homeowner!

you do in northern virginia. there's 6 million people living in the metro area, and the average home price is $587,000.

 

[Pezpunk]

In Australia some units come with a parking space, but it’s equally common and much the same price to buy/rent a unit with a lock up garage, with 240V power (for the roller door if nothing else).

As EVs become a cost saver, demand for the latter will increase. Landlords/developers of the former will be pushed/forced to add power to parking spaces to compete for tenants. The invisible hand of the market will sort it out.

the invisible hand of the market favors the status quo and takes the path of least resistance. relying on the invisible hand of the market to sort it out on its own is the best way to guarantee you won't change the world.

 

[MarcusMaximus]

And NIMBYs, apparently no one wants a clean mode of transportation (though noisy) in their backyard.

California’s Bullet Train Goes Off the Rails

"California had its own unique problem: intransigence from a small but vocal set of opponents. The high-speed rail project has been under a mile-by-mile assault. Cascading lawsuits and NIMBY-like resistance to the train’s presence dragged out the timeline, which just through inflation and surging land costs increased the price tag. It’s been a familiar two-step: opponents use available tools to grind projects to a halt, thereby ballooning costs. And then they complain that the projects cost too much."

Like I stated, ironic, isn't?

Just Google it.

This is where Hyperloop would really shine. Not only faster than high speed rail, but it would also be much quieter, being both completely enclosed and ultra-low pressure.

 

[MC3OZ]

the invisible hand of the market favors the status quo and takes the path of least resistance. relying on the invisible hand of the market to sort it out on its own is the best way to guarantee you won't change the world.

I'm not sure why you think Urban Superchargers will not work, or why tenants will not look for a rental property with a charging option.

To be clear Urban Superchargers are the short term fix.

If Telsa is tardy in building them in areas where they are needed, that may delay sales...

For other brands of EVs the solution is less clear...

In the long run all swimming pools, libraries, gyms and car parks should have EV charging..

 

[Carl Raymond]

the invisible hand of the market favors the status quo and takes the path of least resistance. relying on the invisible hand of the market to sort it out on its own is the best way to guarantee you won't change the world.

If that was true, units would not have internet ports. Every landlord knows he/she gets a better rental providing the services tenants expect.

If govt wants to get involved, they should tax-break installation of workplace charging. The win is bigger, because the cars then get charged with “duck curve”, essentially free, solar.

Edit: Robotaxis render this discussion largely moot.

 

[MarcusMaximus]

you do in northern virginia. there's 6 million people living in the metro area, and the average home price is $587,000.

This person from Santa Clara County says: Ha. Ha. Ha.

 

[MC3OZ]

If that was true, units would not have internet ports. Every landlord knows he/she gets a better rental providing the services tenants expect.

If govt wants to get involved, they should tax-break installation of workplace charging. The win is bigger, because the cars then get charged with “duck curve”, essentially free, solar.

IMO Urban Supercharging is a great short-cut...

And all car parks can make money installing fast charging of various types...

These "public space" solutions are initially quicker...

When I was a young lad I used to work with a electrician wiring up houses... the number of power outlets in a typical house today is 2-3 X or more.... expectations and standards change over time...

A lot of units/apartments have underground garages, running new power lines on the walls in conduit is no big deal, it will not look neat, but it will be functional. We may even see a return to an older generation of coin in the slot, or credit card based charging if the line has to be shared..

Everything costs money, but that hasn't stopped houses getting bigger and having more lights and power points..

In the long run "Urban Supercharging" is break-even for Tesla, and will be handy even when most apartments have their own charging..

 

[samppa]

I'm not sure why you think Urban Superchargers will not work, or why tenants will not look for a rental property with a charging option.

To be clear Urban Superchargers are the short term fix.

If Telsa is tardy in building them in areas where they are needed, that may delay sales...

For other brands of EVs the solution is less clear...

In the long run all swimming pools, libraries, gyms and car parks should have EV charging..

This is happening here, a couple charging points at a time, but more coming all the time. But they are a bit costly, say at my local swimming pool the 11kw charger costs about double what I pay for home. Still very cheap compared to gasoline..

Lack of home charging creates one usability problem with Tesla: you can never time it so that battery is 100% in the morning, so you either only charge to 90% and have to maybe plan a quick stop, or charge to full in the evening and let it sit overnight at 100%.
I didn't have home charging for first 6 months of owning Model S, and this was really the only real inconvenience. Esp in winter if I wanted to preheat the car b4 leaving.

 

[TSLA Pilot]

There are very nice people that don’t live on the internet and know nothing about Tesla... so they go ahead and buy what they already know. Believe me, not everyone uses Twitter and knows what an Elon Musk is. How are they part of the problem? They will buy an EV when their neighbors buy one though

These are so apropos that I'll post them both:

Our species needs, and deserves, a citizenry with minds wide awake and a basic understanding of how the world works.

And:

We have also arranged things so that almost no one understands science and technology. This is a prescription for disaster. We might get away with it for a while, but sooner or later this combustible mixture of ignorance and power is going to blow up in our faces.
-Carl Sagan

"How are they part of the problem?" Are you serious in asking that question?

Because they're either dumber than a box of rocks, or so far beyond ignorant that they should be removed from the gene pool before they can do any more damage.

That's how they're "part of the problem."

 

[SpaceCash]

These are so apropos that I'll post them both:

Our species needs, and deserves, a citizenry with minds wide awake and a basic understanding of how the world works.

And:

We have also arranged things so that almost no one understands science and technology. This is a prescription for disaster. We might get away with it for a while, but sooner or later this combustible mixture of ignorance and power is going to blow up in our faces.
-Carl Sagan

"How are they part of the problem?" Are you serious in asking that question?

Because they're either dumber than a box of rocks, or so far beyond ignorant that they should be removed from the gene pool before they can do any more damage.

That's how they're "part of the problem."

That's a little hardcore, m8. I agree with the general sentiment but you're literally implying we need to purge these people death-squad style towards the end and that's pretty crazy

 

[Tslynk67]

He has apparently been a fellow member of TMC for more than ten months, but has never posted: Niedermeyer

Wd need more like that on this thread, no?

 

[Stars aligned]

Non-affluent people will begin buying Teslas en mass when charging stations become ubiquitous at apartment complexes and not one second sooner. It is by far the number one reason all the young people I know have declined to buy one after riding in mine, and in many cases the ONLY thing stopping them. But it IS a deal breaker for almost all of them. Tesla really ought to be making some kind of huge push to electrify apartment parking spaces.

The model 3 is firmly aimed at that demographic, but the vast majority absolutely will not buy one if they can’t charge it at home. I’m speaking from dozens of first-hand conversations here.

They wouldn’t have to be superchargers - simple 240v chargers would be fine.

Parking spots in new apartment houses should be required to have charging infrastructure, 400 or 240v. Should be part of the building permit process.

This would not only be good for aspirational EV owners, but also grid loading balance once EV batteries are good enough to serve as grid buffers.

 

[CorneliusXX]

I'm not sure why you think Urban Superchargers will not work, or why tenants will not look for a rental property with a charging option.

To be clear Urban Superchargers are the short term fix.

If Telsa is tardy in building them in areas where they are needed, that may delay sales...

For other brands of EVs the solution is less clear...

In the long run all swimming pools, libraries, gyms and car parks should have EV charging..

Moreover, given the number of people who park on the street, there will likely be a need for some level of urban supercharging for a long time. It's far easier and more convenient than building slow charging in every other parking space.

 

[jbcarioca]

Anybody who thinks there is a finite limit to European demand for Tesla needs to actually experience Tesla driving in areas thought resistant to EV adoption, like Italy, Slovenia and Croatia. Public EV infrastructure is already established and poised for far more growth as adoption grows. Superchargers and Destination Chargers are widespread. Enthusiasm is clearly high. I suspect most residents in these parts of Europe underestimate just how prevalent options already are. I have met several Tesla owners during this trip who were surprised about some of these locations. For more:
Tesla Road Trip: Renting in Italy
The challenges now are distribution and after-sale support. Tesla stores are rare in the whole of these regions. Charging infrastructure is already quite plentiful, although more is needed urgently as Model 3 has just started deliveries in, for example, Slovenia. That country is small but has allegedly the per-capita highest luxury car penetration in Europe. The first European giga-factory cannot come soon enough.

I depart tomorrow with the strong impression that I need to buy more TSLA.

 

[Fact Checking]

He has apparently been a fellow member of TMC for more than ten months, but has never posted: Niedermeyer

A person calling himself Ed Niedermeyer apparently created that account to write the following TMC message to me, approximately 10 months ago, with various ways to contact him:

"Niedermeyer, Oct 26, 2018

Are you Elon Musk?

Hey Fact Checking, I'm a reporter for Automotive News. Sorry to bother you here, but I didn't know how else to reach you.

I couldn't help but notice that a lot of people in the Market Action thread think you are Elon Musk and you haven't really denied it. I've also read through a lot of your posts, and I totally see why people think you are Elon. In fact, it's pretty tough to imagine who else you might be. And it's not just me... my editors find the evidence convincing enough to have asked me to write a story about the situation.

So I pretty much have to just blurt it out: are you Elon Musk? More specifically, does Elon Musk or anyone who works for him directly or indirectly post from the "Fact Checking" account?

If I have the wrong end of the stick here and the answer to both of the above questions is "no," I have no interest in doxxing a non-public-figure. If there is no public news interest in the identity of the person or people behind the "Fact Checking" account and you can prove it, I would keep any personally-identifying information you share confidential. That said, I do need some kind of evidence one way or another.

If you are not Elon I think the best way to proceed would be for you to give me a call or text at five four one five two zero five six two two (Signal or Whatsapp are fine if you prefer), or drop me an email at edward.niedermeyer [at] gmail [dot] com and/or eniedermeyer [at] crain [dot] com.

If you are Elon, it should be super easy to prove. You could call me, email me from a Tesla or SpaceX account or even just tweet something about Vienna so I know this is you.

Thanks in advance for getting back to me about this.

Ed Niedermeyer"​

(I never tried to call or text the (+1)-5415205622 number, or tried to contact the [email protected] or [email protected] email addresses to verify whether that's Edward Niedermeyer or not, so these might just be fake and part of an elaborate prank.)

So this message is why someone claiming to be the "Tesla Deathwatch" guy has an account on TMC apparently, and no, I'm not Elon, nor connected to him in any direct or indirect fashion.

I'm really curious how Niedermeyer is going to explain his past views about Tesla in a couple of years, should Tesla reach 1 trillion dollars in market valuation.

 

[Steve m]

There is a finite limit to the number of Teslas that can be sold in Europe no one person needs more then 3 brand new ones each year.

The population of Europe is about 740 million so an upward limit on sales per year would be 2.2 billion.

I expect the maximum number of sales though to be a tad smaller