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UK Model 3 order page open!
- Thread starter NorfolkMustard
- Start date
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
I've been xpecting significant competition for the last 24 months ... each "offerign" has a) been dissappointing and b) TEsla had a bit up its sleeve that it has rolled out moving the goal posts even further towards the horizon.
Go Tesla!
Sell, Rent, Buy? I have absolutely no idea if that is a good idea ... and doubt you haven't considered it.
interbear
Active Member
In all the research I’m doing currently I keep coming back to Tesla vs other options. 3 primary reasons:
1) Much better charging network
2) Longer range
3) Tech updates after buying the car
As a pure EV manufacturer rather than a ICE manufacturer trying not to compromise their existing ICE business when switching to electric, Tesla have both a head start and a resolute focus that make them the most compelling proposition today. And I think this will still be the case in a couple of years as other EV manufacturers seem so constrained by the limited and overly complex charging networks that they have to use. The supercharger network is a real USP for Tesla in my opinion, worth the premium.
I'm awaiting an order and it's tesla for very similar reasons.
However I think range and charging infrastructure are quite inter-related. Sell a car with more range and it relies much less on the charging infrastructure (assuming nearly all of them are home charged of course, which will be a wrong assumption soon but while the EV numbers are tiny it remains mostly valid). Which it makes it all the sillier to my mind that the others are so obsessed with big SUVs and therefore can't match tesla range.
The reason they're obsessed with big SUVs is that it's easier to build a car in that class that is not developed as an EV from the ground up without appearing completely ridiculous. It's not a coincidence that the VW ID.3 is not something you can drive now but the Audi E-tron is.
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
Good point.
I've got a MS 90D which does 250 miles range (real world, 75 MPH on dual carriageway, UK roads, some traffic/roadworks [extending range] is almost inevitable.
An older 100D would be 300 miles, and the new better-motors 2019 100D I guess 350 miles. Next iteration (bigger battery / more energy density / less weight) might get me to 400 miles.
On all of them I need reserve of 20 miles "comfort" and that becomes a smaller percentage, offering "more real range".
My current 250 mile range means 2 days a month when I am out-of-range.
At 400 miles that would be maybe one a year ...
Of course this depends on journey-mix. Some people will never drive out of 200 mile range, let alone ned 400 mile range. I think UK [compared to USA or even EU] has more drivers typically doing out-and-back days that exceed range, rather than drive-charge-drive-charge trans continental journeys. So in UK that would be journeys out-of-range visiting a Relation / Client.
Journeys vising a relation may not justify bigger battery to avoid charging (that changes as price of battery comes down). I put up with any amount of charging hassle on leisure journeys, but for me visiting a Client is a different ball of wax. I do not want to be late, so (personally) I need range enough to get to client AND back to supercharger, so any charging is on return leg, where delays (all stalls occupied / having to pair / reduced kW) are non-consequential. I can do email, so the delay is time-neutral for me - less emails to do when I am back in office / home.
I am happy to pay £10K more sticker price for 50 more miles range, 100 miles more range is even more attractive. I'm not paying £10K / 50 miles = £200 per mile !! I am paying to reduce / avoid road charge several times a month. And actually I only have to pay for 50% of the £10K being the deprecated resale value.
So £10 * 50% = £5K over 36 months is £140 a month. I know my charge out rate
but I don't know the average for a average Travelling Salesman. Rule of thumb seems to be about 3x salary, so I reckon 1 hour saved per month would be around £80-90K salary, but someone on £40K would need to save 2 hours a month - that's a lot of trips where additional 50 mile range makes enough difference to avoid charging that would save 2 hours a month.I would certainly save 1 hour a month if I swapped to a current 350 mile range Model-S, and I'm sat on the fence trying to judge the optimum moment to do that ...
Still having the Free Performance Upgrade would be nice
...having CCS port would be nice (although CCS adaptor must run a very close second on new models). Do I need / want the Cabin Refresh? I might hate it ... early adopters may find it buggy ... but if I am a late buyer of old model I might get lousy depreciation ... I suppose I'll sit on the fence a bit longer.
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
If it's designed as an EV from the ground up, it wasn't done particularly well ;-). Yeah, it's also more or less an ICE design with an electric motor crammed in it. Actually, it's a bit half of one, half of the other (the frunk is slightly less pathetic than on an E-tron, which is one indication, but the weight is also less ridiculously large for the interior space).
But more to the point: it's large, a lot larger than a Zoe, Kona or ID.3, which lets you sweep your lack of experience at designing EVs a bit more under the carpet.
Except for its less austere interior (an E-Tron interior is typical Audi and quite depressing if you just come from an i-Pace ;-) ), I prefer the E-tron to the i-Pace. You have almost as much range anxiety (don't be fooled by the WLTP "mixed cycle" numbers; the efficiency on motorways is poor compared to that of Teslas so it's even worse than it looks), but at least you have a trunk that's really a lot larger.
Frankly, except for the trunk in which you can stack things higher and the higher driving position (and high rear seats...the Model 3 rear seats isn't the easiest to access for older people because they are so low), I'd much rather have a Model 3 than an i-Pace, and Model S and X are a lot more spacious. Subjectively it has just the same amount of interior space as a model 3 (although the model 3 cheats with its glass roof).
Of course the model 3 interior is more "minimalist Scandinavian kitchen" than "living room in a Victorian house". I'm in two minds about that: the model 3 interior feels less luxurious, but it's got its own charm and looking through the windshield with barely an obstacle in sight is striking.
But more to the point: it's large, a lot larger than a Zoe, Kona or ID.3, which lets you sweep your lack of experience at designing EVs a bit more under the carpet.
Except for its less austere interior (an E-Tron interior is typical Audi and quite depressing if you just come from an i-Pace ;-) ), I prefer the E-tron to the i-Pace. You have almost as much range anxiety (don't be fooled by the WLTP "mixed cycle" numbers; the efficiency on motorways is poor compared to that of Teslas so it's even worse than it looks), but at least you have a trunk that's really a lot larger.
Frankly, except for the trunk in which you can stack things higher and the higher driving position (and high rear seats...the Model 3 rear seats isn't the easiest to access for older people because they are so low), I'd much rather have a Model 3 than an i-Pace, and Model S and X are a lot more spacious. Subjectively it has just the same amount of interior space as a model 3 (although the model 3 cheats with its glass roof).
Of course the model 3 interior is more "minimalist Scandinavian kitchen" than "living room in a Victorian house". I'm in two minds about that: the model 3 interior feels less luxurious, but it's got its own charm and looking through the windshield with barely an obstacle in sight is striking.
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Jason71
Well-Known Member
At the end of the day we are quite a small country so our range needs should typically be less than others particularly the US. For a lot of people I think range anxiety is just a state of mind. Having to even thing about it feels like a step back when even the cheapest ICE car doesn't have to worry at all. It will take time for the paradigim shift. And as re-charge times come down it will be less and less of an issue anyway.
Personally I cover 20000 miles per year but I live in the midlands and cannot think of the last time I actually did more than 200 in a day. but I do 150ish at least twice a week.I haven't ordered anything (yet ) but if my current pattern holds, with an LR/P- I could see me basically never needing to use a supercharger even in the middle of winter. which is probably a good thing since many of my journeys are into wales which only had one last time I checked!
You're talking to a Belgian. That's not what a small coutry looks like ;-).
But yeah, if the range is "good enough" it's "good enough", at the end of the day.
But it's certainly good enough more of the time in a Model 3 LR (RWD, AWD or P), especially with the 18" wheels, whereas in an SR+ or something like an i-Pace or E-tron it might be less so.
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
I'm influenced by Bjorn's videos. Early ones had iPace with poor range at 75 MPH cruise (say 10% less then Tesla), but later ones have been much closer (he hypothesised that iPace battery supplier(s?) QA may be to blame) ... but the eTron still 10-20% behind that.
The ultimate range only matters when it matters, of course. When it matters there are other consequences: not many 100+ kW chargers, very few 350+kW chargers (but they will make a difference to refuelling of course ... but Tesla V3 Supercharger has started rollout). Poor efficiency means a) longer charging and also b) the formula of "drive faster, charge longer = shortest journey time" does not hold true for higher speeds (and requires fast 3rd party charger, which may not be available)
Tesla folk know all this of course, so I'm probably typing to myself!
I wonder how many times a year Americans actually do the drive-charge-drive-charge thing. I do that once a year when we go skiing (we prefer drive to fly). Surely Americans, too, must have range-challenging out-and-back days? It can't be that all days are in range, except we "Drive to Florida for our holiday" ?
Don't forget NOT having to refuel your ICE. That's probably around 8 hours a year on smelly, wet, cold forecourts ... longer if you like to fill up at Supermarkets where you first have to join a car-queue ...
LOL, yeah. I was happy enough to pay a fraction under £60k for it until they bottled it and dropped the price. I'm certainly not paying over the odds for it now. Also I never really wanted to be driving around our pot-holed country roads on 20" rims with O-ring tyres. But I do want the straight line acceleration, so a P- on 18" aero wheels is now perfect for me and puts nearly £8k back in my pocket. Icing on the cake would be a tow bar option, but I can live without and just use our MX for bike trips.
My local Tesla sales guy is now trying to make it happen for me, but with financing in a mess I'm more inclined to wait it out until early next year. I will still get one though, I think it's a great looking car and the performance is stunning.
RjbT3
Member
Hello again,
Just a quick update on my order status.
Spec: LR-AWD/18"/BLACK/WHITE IN/FSD
Reservation: 3/4/16
Ordered: 7/5/19
I still don't have a delivery date confirmed.
I received an email yesterday from Tesla (Customer Support Specialist – Delivery UK). I was enquiring if my delivery date would be affected because I had selected HP in the payment option but hadn't bothered getting approved due to waiting for the PCP option to appear for comparison purposes.
Here is the reply in writing from Tesla:
"I can confirm this will not affect your delivery date and there is nothing more you are required to do at this stage.
With regards to payment method, please note PCP will not be offered at all for Model 3."
So there you have it. No PCP option for Model 3. I expect this could be down to changing pricing structures and/or resulting uncertainty surrounding residual values. Possibly many more reasons.
For me I still have HP or lease as an option if I'd prefer those, but also a lease option with a company I am in dialogue with so it doesn't affect me all that much. I'm certainly still buying the car. I just wish I had a delivery date because I was a fairly early reservation holder.
However, I would imagine Tesla will see a reduction in demand as PCP is such a popular option for buying new in the UK these days.
Just a quick update on my order status.
Spec: LR-AWD/18"/BLACK/WHITE IN/FSD
Reservation: 3/4/16
Ordered: 7/5/19
I still don't have a delivery date confirmed.
I received an email yesterday from Tesla (Customer Support Specialist – Delivery UK). I was enquiring if my delivery date would be affected because I had selected HP in the payment option but hadn't bothered getting approved due to waiting for the PCP option to appear for comparison purposes.
Here is the reply in writing from Tesla:
"I can confirm this will not affect your delivery date and there is nothing more you are required to do at this stage.
With regards to payment method, please note PCP will not be offered at all for Model 3."
So there you have it. No PCP option for Model 3. I expect this could be down to changing pricing structures and/or resulting uncertainty surrounding residual values. Possibly many more reasons.
For me I still have HP or lease as an option if I'd prefer those, but also a lease option with a company I am in dialogue with so it doesn't affect me all that much. I'm certainly still buying the car. I just wish I had a delivery date because I was a fairly early reservation holder.
However, I would imagine Tesla will see a reduction in demand as PCP is such a popular option for buying new in the UK these days.
Hi Peteski. I just ordered the exact same spec as you last week as soon as the white interior came back. I'd be delighted to take your VIN off your hands if you don't need it!! Haha. Maybe I should contact my local Delivery Centre to see if they can do something. I expect though I'm last in line in a long queue. I just heard the first UK boat is one its way for those who ordered early. Cheers Andrew.
I have it in writing that my car cannot be uncorked and that the problem with my front parking sensors intermittently not working in the rain was hardware, when I said it was software.
My car is now uncorked and a software update cured the rain sensor problem. Just two examples of the unintentional misinformation Tesla dish out with regularity.
PCP will be available for the Model 3, it’s just a question of when.
RjbT3
Member
I have no idea what uncorked means, but diagnosing faults is different to setting policy for finance arrangements. I do accept though that the employee who wrote the email about PCP could have been misinformed by a colleague.
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
Tesla improved performance of all non-performance-mode cars from around 5s 0-60MPH to 4-ish seconds. It was exactly the same chaos of misinformation as PCP - "No Sir, Uncorking isn't applicable to your car for reason XXX" ... and then a week or two later Tesla started uncorking Models with XXX option but "No Sir, your model has YYY and can't be uncorked" made those users livid ... the reality was that all cars were uncorked within what was only a few elapsed-weeks end-to-end.
There have been plenty of other, similar, poor-communication stories like that one over the years ...
I doubt that (i.e. as you have described it), seems historically to have been that:
XXX is not, currently possible
Someone higher up has decided that it is now possible
but it takes time for coal-face employees to be told / software to be changed
The "mis informed by colleague" is also possible of course, as is "employee made something up", but that is less common than "New policy not yet informed to Worker-Bees" ... sadly.
Actually, unlike some of the other changes, this one makes a degree of sense.
It's all about loading cars on a ship ahead of customers placing a firm order - the more different variants there are, the more risk that you get the mix wrong and end up with a pile of cars you can't shift, but with the trade off that if you delete popular combinations then you risk losing those orders altogether.
Luxembourg is not a small market in this context - it's the same market as Belgium/Netherlands/Germany/France as all the cars go on the same boat. UK is a reasonably large RHD market, and includes Ireland. New Zealand is a small RHD market.
My fault, apologies. Think ‘chipped’ in the ICE world but done free of charge by the manufacturer
. Well explained by @WannabeOwner except it was the 75D that got the treatment not all the non P versions.
interbear
Active Member
So wife and I went to see the Model 3 and S today in Bristol to decide which would suit us best in terms of size and budget. Model 3 won on both counts. Big enough we concluded in terms of storage space. Cabin seemed spacious too, the minimalist design opens it up nicely.
So, having originally wanted the LR AWD that is no longer available to order, it looks like we are heading toward the basic Performance model with 18 inch aero wheels. I don’t want the 20 inch wheels and lower suspension of the performance upgrade pack given the state of UK roads . Deliberating now over colour and interior options which surely means we’ve nearly made a decision Red or blue the current favourites, I think the red looks best with the Aeros (cover on or off) based on pictures I’ve seen so far. Not seen one “live” yet other than the metallic grey in the Cribbs store, it’s a nice colour but I’d prefer something different. Black interior also good with the red exterior I think.
Anyway, getting closer to making that reservation online.
So, having originally wanted the LR AWD that is no longer available to order, it looks like we are heading toward the basic Performance model with 18 inch aero wheels. I don’t want the 20 inch wheels and lower suspension of the performance upgrade pack given the state of UK roads . Deliberating now over colour and interior options which surely means we’ve nearly made a decision
Red or blue the current favourites, I think the red looks best with the Aeros (cover on or off) based on pictures I’ve seen so far. Not seen one “live” yet other than the metallic grey in the Cribbs store, it’s a nice colour but I’d prefer something different. Black interior also good with the red exterior I think. Anyway, getting closer to making that reservation online.
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