Western Canada Superchargers

[jrreno]

So we are planning a trip this summer which puts us in Vancouver in July. We plan to travel to Banff and then down to Kalispell Montana where we'll be staying for a couple days in a place with a destination charger.
Any advice from our Canadian friends or others that have taken a similar route?

 

[Paul Carter]

So we are planning a trip this summer which puts us in Vancouver in July. We plan to travel to Banff and then down to Kalispell Montana where we'll be staying for a couple days in a place with a destination charger.
Any advice from our Canadian friends or others that have taken a similar route?

I think by then you'll have no issues at all. The route is covered all by Superchargers except your last part right now (but looks like plans to have something there on the 2017 map).

Hope to Kamloops right now is quite the leg requiring a lot of range, but soon should have 1/2 way filled in at Merritt, so it won't be bad once that opens. There are options in Merritt if you get into trouble (CHAdeMO, HPWC, other L2 charging options). The hill out of Hope up the Coquihalla can eat up range like no tomorrow and speed is 120 kph (~ 75 mph). Great and beautiful drive.

Enjoy and feel free to ping if you are in Vancouver.

 

[dasRad]

So we are planning a trip this summer which puts us in Vancouver in July. We plan to travel to Banff and then down to Kalispell Montana where we'll be staying for a couple days in a place with a destination charger.
Any advice from our Canadian friends or others that have taken a similar route?

If you do take the Coquihalla from Hope to Kamloops, chances are you will stop at the (soon to open) Supercharger near the airport in Merritt. Rather than getting back on the Coquihalla to head north to Kamloops, stay on the old Highway 5 along the east side of Nicola Lake and on into Kamloops. The drive is much, much more scenic and the Kamloops Supercharger is literally at the Kamloops end of that road (just continue across the overpass over the "freeway"). If you don't stop, it will be about 30 minutes longer than Coquihalla as the speed limit is lower.

If you are travelling through North Central Washington, Hwy 20, the North Cascade highway, is a spectacular route from Omak/Pateros west to Burlington. There is a supercharger in Burlington and Tesla's 2017 map promises new ones in Wenatchee and Tonasket (or Omak, I'm unsure). Doesn't really matter if you aren't in a hurry as JackA has spearheaded the North Central Washington high amperage L2 Charging Project (North Central Washington high amperage L2 Charging Project ) along this route.

 

[jrreno]

I think by then you'll have no issues at all. The route is covered all by Superchargers except your last part right now (but looks like plans to have something there on the 2017 map).

Hope to Kamloops right now is quite the leg requiring a lot of range, but soon should have 1/2 way filled in at Merritt, so it won't be bad once that opens. There are options in Merritt if you get into trouble (CHAdeMO, HPWC, other L2 charging options). The hill out of Hope up the Coquihalla can eat up range like no tomorrow and speed is 120 kph (~ 75 mph). Great and beautiful drive.

Enjoy and feel free to ping if you are in Vancouver.

Thanks for the insight. It is interesting that EVtripplanner doesn't flag that leg as using a lot of energy ( 155 RM, 368 wh/mi). We'll take the time to get some extra charge so we don't have any issues.

 

[jrreno]

If you do take the Coquihalla from Hope to Kamloops, chances are you will stop at the (soon to open) Supercharger near the airport in Merritt. Rather than getting back on the Coquihalla to head north to Kamloops, stay on the old Highway 5 along the east side of Nicola Lake and on into Kamloops. The drive is much, much more scenic and the Kamloops Supercharger is literally at the Kamloops end of that road (just continue across the overpass over the "freeway"). If you don't stop, it will be about 30 minutes longer than Coquihalla as the speed limit is lower.

If you are travelling through North Central Washington, Hwy 20, the North Cascade highway, is a spectacular route from Omak/Pateros west to Burlington. There is a supercharger in Burlington and Tesla's 2017 map promises new ones in Wenatchee and Tonasket (or Omak, I'm unsure). Doesn't really matter if you aren't in a hurry as JackA has spearheaded the North Central Washington high amperage L2 Charging Project (North Central Washington high amperage L2 Charging Project ) along this route.

Thank you for the ideas. We definitely will take the alternative route for the scenery. I take it route 5 is referred to as the "Coquihalla"?

 

[Dax279]

Thanks for the insight. It is interesting that EVtripplanner doesn't flag that leg as using a lot of energy ( 155 RM, 368 wh/mi). We'll take the time to get some extra charge so we don't have any issues.

Definitely take the extra charge Hope to Kamloops. I think I posted somewhere earlier that I was surprised how much more Energy I used. Although my trip was around freezing and rainy.

 

[Paul Carter]

Thanks for the insight. It is interesting that EVtripplanner doesn't flag that leg as using a lot of energy ( 155 RM, 368 wh/mi). We'll take the time to get some extra charge so we don't have any issues.

Definitely take the extra charge Hope to Kamloops. I think I posted somewhere earlier that I was surprised how much more Energy I used. Although my trip was around freezing and rainy.

EVtripplanner now looks like it has the correct speed on that leg, but I would use speed multiplier 1.1 to get a more accurate estimate. In my classic 60 I used 90% of my range (old speed limits) and in a classic P90D w/ AP1 I also used 90% (current limits). Keeping up with traffic flow you tend to go a little over the speed limit.

 

[doubeld]

I take it route 5 is referred to as the "Coquihalla"?

Yup. Phonetically, some people would call it the "Coke."

 

[green1]

Thanks for the insight. It is interesting that EVtripplanner doesn't flag that leg as using a lot of energy ( 155 RM, 368 wh/mi). We'll take the time to get some extra charge so we don't have any issues.

evtripplanner is pretty good, but the one built in to the car is completely useless for that leg, if you rely on the car's estimates for the trip over the coquihalla you'll never make it. Partially it's because the car thinks the speed limit ranges from 100-110 when in fact it's 120 the whole way, though I'm not sure if that accounts for all of it's estimating error.) Make sure you have a MINIMUM of a 20% buffer according to the car for the trip from Hope to Kamloops

 

[CalBlue 85D]

evtripplanner is pretty good, but the one built in to the car is completely useless for that leg, if you rely on the car's estimates for the trip over the coquihalla you'll never make it. Partially it's because the car thinks the speed limit ranges from 100-110 when in fact it's 120 the whole way, though I'm not sure if that accounts for all of it's estimating error.) Make sure you have a MINIMUM of a 20% buffer according to the car for the trip from Hope to Kamloops

Speaking of the 120 zones on the coquihalla, has anyone else had issues with the AP camera not correctly reading the speed limit signs above 110kmh? I've noticed this in two different cars from two different manufacturers, and neither would reliably read the speed in a 120 zone.

 

[Dax279]

I noticed that as well.

 

[cmt489]

Speaking of the 120 zones on the coquihalla, has anyone else had issues with the AP camera not correctly reading the speed limit signs above 110kmh? I've noticed this in two different cars from two different manufacturers, and neither would reliably read the speed in a 120 zone.

Yes, mine consistently would not read them. It also had issues with the 110 signs as well and sometimes would read them as either 100 or 10 km/h.

 

[JSergeant]

So we are planning a trip this summer which puts us in Vancouver in July. We plan to travel to Banff and then down to Kalispell Montana where we'll be staying for a couple days in a place with a destination charger.
Any advice from our Canadian friends or others that have taken a similar route?

If you have time I recommend visiting the Kelowna/Okanagan Lake area. I think it might be Canada's best kept secret vacation spot. Beautiful countryside, vineyards, fruit stalls. Gorgeous weather in the summer. The Best Western in Kelowna has the Superchargers right there plus Destinations chargers and Sun Country chargers. We stayed there last summer and have it on our list to return to.

 

[JSergeant]

If you have time I recommend visiting the Kelowna/Okanagan Lake area. I think it might be Canada's best kept secret vacation spot. Beautiful countryside, vineyards, fruit stalls. Gorgeous weather in the summer. The Best Western in Kelowna has the Superchargers right there plus Destinations chargers and Sun Country chargers. We stayed there last summer and have it on our list to return to.

Oh, and in the summer there was no issue driving from Hope to Kamloops in an S85. I looked back at my records and I used 144 rated miles to drive the 125 actual miles - of course I probably don't drive as fast as these Canadian guys! The drive from Hope through to Calgary has to be one of the most spectacular drives I've ever done - perfect for a Tesla.

 

[f-stop]

Speaking of the 120 zones on the coquihalla, has anyone else had issues with the AP camera not correctly reading the speed limit signs above 110kmh? I've noticed this in two different cars from two different manufacturers, and neither would reliably read the speed in a 120 zone.

yes I noticed that too when I drove the Coquihalla this past fall, the 120kph signs were not read correctly by my Model S.

btw for reference I charged my 70D to 100% in Hope and arrived in Kelowna with about 14% charge remaining (53 rated km). But it was a beautiful sunny fall day (~ 20C) - the trip would not be possible for me in the winter up that massive hill, without an extra charge along the way in the soon-to-be Supercharger in Merrit

 

[green1]

Speaking of the 120 zones on the coquihalla, has anyone else had issues with the AP camera not correctly reading the speed limit signs above 110kmh? I've noticed this in two different cars from two different manufacturers, and neither would reliably read the speed in a 120 zone.

Well known issue, reported many times and many different ways to Tesla.

Unfortunately Tesla has no process in place for fixing these sorts of errors, and they don't care to even try. This has been made abundantly clear in my discussions with them on the matter as I have reported dozens of locations with similar issues, and not a single one has been fixed in over a year since I started reporting them. Each time I report a new one I'm told it's the first one they've ever heard of, despite my having records of many previous reports.

I've now stopped reporting erroneous speed limits, there are far too many of them out there, and Tesla has no interest in fixing the problem.

But keep in mind that their speed limit recognition is infallible, so it's perfect to use to limit your use of AP on certain roads.

 

[CalBlue 85D]

Well known issue, reported many times and many different ways to Tesla.

Unfortunately Tesla has no process in place for fixing these sorts of errors, and they don't care to even try. This has been made abundantly clear in my discussions with them on the matter as I have reported dozens of locations with similar issues, and not a single one has been fixed in over a year since I started reporting them. Each time I report a new one I'm told it's the first one they've ever heard of, despite my having records of many previous reports.

I've now stopped reporting erroneous speed limits, there are far too many of them out there, and Tesla has no interest in fixing the problem.

But keep in mind that their speed limit recognition is infallible, so it's perfect to use to limit your use of AP on certain roads.

I wonder if it is a Mobileye issue? I've noticed the same issue on multiple roads in both BMW's and Teslas which use a similar camera. I don't think it's a database issue, but maybe that's part of the problem too.

Off topic, so back to the supercharger discussion.

 

[green1]

I wonder if it is a Mobileye issue? I've noticed the same issue on multiple roads in both BMW's and Teslas which use a similar camera. I don't think it's a database issue, but maybe that's part of the problem too.

Off topic, so back to the supercharger discussion.

It's 2 seperate problems.
Someone who doesn't know Canada has specifically programmed the car not to recognize 120kph signs. Likely because at the time of doing so they didn't think any speed limits existed that high, that however changed when BC re-evaluated all their speed limits, so it assumes a mis-read and reverts to the database.
The second issue is that the database is wrong, it's wrong for most of BC (due to the re-evaluation of all speed limits listed earlier) as well as MANY other locations. The database is used any time a speed limit sign is mis-read, but also if it hasn't seen one in a while. So a frequent situation is that the car sees a speed limit sign, reads and displays the correct number, and a while later, with no speed limit signs around, the car suddenly shows an incorrect number (and depending on road class, limits your autosteer function to that now incorrect number)

The first issue is either a Mobileye or Tesla origin, and I don't have any way of knowing which without logging the CAN traffic while passing one of those signs, the second one is either a Navigon or Tesla origin, and I'm not really sure which. But either way, both are Tesla's responsibility, it's their car, and they could chose to fix this either by ignoring the incorrect data, or by working with their vendors on a fix, they have chosen to do neither.

 

[MP3Mike]

that however changed when BC re-evaluated all their speed limits, so it assumes a mis-read and reverts to the database.

When did they change the speed limits?

 

[green1]

When did they change the speed limits?

It was in 2014, the majority of primary and secondary highways in the province saw an increase of 10km/h on the speed limits, some also adapted dynamic speed limits that change with road conditions (electronic signs that the Tesla can not read show the current limit).