Wh/km (or mi) / range grossly mis-advertised, if not fraudulent... srsly.

[chdlmc]

New MYLR owner here, living in a four season climate, though winters are fairly mild. 68-98F avg ranges in summer, and 38-55F avg ranges in winter, though i often see nights in the mid teens F during winter.

I am trying to learn about my car, and have regularly been using the Energy app to look at consumption. I typically have it on 30mi, avg value. Is that number considered accurate by TMC in general? I assume the wh/mi is correct on that chart, though it only includes the kwh actually consumed by the car, meaning it neglects charging losses (fine by me). Are there better options for this data I should look into?

I make lots of short trips (<10 miles), the occasional mid range (45mi one way), and then infrequent 250+ mi trips. I am looking to learn about operating the car in an efficient manner and good quality information is key to that.

 

[Supcom]

The trip odometer card can be used to see overall usages.

BTW, the biggest impact on efficiency is your highway speed. A few miles an hour makes a big difference in any EV.

 

[Occhis]

@chdlmc, Wh/mile on trips <10mi. will vary wildly so do not drive yourself nuts over this, or any other trips for that matter unless you just like to follow the numbers. If that’s the case then get Teslafi or some other third party app and you’ll be able to view all your trips along with more data than you’ll even want. Then you’ll be able to see how consumption varies even on the same exact route.
Otherwise, just drive and enjoy.

 

[chdlmc]

The trip odometer card can be used to see overall usages.

BTW, the biggest impact on efficiency is your highway speed. A few miles an hour makes a big difference in any EV.

Right, after i posted I thought about the Trips area on dashboard. I will definitely use that.

Re highway speeds, I look forward to learning about that. On my longer trips, there are lots of gentle grades but there can be strong winds in both hea and tail directions.

 

[chdlmc]

@chdlmc, Wh/mile on trips <10mi. will vary wildly so do not drive yourself nuts over this, or any other trips for that matter unless you just like to follow the numbers. If that’s the case then get Teslafi or some other third party app and you’ll be able to view all your trips along with more data than you’ll even want. Then you’ll be able to see how consumption varies even on the same exact route.
Otherwise, just drive and enjoy.

Understood re the short trips, and I don't take it with much weight cause the sample is low. On the 30 mile selection on the energy app, i do consider that somewhat useful as it aggregates several short trips and I can see the variation between them.

All in all, I am looking for "easy wins" and best practices, I will not be driving myself crazy over every last detail. I'm seeking a solid understanding of the big picture and good things / practices to know.

 

[Supcom]

Right, after i posted I thought about the Trips area on dashboard. I will definitely use that.

Re highway speeds, I look forward to learning about that. On my longer trips, there are lots of gentle grades but there can be strong winds in both hea and tail directions.

If you haven't done so yet, I suggest trying out abetterrouteplanner.com. You can create a route someplace, then play with things like the percent of the speed limit you want to drive, what day and time you plan to leave, starting battery SoC, etc. The planner will adjust the energy usage based on the criteria you set. It's an easy way to explore the factors that impact your range.

Some features require a premium membership, but it's reasonably priced and very useful when planning a trip.

 

[voldar]

New MYLR owner here, living in a four season climate, though winters are fairly mild. 68-98F avg ranges in summer, and 38-55F avg ranges in winter, though i often see nights in the mid teens F during winter.

I am trying to learn about my car, and have regularly been using the Energy app to look at consumption. I typically have it on 30mi, avg value. Is that number considered accurate by TMC in general? I assume the wh/mi is correct on that chart, though it only includes the kwh actually consumed by the car, meaning it neglects charging losses (fine by me). Are there better options for this data I should look into?

I make lots of short trips (<10 miles), the occasional mid range (45mi one way), and then infrequent 250+ mi trips. I am looking to learn about operating the car in an efficient manner and good quality information is key to that.

Here is what I learned in the 6 months I have my Tesla : it doesn’t like to be driven slow.
I had a Bolt EV for 4.5 years before and it was unbelievable efficient when driven slow. But this was because it was a FWD and GM made its drivetrain really very efficient. Tesla is a very efficient RWD, even the AWD which I have, the front motor is engaged only in specific situations, and it doesn’t use as much energy to move the car ahead, but doesn’t gain much through regeneration at low speeds either. You need to find the right balance between acceleration and regeneration to get the maximum out of it. A "pulse & glide" driving style would be perfect for Tesla, but who does this ? You want to enjoy the HP it has, right ?!? I wish Tesla shown the instant power needed to accelerate and not only a black/green line. I learned from 4.5 years of owning a Volt and other 4.5 years of owning a Bolt that keeping the power of acceleration below 25 kW is best for efficiency. From my observations, Tesla likes a bit higher acceleration, and of course, harder braking/regeneration. Don’t forget, Tesla doesn’t have blended brakes. When you press the brakes, it’s the brakes who stop the car, no regeneration occurs. So stay as much as possible off the brakes. Use the regeneration learning to modulate the pressure on the acceleration pedal.
I always use 21C on Auto. IMO it is the temperature the heat-pump loves and it’s freaking efficient ! I would advise to not use chill mode during cold temperatures, because while in chill, the heat-pump will scavenge heat from the battery to warm the car. And you want a warm battery in cold temperatures.

 

[Dr. J]

A "pulse & glide" driving style would be perfect for Tesla, but who does this ?

A Prius driver.

--A former Prius driver

 

[chdlmc]

Here is what I learned in the 6 months I have my Tesla : it doesn’t like to be driven slow.
I had a Bolt EV for 4.5 years before and it was unbelievable efficient when driven slow. But this was because it was a FWD and GM made its drivetrain really very efficient. Tesla is a very efficient RWD, even the AWD which I have, the front motor is engaged only in specific situations, and it doesn’t use as much energy to move the car ahead, but doesn’t gain much through regeneration at low speeds either. You need to find the right balance between acceleration and regeneration to get the maximum out of it. A "pulse & glide" driving style would be perfect for Tesla, but who does this ? You want to enjoy the HP it has, right ?!? I wish Tesla shown the instant power needed to accelerate and not only a black/green line. I learned from 4.5 years of owning a Volt and other 4.5 years of owning a Bolt that keeping the power of acceleration below 25 kW is best for efficiency. From my observations, Tesla likes a bit higher acceleration, and of course, harder braking/regeneration. Don’t forget, Tesla doesn’t have blended brakes. When you press the brakes, it’s the brakes who stop the car, no regeneration occurs. So stay as much as possible off the brakes. Use the regeneration learning to modulate the pressure on the acceleration pedal.
I always use 21C on Auto. IMO it is the temperature the heat-pump loves and it’s freaking efficient ! I would advise to not use chill mode during cold temperatures, because while in chill, the heat-pump will scavenge heat from the battery to warm the car. And you want a warm battery in cold temperatures.

Thanks for the comments.

Interesting regarding chill mode. It’s winter now and I’ve been in chill mode the last week or so. Coming from a 4-cyl ICE car the chill mode acceleration is still much faster.

My goal with chill mode was to improve efficiency and possibly save tire wear. However, I drive in a mellow manner, and could still accelerate somewhat modestly on Standard. Maybe I should do that for the heat pump reasons you mention.

My car typically is parked outside and not plugged in (I can charge at work). So I often have a cold battery for short drives (I assume) even though I precondition, and I’ve been setting the precondition for 15 minutes earlier than I actually leave.

I am driving one pedal style, that part has come easy to me and it’s really nice.

 

[voldar]

So I often have a cold battery for short drives (I assume) even though I precondition, and I’ve been setting the precondition for 15 minutes earlier than I actually leave.

You have a cold battery all the time in this case. And 15 minutes aren’t enough to warm the battery, only the cabin. In cold weather, a Tesla unplugged, needs about 45 minutes of preconditioning to have a warm battery. Of course, it uses about 10% SOC at the end of this cycle. And when I say warm, I mean cells around 10C temperatures.

 

[AAKEE]

You have a cold battery all the time in this case. And 15 minutes aren’t enough to warm the battery, only the cabin. In cold weather, a Tesla unplugged, needs about 45 minutes of preconditioning to have a warm battery. Of course, it uses about 10% SOC at the end of this cycle. And when I say warm, I mean cells around 10C temperatures.

You are mixing things up here

The preconditioning for a charge, where the battery need > +40C takes longer time. In average the car can heat the battery with 1C per minute, for a 3/Y dual motor. (RWD is slower), Plaid trimotor could be faster. To plan for a supercharging session wintertime one hour should be given. (cell temp target for supercharger V3 is 48C for mu M3P and the MSP.)

During a preconditioning for departure in cold climate where the battery has been out in low tmeperatures a whole day the battery heater only heats the cell temp tp about 5C. ( stops battery heat at 4.25C on my Plaid and did stop it at aorund 5C on my M3P). If the cell temp is 5C or more, no battery heating is performed.

On this picture the car was out for the whole day at about -16C (about a few F's). The most common time for the battery heater to run for me is about 3-15mins, but only when it is so co9lt that the cell temp actually is below 5C otherwise the battery heating will not run.

 

[SageBrush]

it uses about 10% SOC at the end of this cycle. And when I say warm, I mean cells around 10C temperatures.

The Tesla drivetrain can divert up to ~ 6 kW to the motors for heat production. 45 minutes is 4.5 kWh, so closer to 6% of SoC of a 75 kWh pack

 

[SageBrush]

It is free in the aspect that that energy was already lost to heat losses anyway.
If you do not steal it back with a heatpump it is lost forever.

A heat pump is not required to divert heat from a source to a sink. A heat exchanger or a radiator would do the job just fine -- albeit with a COP something below 1.0

 

[AAKEE]

A heat pump is not required to divert heat from a source to a sink. A heat exchanger or a radiator would do the job just fine -- albeit with a COP something below 1.0

But a heat pump is required to catch energy from a source with a lower temperature than the medium you like to heat.

Currently -23C and dropping fast here. The forecast says well below -30C for a week or so. Probably bottom out about -35C or below so….

If the battery is +5C, we can newer heat the cabin to more than close to +5C, and thats not very comfortable. Ask me how I know… my heatpump stopped working when my M3P was brand new, in a week three yrs back.

 

[SageBrush]

If the battery is +5C, we can newer heat the cabin to more than close to +5C

In a Tesla, battery energy is sent to the motor where it is converted to heat. The battery pack temperature does not matter.

 

[sleepydoc]

Yet another reason no one likes Prius drivers!

 

[voldar]

You are mixing things up here

I was talking about preheating the battery after sitting outside in the cold. Not the preconditioning for charge. We all know that a battery can get cold sometimes below 0C when it sits long time in cold weather and I was referring to that situation. Tesla Bjorn had a video about preheating the Tesla plugged on L1, unplugged and plugged on a L2.
In my Model 3 I see the battery cells kept at around (average max and min temp) 10C all the time, while plugged and charging on a L2.

 

[voldar]

Yet another reason no one likes Prius drivers!

Right.

 

[AAKEE]

In a Tesla, battery energy is sent to the motor where it is converted to heat. The battery pack temperature does not matter.

Thats only when actively heating the battery, which do not happen often.

Heat losses from the motors, and even the CPU in the HW computer is transfered to the battery to passively heat it.

The heat pump use the heat in the battery to heat the cabin when its cold outside.

The heat pump in my M3P was allowed to suck the heat from the battery down to ~12C, so when the cell temp was below 12C the heat pump would either need to use putside air (which only could be done down to -10C), below that the heat pump would need to work as a 1:1 COP heat generator.

For the Plaid the heat pump is allowed to suck the e ergy down to +5C in the battery.

 

[AAKEE]

I was talking about preheating the battery after sitting outside in the cold. Not the preconditioning for charge. We all know that a battery can get cold sometimes below 0C when it sits long time in cold weather and I was referring to that situation. Tesla Bjorn had a video about preheating the Tesla plugged on L1, unplugged and plugged on a L2.

Yes, that was what I was talking sbout too.

When preconditioning the var heats the battery quite fast in a dual motor.