Lol that’s fair. I think they will sell the 135 and 180 models first. $80k and $100k
-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
What do you think is the drag coefficient on Rivian?
- Thread starter argon2018
- Start date
Lol that’s fair. I think they will sell the 135 and 180 models first. $80k and $100k
JG T3SLA
Member
2020 seems to be the year most major auto manufacturers are pledging to electrify their vehicles. Battery costs are sure to be less by then, so I don’t think assuming prices have to be higher is the right approach.
Just look at our 3... prices are dropping every other week! Ha
Just look at our 3... prices are dropping every other week! Ha
With options like autopilot sure they will be more but I don’t see them going above $110k unless there’s some crazy towing or off-road package available
Almost all of these "Tesla Killers" and others like the Rivian have huge unnecessary frontal areas or grills which is the biggest detriment to a low Cd. Their marketing departments are terrified of trying to sell something that looks different from their traditional signature products. This is actually another "moat" for Tesla. Has any rational person ever said Tesla's don't look terricic?
The pickup is 400 miles, and the SUV is 440 miles. The 400 mile range was just calculated at 450Wh/mi, and 440mile range is 409Wh/mi. Then consider bad weather, actually driving the speed limit on highway not 55mph, and the actual will be very different. I'm really surprised at all of this push for electric for trucks because it seems the WORST application to me. The SUV at least makes sense as a real 7 passenger vehicle. I'd just like to see something more like a minivan, Mercedes R, or Flex. Just having it lower to the ground like a Flex would improve aerodynamics. The massive frunk really makes up for a lack of storage behind the 3rd row of seats which is a common SUV problem.
JG T3SLA
Member
Interesting video I just found. Provides a nice overview. I view companies like this as beneficial to Tesla. Need more and more diverse segments of drivers to make the switch. Tesla can’t do it all by itself.
SammichLover
Banned
My guess is roughly 0.dontcare . Same as battery size doesn't really matter.
After sticker price, the actual questions that matter are: How far, how fast, carrying how much?
Reduced drag is just one potential means to an end.
The point of the vehicle is roughly the same as any other pick-up/offroad-ish SUV. If that isn't what you're looking for then yeah, it doesn't make much sense.
SammichLover
Banned
The reference to use by Amazon makes it pretty clear that's the semi, even though that seems a rather odd comparison since they are wildly different vehicle categories.
We haven't seen anything remotely credible on the shape for the Tesla truck, have we? I thought all there had been so far was fanfic.
SammichLover
Banned
I was floored by their claimed entry price. The $60K they are touting is a full $20K lower than what I expected their floor would be. I guess we'll see when exactly that happens but that's getting into the pretty credible range for pickups for their base feature set.
voip-ninja
Give me some sugar baby
Who are you to decide what's necessary or unnecessary? Do a bit of research into CEO of Rivian, who went straight out of MIT with his doctorate in mechanical engineering into starting work on electrification of the pickup and sport utility segment.
I have zero doubt that these guys have as much engineering muscle as Tesla does as he's up to 750 employees and I imagine he has maybe two in marketing.
RJ Scaringe understands what Elon Musk understands which is that people want sexy, high performance cars, they don't want weirdmobiles.
1. Build sexy car/truck.
2. Can't look like a weirdmobile.
3. Insane performance.
4. Could be more efficient, but, meh?
5. Sell as many as you can produce to the very well heeled people who can afford one.
6. Build lower cost iterations of the product as your manufacturing costs go down.
I expect Rivian to be able to pull off their initial asking price by waiting till 2021 to start filling orders, by which time battery prices will have fallen another 20-30% or more from where they are today. GM/Ford/Toyota/Nissan slobber all over their super high margin luxo SUVs and trucks.... but they have to offset the sale of every truck with the sale of a high efficiency car that they make little to no money on in order to meet CAFE standards.
Rivian does not have this limitation. It's also possible that they will sell at a loss for a couple of years because longterm they stand to make a ton of money if they dominate a new auto segment. All it takes is money to burn baby, just ask Amazon.
If Rivian can execute (and a lot of big $$ is betting that they can) then check-mate Rivian... at least when you think about what someone spending $75,000-$100,000 on a new top of the line quad cab truck is going to want to buy.
I just wish I knew this Scaringe guy when he got out of MIT and was looking for people to put $100K into his truck company idea. Those people who helped him get initial funding so he could buy material and start experimenting stand to make a metric *sugar*-ton of money on this if it pans out.
Lucky13
Member
I pulled the trigger. I hope it all works out for these electric car companies but I do agree the frontal areo on the rivian could benefit to make for better CD, but I am no expert and actually like they way it looks.
I look at the Rivian PU as an original Tesla Roadster. It's the first effort from an untested company that does not yet know what they don't know. Drag is actually a pretty good point to raise, I mean after ten years in this business Tesla is obsessive about drag --- maybe they think it is important.
Experience matters in technology companies and I expect for cars that goes tenfold. Throwing tons of money -- and people -- does not always help either, unless your only goal is losing that money. The establishment -- Audi, VW, Porsche -- will have some growing pains, but the new companies like Rivian are going to have a much harder time IMO. All that said, I love the Bollinger truck myself, and it is about as high drag as possible.
Experience matters in technology companies and I expect for cars that goes tenfold. Throwing tons of money -- and people -- does not always help either, unless your only goal is losing that money. The establishment -- Audi, VW, Porsche -- will have some growing pains, but the new companies like Rivian are going to have a much harder time IMO. All that said, I love the Bollinger truck myself, and it is about as high drag as possible.
Eno Deb
Active Member
Have they actually published the drag coefficient? The general shape of a pickup truck is obviously not optimal for aerodynamics, in large part because of the open cargo area (which no doubt causes a lot of turbulence). But looks can be deceiving. For example, the Mercedes A class is currently the production car with the lowest drag coefficient, but you wouldn't know it from the looks of the front end:
2019 Mercedes A-Class Sedan will be most aerodynamic new car on sale
I don't think Rivian has announced the drag coefficient on the R1T yet, but remembered hearing something about it maybe during their reveal. Found this comment for what it's worth in an article from Motor Trend's 11/26/18 article on the vehicle ("2020 Rivian R1T EV First Look: The Electrick Pickup Truck")
"This tonneau, a gentle spoiler on the tailgate, front-wheel air curtains, and the aforementioned ballistic full belly pan with rear diffuser deliver what Rivian claims will be a class-leading pickup truck drag coefficient."
At this point seems like they are just roughly comparing it to other trucks at the moment. Will be interesting to see how it ultimately compares on that point against Tesla's pickup when it comes out.
"This tonneau, a gentle spoiler on the tailgate, front-wheel air curtains, and the aforementioned ballistic full belly pan with rear diffuser deliver what Rivian claims will be a class-leading pickup truck drag coefficient."
At this point seems like they are just roughly comparing it to other trucks at the moment. Will be interesting to see how it ultimately compares on that point against Tesla's pickup when it comes out.
Last edited:
I don't get how one buys it for off-road and can use an autopilot technology to drive it, on the highway yes but off road? No lane markings to follow, how does one set it and gage operating speed not knowing what might lie ahead in the way of ruts and potholes, etc. Even Tesla's autopilot isn't suppose to be used yet in cross traffic/non-highway situations.
Yeah it will be interesting to see what they come with. I saw a video and it was using radar for things off road but I’m sure that was testing footage.
SammichLover
Banned
Level 3 is "fully automated for sections of road, then the driver must take over". So running automation on the highway and then switching to manual off-road (potentially with certain types of assist and sensor data feed) is entirely consistent with that.
SammichLover
Banned
So what's your plan on goalpost shifting for later this year, when you'll pretend like you never actually used this line and poo-poo the shipping of the $35K Model 3 as meaningless?
Similar threads
