What wasn't said.

[jerry33]

Hmmm, brings up something to ponder. Most of the taxes on gas go to pay for road construction & maintenance. Electric cars don't pay that tax. At some point in the future the quantity of electric cars on the road will grow and the tax revenue from gas sales will decrease, yet roads still need to be built and maintained. I foresee some sort of tax on electricity when used to power electric cars, or some sort of yearly tax based on mileage for each electric car - maybe assessed when you get your yearly inspection? Nobody like taxes, but they are important to pay for common use things like roads.

1. EVs pay tolls like everyone else (except in certain states). Here in Texas the plan appears to be to turn every highway into a toll road--and a very expensive toll road at that.
2. EVs don't have messy oil spills and leaks that costs states many millions to clean up.
3. As the EV population increases, healthcare costs will go down due to a cleaner environment.
4. Big rigs do most of the road damage and don't pay nearly their share.
5. Roads are often constructed cheaply and so are subject to frost heaves and ground subsidence.

 

[Bimbels]

We have a AP model S that had the AP hardware for 4 months before AP was released. TACC was included and switched on - but that could have been because we'd paid for AP even though it wasn't released yet.

Safety features would be collision avoidance and blind spot sensors. But really everyone - if you get ONE option it should be autopilot. Don't skimp there. It is amazing and keeps getting better.

 

[Saghost]

We have a AP model S that had the AP hardware for 4 months before AP was released. TACC was included and switched on - but that could have been because we'd paid for AP even though it wasn't released yet.

Safety features would be collision avoidance and blind spot sensors. But really everyone - if you get ONE option it should be autopilot. Don't skimp there. It is amazing and keeps getting better.

I think we're struggling with terminology here - which might have been the case with the earlier post I suppose, though it didn't occur to me at the time.

Autopilot is the whole suite of features, and is either bought once or not, and has at various times included several levels of capability (starting with just reading speed limits and controlling high beams - currently able to park the car, drive by itself on freeways, and more.)

Autosteer is a spectacular addition to the package that's gotten everyone's attention this year, and I think maybe some people are referring to Autosteer as Autopilot instead even though it is only one piece of the package.

Folks who paid for Autopilot got access to TACC as soon as it came out, well before Autosteer appeared. Folks who didn't pay for Autopilot did not get access to TACC as far as I know (though there was some confusion and possibly some unique deals for folks who had AP capable cars delivered prior to the ordering functions changing to cover Autopilot.)

If the prior post had been referring to Autosteer as Autopilot, and was about an AP capable car which had paid for AP, then it is possible the recollection is correct - certainly TACC was available on AP cars before Autosteer came out - but AFAIK it has never been an included standard feature to date, and there's no reason to expect it will be in the near future.
Walter

 

[ecarfan]

It is clear to me that Model 3 AP will be like Model S: all cars will be built with all the AP hardware but the AP software will be optional except the AP "safety features" will be included and functional (as Elon stated in the tweet quotes just upthread".

I agree with Bonnie that the 3 will not only include Supercharging onboard hardware as standard but also Supercharging capability just like the S and X do now.

So this thread is about what wasn't said at the launch, and I'd like to see discussion about other issues that I think are less clear, for example:

Does the 3 have enough space for a higher capacity battery than what will come with the base model that provides at least 215 miles of range? I think it does and am hoping that a higher capacity optional battery in the 3 will provide around 250 miles of real world range. That is what I need for the 3 I have reserved to replace my S.

 

[ohmman]

1. EVs pay tolls like everyone else (except in certain states). Here in Texas the plan appears to be to turn every highway into a toll road--and a very expensive toll road at that.
2. EVs don't have messy oil spills and leaks that costs states many millions to clean up.
3. As the EV population increases, healthcare costs will go down due to a cleaner environment.
4. Big rigs do most of the road damage and don't pay nearly their share.
5. Roads are often constructed cheaply and so are subject to frost heaves and ground subsidence.

In addition, gas taxes have sloughed off rapidly in recent years since there's no will to increase them, and fuel efficiencies are going up. California (as with other states like Oregon, noted above) is doing a pilot program based on mileage. Big rigs are to be taxed more heavily. But it doesn't cover some of your other important notes.

I agree with Bonnie that the 3 will not only include Supercharging onboard hardware as standard but also Supercharging capability just like the S and X do now.

It'll be interesting to see how this turns out. Elon is known for using the words "free for life" a lot when discussing Supercharging with respect to the S and X. That phrase was left out. Supercharging capable and Supercharging free seem to me to be different things. It'll be interesting to see how this unfolds, but I'm guessing we won't hear much more about it for over a year.

 

[Jersey Shore Tom]

Tesla is going to not allow Model 3 to charge at the same location twice in a row.

One of the most common trips I will make is about 250 miles each way with the 12 newly installed Superchargers at Newark, DE right at the halfway point. I will stop there going both ways with no other Superchargers in between, relying on plugging in at my destination.

 

[Jhsq]

The number one feature I'm looking forward is the Tesla car sharing feature. They have the developer resources and connected cars to create a global membership scheme where one could access teslas located in other cities and countries.

 

[Bimbels]

Does the 3 have enough space for a higher capacity battery than what will come with the base model that provides at least 215 miles of range? I think it does and am hoping that a higher capacity optional battery in the 3 will provide around 250 miles of real world range. That is what I need for the 3 I have reserved to replace my S.

In one of the ride videos, the engineer said there would be a higher battery option. I think it's pretty much a given that there will be 2 battery options - and that the bigger battery will ship first. they just haven't released specifics yet. I think the focus of this event was that the Model 3 is a 35K car - with the smaller battery.

 

[Twiglett]

The other things that weren't said in the presentation, mentioned during the rides :

• Roof would have options for retractable roof, steel roof or all glass
• RWD standard - optional dual motor
• Trunk design is still being worked on
• 15" landscape format is integral to the new design and not likely to go away
• Handling and performance are Tesla handling and performance
• Door handles are mechanical, but still cool looking

 

[Fanatic1]

Jus


Just look at the list of auto pilot convenience features for the S. Done. These are the non-safety features.

The main reason I waited to buy a model S was for these convenience features...

 

[DrManhattan]

Supercharging will be included. This is what Tesla is all about. However, I think more strict requirements will be put in place as to not abuse it as a lot of current Model S owners are. There will simply be too many Teslas on the road and not enough superchargers available by 2019.

 

[SageBrush]

4. Big rigs do most of the road damage and don't pay nearly their share.

This

 

[RIZE]

A employee at an model S test drive said that the model 3 is likely to have paid supercharging.

 

[eye.surgeon]

The number one feature I'm looking forward is the Tesla car sharing feature. They have the developer resources and connected cars to create a global membership scheme where one could access teslas located in other cities and countries.

Won't happen, at least not in the next decade. So don't hold your breath.

 

[Az_Rael]

If you want accuracy you need detailed tracking of movement. When, where and in what vehicle.
If you want privacy, expect to pay more.

I know several of the pilot programs are using tracking devices. And I would probably benefit significantly with a tracking device vs a flat rate since ~40 miles of my daily commute is done on Federal roads for which I am entitled a refund of my CA gas taxes. (Since CA isn't paying for the maintenance of those roads)

BUT. I don't like the privacy loss. So I would rather pay some standard fee based on my odometer reading during annual registration or something like that. I don't sign up for those insurance tracking programs either, even though I am a safe driver.

 

[Snowdog]

I agree with Bonnie that the 3 will not only include Supercharging onboard hardware as standard but also Supercharging capability just like the S and X do now.

That is an opinion, that runs counter to available information. The PR department themselves clarified that they are not announcing the supercharger access details.

Not once did Elon say "Free" in relation to Supercharging.

Free is a big deal, and if they knew it was going to be free, they would be touting "FREE".

Best case they are still deciding if it will be free. Worse case they already decided it won't be free.

 

[mobe]

Unless I'm missing something, Georgia already did it - In April of 2015 they killed the state income tax credit and attached a $200 fee to annual renewal for EVs only to cover the road usage:

States Used to Help People Buy Electric Cars. Now They Punish Them for It.

Missouri already does this.
"Alternate fuel vehicle" annual required fee = 75.00. You cannot renew registration without paying the fee and getting a new sticker which is placed at the lower right corner of the vehicle windshield. Color coded to the year.

 

[eloder]

I don't know about Europe and Japan, but in North America most of those CHAdeMO stations are inside the auto dealers' locked gates and often used to charge the dealers' cars. This makes the usable number somewhere around 160. The CCS stations are likely similar, although I don't have any first hand experience with them. Dealer locations are often inconvenient, there is typically only one or at most two stalls (that are often blocked), and some dealers don't allow charging unless you purchased your car there, some will only charge their brand of cars, and some will allow anyone to charge--there's zero consistency. In my opinion, charging at a car dealership might as well not exist. Only Tesla has a decent, you can count on it, 7x24, DC charging network. (Sun Country does have a decent 70 amp charging network, but they are not even close to matching Tesla's distribution of Superchargers).

Yup.

Saying CCS and chademo are advantages for other cars is only something stated by non-owners of CCS or chademo-capable cars.

It's horrendous. I know first hand as a Leaf owner.

 

[yak-55]

I think you people are reading way too much into the supercharging thing.

A perceived bait-and-switch dishonesty would be far worse than having said nothing at all.

Supercharging is a feature that gives Tesla a competitive advantage and exists for them to sell more cars. The cost is a pittance if it sells more cars. Charging for it would be stupid - being dishonest (or coy, or whatever you want to call it) about charging people for it would be stupider.

You must be new here, welcome to the forums. Tesla has a long history of (depending on your perspective) imprecise to deceptive communications. So far those communications don't seem to have had much negative impact on sales. Rest assured, at this point, we know *nothing* other than there is likely to be hardware in M3 that allows it to receive a charge from a supercharger. What all that will cost and when it might be available is all TBD.

It will be fun to see it all unfold !

 

[Andyw2100]

So...leaving aside the whole "Supercharging included free or not" discussion for the moment, mainly because we're not going to settle it here anyway, I thought it would be interesting to roll the discussion along (watch what I'm doing here) into a discussion of the three kinds of wheels that were on display on the three Model 3s on stage during the presentation. Nothing was said about the wheels by Elon Musk, and I don't believe I've seen them discussed in any of the "ride" videos I've watched. Do we think any of those three different wheel types were the standard wheels? If so, they'd have had to have been the wheels on the middle car, right? I thought those were quite impressive looking, actually, and very similar to the Cyclones and Turbines. I also really liked the wheels on the red car.

Did anyone at the event hear anything about names for any of those wheels?

Perhaps I should look for a different thread (or start one) on the wheels, but I thought since this thread id discussing things that weren't said, the topic would be appropriate here.