Why I recommend AGAINST buying a Tesla

[Pruitt]

Thanks for sharing about your issues. Just curious. Are you considering upgrading? If so to what? Raven?

No, I'm not.
I love driving my Tesla, but I DON'T love sitting for a third of my road time at a supercharger waiting for the emasculated charge rate to put enough juice in the battery for the next leg of the trip.
The newer versions of the S, with the longer range and batteries not enfeebled by software updates, are tempting.
But MY car, when I bought it, supercharged in a bit more than half the time it takes now. Tesla intentionally degraded the charge rate, and intentionally did not, and still will not, provide any sort of technical explanation or data for it. All they've ever said, to my knowledge, is basically that my battery will degrade faster without the reduced charge rate.
So as a result I don't trust Tesla not to screw up more cars. Who's to say they won't wind up doing the same thing to new cars in the next year or two or three? If they find a problem that they can avoid repairing by a software update, they're more likely to take that path again, now that it apparently has worked the first few times they've tried it. For THAT reason, I will not purchase another Tesla, nor will I recommend them to others.

 

[Pruitt]

My wife, dog and I are making a road trip from Austin, TX to Tuscaloosa, Alabama on Friday. I bought my 2014 P85D off of this forum about a month ago and this would be by far my longest trip yet in the car. Reading this thread is making me scared of wanting to bring it now on the ~13 hour trip with an ICE. My Dad has a 2013 Lexus LS 460 he'd probably let me borrow. I was kind of excited to make the first road trip with a Tesla... I'm guessing the estimated time that the Tesla navigation estimates for total trip with charge times included is not very accurate and does not account for the slower supercharger charge times for these older models like mine?

Go ahead and take the trip, but just plan on four to five hours at superchargers. Maybe the longer supercharger stops won't be an issue for you. They aren't for many folks. I suggest you owe it to yourself to try it once and see how YOU feel. My Tesla has always gotten me where I'm going, and it is fun to drive. It just takes so damn LONG to get there!

 

[meomyo]

Maybe tesla will right these wrongs?

 

[X Fan]

FWIW: re: long distance travel

we’ve been driving for four years up and down i95 from Naples FL to North Carolina in both our 90 and 100X’s 5-6x a year

Never once have we had to wait at a supercharger and quite frankly the ability to stop every couple of hours has made our 14 hour trips refreshing.

there are keys to long distance travel including arriving with a battery around 10% and staying away from a paired unit that is being used.

Take the trip in your Tesla....you won’t regret it.

 

[mayhews72]

No, I'm not.
I love driving my Tesla, but I DON'T love sitting for a third of my road time at a supercharger waiting for the emasculated charge rate to put enough juice in the battery for the next leg of the trip.
The newer versions of the S, with the longer range and batteries not enfeebled by software updates, are tempting.
But MY car, when I bought it, supercharged in a bit more than half the time it takes now. Tesla intentionally degraded the charge rate, and intentionally did not, and still will not, provide any sort of technical explanation or data for it. All they've ever said, to my knowledge, is basically that my battery will degrade faster without the reduced charge rate.
So as a result I don't trust Tesla not to screw up more cars. Who's to say they won't wind up doing the same thing to new cars in the next year or two or three? If they find a problem that they can avoid repairing by a software update, they're more likely to take that path again, now that it apparently has worked the first few times they've tried it. For THAT reason, I will not purchase another Tesla, nor will I recommend them to others.

This sums it up nicely for me. My 2015 S85 has been affected by loss of range, supercharge rates, and now re-gen. It is not what I spent 70k on 4 years ago. If it was normal degradation I would not mind one bit, but this appears to be deliberate action by Tesla to protect their interests at the expense of their early adopter customers.

Maybe tesla will right these wrongs?

I hope so. I'm due a new car, and several family members and work colleagues have ask about my car. As per the thread title, at this time I recommend AGAINST buying a new Tesla. These issues affect ALL Tesla owners - unless they do right by these early vehicles, I have no faith that they will not do the same again when new cars are few years old.

 

[SO16]

This sums it up nicely for me. My 2015 S85 has been affected by loss of range, supercharge rates, and now re-gen. It is not what I spent 70k on 4 years ago. If it was normal degradation I would not mind one bit, but this appears to be deliberate action by Tesla to protect their interests at the expense of their early adopter customers. I’d like to one day use my old battery as a Powerwall and get a new one.


I hope so. I'm due a new car, and several family members and work colleagues have ask about my car. As per the thread title, at this time I recommend AGAINST buying a new Tesla. These issues affect ALL Tesla owners - unless they do right by these early vehicles, I have no faith that they will not do the same again when new cars are few years old.

I highly doubt the new raven and model 3’s will be affected as much as the early models were. After all, the early models were.....early models. There is risk being an early adopter. And if those reductions were needed to protect the battery and prevent a fire, then it’s probably good they made those reductions. It would be nice if Tesla could offer a cheap battery replacement to get you up to current technology and charging speeds again though.

 

[SilverGS]

Go ahead and take the trip, but just plan on four to five hours at superchargers. Maybe the longer supercharger stops won't be an issue for you. They aren't for many folks. I suggest you owe it to yourself to try it once and see how YOU feel. My Tesla has always gotten me where I'm going, and it is fun to drive. It just takes so damn LONG to get there!

Maybe its my old age here, but in my 2016 75D, I personally cannot last over 200 miles (probably 3 hours approximately) without stopping to get a meal/snack, restroom break, etc. So I plan the break around supercharger stops and the time it takes to charge is no longer relevant in my case.

Each to his own and everyone's mileage varies.

 

[TSLA Pilot]

This sums it up nicely for me. My 2015 S85 has been affected by loss of range, supercharge rates, and now re-gen. It is not what I spent 70k on 4 years ago. If it was normal degradation I would not mind one bit, but this appears to be deliberate action by Tesla to protect their interests at the expense of their early adopter customers.

I hope so. I'm due a new car, and several family members and work colleagues have ask about my car. As per the thread title, at this time I recommend AGAINST buying a new Tesla. These issues affect ALL Tesla owners - unless they do right by these early vehicles, I have no faith that they will not do the same again when new cars are few years old.

Well, not to be a pill here, and I DO agree with your points--but what other brand is doing so much to leave a usable planet (despite all their flaws and poor behavior)?

Despite being an owner since 2013, and buying about six or seven new (and used) Model S's since, I too am picking up a "love/hate" relationship with Tesla, but what other options are there?

 

[rsg123]

Cool story brosef. That would be relevant information to include in your original post. You should consider painting a complete picture in the future - it might avoid people telling you the facts you present make no sense or aren’t conclusive for a given set of conditions.

Cool. Next time I’ll give you my entire life story too.

 

[Az_Rael]

I highly doubt the new raven and model 3’s will be affected as much as the early models were. After all, the early models were.....early models

I am not so sure about that. This change was implemented well after the design for the Model 3 batteries was already shipping. It is possible whatever the problem is will also affect the new design, it will just take a few years to show up.

For now Tesla is increasing supercharging rates on the 3, but who knows if that is just to sell more cars today, and less concern with effects on the batteries long term. Tesla would much rather you buy a new car in 4 years when the charging gets too slow vs keep your old one.

 

[Battpower]

For now Tesla is increasing supercharging rates on the 3, but who knows if that is just to sell more cars today

I think there is a lot of evidence to support this possibility.

And I also have not seen any step-change in battery technology although I think I saw different heat management in the 3.

But, compared with variation in ambient temperature, load on battery immediately before charging / pre-heat prior to charge, age of battery, use patterns of battery, supercharge vs slow charge etc etc, I would think battery technology would have to be a big change to be significant to all use cases.

It feels a lot like keeping moving the goal posts so it's hard to tell what you were promised and whether or not you actually ever had it / still have it.

Smoke and mirrors.

 

[Az_Rael]

It feels a lot like keeping moving the goal posts so it's hard to tell what you were promised and whether or not you actually ever had it / still have it.

Smoke and mirrors.

Yeah, I bought a car with a 310 mile range. Tesla later gave me a software update to 324 miles range, awesome! But now I am back down to the original range. It is hard to be upset, though, because that IS what I bought originally. But it makes me wonder what is going on.

 

[SO16]

Yeah, I bought a car with a 310 mile range. Tesla later gave me a software update to 324 miles range, awesome! But now I am back down to the original range. It is hard to be upset, though, because that IS what I bought originally. But it makes me wonder what is going on.

I just get in and drive. Looking at the max range for me is pretty much useless (especially when full). It depends more on driving style. Same issue with my Ford Escape. I get less than rated range but I also drive a bit faster.

 

[Mike Robinson]

Taycan, etron, EQC, they have arrived guys. It will be healthy if some of us switch. With fast charger arriving everywhere superchargers have no advantage any more. I am a short term owner, just 4 months, love the drive, but had loaners for 7 weeks already and wonder whether I should've waited to go electric another half year and gotten an etron or so.

Not bering able to call for customer service simply sucks. Even no call back possible when the car is already in service. WTF???

Mercedes is delaying introduction of EQC a full year because of poor sales of eTron and iPace. Taycan's charge rate and range are coming under significant attack recently. Don't know of any "good" alternatives to Tesla right now. I've had my MS 100D a year now and very happy.

 

[rsg123]

I’m not sure how much of the supercharging slowdown has to do with a) battery fire risk, b) battery degradation, c) discouraging and slowing free supercharging sessions since most affected cars are from the FUSC era.
I can’t fathom they found the risk of battery fires was high enough to inconvenience so many customers, including all of the early adopters. I think it may have to do with all of the above.
Since, like most customers, I do most of my charging at home (except recently so that I could preview what my upcoming road trip might feel like while supercharging), this doesn’t really affect me greatly. Even on the longer trips, I would gladly take autopilot for an extra hour added to a 7 hour trip.

 

[BulldogsRus]

Maybe its my old age here, but in my 2016 75D, I personally cannot last over 200 miles (probably 3 hours approximately) without stopping to get a meal/snack, restroom break, etc. So I plan the break around supercharger stops and the time it takes to charge is no longer relevant in my case.

Each to his own and everyone's mileage varies.

It "Depends"

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

Not sure what I have in the trunk of my Raven then!

Hey, I'm an American.

We tend to forget that anyone else exists.

But, more seriously the Model S/X is supposed to get a CCS adapter in the states. I don't know if my Model 3 will ever get an adapter.

 

[ahhlun]

This sums it up nicely for me. My 2015 S85 has been affected by loss of range, supercharge rates, and now re-gen. It is not what I spent 70k on 4 years ago. If it was normal degradation I would not mind one bit, but this appears to be deliberate action by Tesla to protect their interests at the expense of their early adopter customers.

You have a 2015 car which is out of warranty. Shouldn't you be happy Tesla is protecting YOUR interests so you don't have to make out of warranty battery replacement$$$?

 

[ahhlun]

Maybe its my old age here, but in my 2016 75D, I personally cannot last over 200 miles (probably 3 hours approximately)

You are from Ontario and drives a 75D, I am surprised you can last 200 miles in one charge :/

 

[Az_Rael]

You have a 2015 car which is out of warranty. Shouldn't you be happy Tesla is protecting YOUR interests so you don't have to make out of warranty battery replacement$$$?

If it was the customers' interests they were protecting, they would have replaced the batteries in question under warranty. After all, they have stated themselves that only "a small number" of cars are affected.