All discussion of Nikola Motors

[GBleck]

I'm confused. It looks like they will be using GM fuel cell tech as well as GM battery tech? Does Nikola bring anything to this deal other then 200,000 $7,500 tax credits that may or may not be worth anything when the truck gets to market?

Also... COST PLUS CONTRACT LOL.

 

[mtndrew1]

I'm confused. It looks like they will be using GM fuel cell tech as well as GM battery tech? Does Nikola bring anything to this deal other then 200,000 $7,500 tax credits that may or may not be worth anything when the truck gets to market?

Also... COST PLUS CONTRACT LOL.

If they can play the tax credits like Tesla did it could be significantly more than 200k units.

GM can sell off Nikola stock over time so if they play it right they’ll literally get more volume and tooling/development amortization for free. It’s quite slick if I’m interpreting this correctly. Lousy, but slick.

 

[JRP3]

Long interview with Sean Mitchell. No real insights provided, he thinks Nikola may have some software that's interesting, he bought a few shares, and the people there are really nice. He makes some comparisons with Tesla in the early days without seeming to understand that while Tesla was often late with products they never lied about the basic physics of EV's and charging infrastructure, unlike Nikola regarding fuel cells.

 

[Fred42]

I'm confused. It looks like they will be using GM fuel cell tech as well as GM battery tech? Does Nikola bring anything to this deal other then 200,000 $7,500 tax credits that may or may not be worth anything when the truck gets to market?

Also... COST PLUS CONTRACT LOL.

Nikola brings potential sales volume that would enable lower unit costs on GM brand vehicles. Nikola is paying for GM product development that probably benefits GM as well as Nikola vehicles. Potential downside for GM is Nikola's first $2 billion payments is in stock that might or might not yield anticipated value when sold.

 

[JRP3]

Bunch of Nikola related videos

 

[vikings123]

Popcorn time!

Nikola: How to Parlay An Ocean of Lies Into a Partnership With the Largest Auto OEM in America

 

[Causalien]

Popcorn time!

Nikola: How to Parlay An Ocean of Lies Into a Partnership With the Largest Auto OEM in America

The guy's already got close to 100 mil. Will there be any consequences after it all blows up?

 

[JohnSnowNW]

Popcorn time!

Nikola: How to Parlay An Ocean of Lies Into a Partnership With the Largest Auto OEM in America

Wow, I even learned some new shenanigans from that.

 

[heltok]

 

[ammulder]

So, Bloomberg reports that GM gets 80% of the EV credits generated by manufacturing the Badger (and has first right of refusal on the remainder). I think THAT'S what's in it for GM. They basically serve as a contract manufacturer for Nikola, getting paid for that work outright, and then ALSO getting enough EV credits that they can continue selling ICE pickups and SUVs. While buffing up their green credentials in the process.

The good news with the Badger is, I guess now we'll see whether there's an actual product there or not.

 

[ZsoZso]

Bunch of Nikola related videos

Trevor invented the vertically integrated BS!
He just said they are not even planning to ever make any truck on their own, so how is that for vertical integration ?

 

[Watts_Up]

I'm confused. It looks like they will be using GM fuel cell tech as well as GM battery tech?
Does Nikola bring anything to this deal other then 200,000 $7,500 tax credits that may
or may not be worth anything when the truck gets to market?

Also... COST PLUS CONTRACT LOL.

So if "The Boring Company" starts making some passenger vans and decides to sell them to fleets or individual customers,
does the 200,000 x $7,500 tax credits would be also available if "The Boring Company" uses "Tesla" as a supplier/contractor?

If so, why not creating a new company called "The CyberTruck Company" to get advantage of the 200,000 x $7,500 tax credits?

 

[phantasms]

Wait a Fn minute. Not sure if this was said.

A company named Hindenburg is coming out saying that Nikola, the hydrogen fuel vehicle, is a fraud.

Yet more evidence of the simulation.

 

[humbaba]

from the investor thread, looks like most of this has already been covered here...

...there has to be something there for GM).

It is almost a no-lose situation for GM. What do they get out of it?

• publicity
• seen as being pro environment
• 80% of the credits
• profit from a fresh $7500 tax break
• sole supplier on a cost-plus basis for batteries and H2 (and parts)
• $700M for building out production

Not terribly strong. For example, the implication of the tax break is that you are able to price such that profits are increased by $7500 -- but it in no way assures sales. Same for the 80% of the credits and sole supplier. For this somewhat tenuous benefit what do the risk?

• publicity (association with a conman, but GM is the victim here)
• design and engineering costs for a Nikola badged vehicle

I'm not seeing anything else because it is all on a cost-plus basis. In theory they get paid $2B for the design and engineering, but they can only cash out 1/3 each year and that value will decline as $NKLA drops.

My bet is that GM allocates resources for design and engineering commensurate with the amount of $NKLA they have cashed out. Like Trevor's other deals (other than the one where he was out con'd) he gets them through (charismatic?) persistence and it being risk-free for the other party.

The thing with Nikola is that Trevor is actually the conman that $TSLAQ has always claimed Elon is. He will likely walk off with millions, but as this is his biggest con yet it is possible that he will upset someone with the resources to bury him in court.

 

[M|S|M MYP]

I am still trying to figure out how many Badger reservations have been placed....

 

[Stretch2727]

I think Mary Barra was really dumb with this deal or smart like a fox and using it take out a potential competitor.

I just don't see how diverting your resources to work with a start up with no technology or distribution channel benefits GM.

Honestly think she was forced to "do something" as they are 7-8 years behind Tesla and with the rising market value of Tesla she needed to have some strong EV association to hopefully raise the GM stock price. Unfortunately having you team now working on multiple EV's when you do not yet have one successful EV internally is not a path for success. The whole thing to me looks like GM is essentially in a panic on being so far behind.

 

[M|S|M MYP]

I think Mary Barra was really dumb with this deal or smart like a fox and using it take out a potential competitor.

I just don't see how diverting your resources to work with a start up with no technology or distribution channel benefits GM.

Honestly think she was forced to "do something" as they are 7-8 years behind Tesla and with the rising market value of Tesla she needed to have some strong EV association to hopefully raise the GM stock price. Unfortunately having you team now working on multiple EV's when you do not yet have one successful EV internally is not a path for success. The whole thing to me looks like GM is essentially in a panic on being so far behind.

Im wondering if they have an 'escape' clause written in their deal...because right now would be a great time to visit that.

 

[M|S|M MYP]

I remember watching an interview with Trevor and he said 'Nikola is the pioneer of trucking and Tesla is just following in their footsteps'....what a clown

 

[Fred42]

Popcorn time!

Nikola: How to Parlay An Ocean of Lies Into a Partnership With the Largest Auto OEM in America

I'm glad they were upfront that they are short NKLA, but I wish they weren't as it suggests the possibility of lack of objectivity. But I'm not saying I don't believe the article.

 

[Fred42]

There's been little progress at the Coolidge factory site because they don't have a building permit. But that's Trevor's fault as they only filed for a building permit two days before the groundbreaking ceremony.