TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker and becoming a Supporting Member. For more info: Support TMC

AP2 - Definitely heading in the right direction...

Discussion in 'Model S: Driving Dynamics' started by Driver Dave, Jun 7, 2017.

  1. BestRadar

    BestRadar Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2013
    Messages:
    601
    Location:
    NJ
    Cruise Control is different than adaptive cruise control which is different than auto pilot. You all are missing the point. Clear your head and go to the Tesla page for the first time. Your impression of what this vehicle can do would completely change verse what it really can do. I challenge any of you to find someone that is neutral and ask them to review the Tesla website and ask them to tell you what they learned. I have done it and just about everyone will say.. Wow this car can drive itself. Its what its marketed at and what its sold as. Go to the Tesla page and choose an S or X and what stands out? Tesla Full Self Driving Hardware and the infamous video of it driving on its own... Order Now! Sure stuff is now worded differently in the fine print but its still the feature they are using to sell and promote this vehicle. Imagine having 300k people getting AP2 on a Model 3 do you not think these younger people will put more or less faith than an older more experienced person. If something dramatically does not change with AP2 yes it will become dangerous out there with these new drivers activating Auto Pilot.
     
    • Love x 2
    • Like x 1
    • Disagree x 1
  2. BestRadar

    BestRadar Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2013
    Messages:
    601
    Location:
    NJ
    AP1 is still very far ahead of AP2
     
    • Like x 3
    • Disagree x 2
    • Funny x 1
  3. Abqnative

    Abqnative Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2017
    Messages:
    28
    Location:
    North Andover, MA
    I plan to use AP2 when I can knowing the limitations of roads and surprises like pot holes. Why should we put the total burden on the AP2 software? We need to push the city, state and national road commissions to improve the roads we drive on. It would improve safety. Besides clear line markings, maybe they could include markers for AP equipped cars to use in known ambiguous sections.
     
    • Like x 2
  4. lunitiks

    lunitiks Cool James & Black Teacher

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2016
    Messages:
    2,708
    Location:
    Prawn Island, VC
    First of all, thank you for an excellent post @essmd.

    To your question: Tesla didn't change vendors voluntarily / without pressure from Mobileye. It seems very clear that Tesla wanted to keep ME, but at the same time use MEs tech to help them migrate to a new in-house vision system. ME wouldn't have it, so they demanded more $$$$ and more control / exclusivity. Elon said f*** off so they broke up.
     
    • Like x 1
  5. NerdUno

    NerdUno Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2016
    Messages:
    647
    Location:
    Charleston, SC
    My recollection is that Mobileye was quite concerned that Elon was overpromoting what Mobileye's current hardware and software were capable of delivering safely. So... I think the divorce was mutual.

    Just wondering what your credentials are for proclaiming everyone that disagrees with you a bad driver? Maybe once you master spelling and basic grammar, we can all chat about how the rest of us could become driving experts like you. :eek:
     
  6. essmd

    essmd Phantom X

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2015
    Messages:
    372
    Location:
    DFW, Texas
    Got it, well that little Tesla milestone potentially destroyed their AP and FSD future (I used to think it was just the lack of LIDAR) , although you would not know it from the stock value and all of the new "Fan Boys" that are still optimistic that AP2 will eventually equal and surpass AP1.

    Should even a quarter of the investors have real insight to this issue, I suspect Tesla stock would take a significant hit.
     
    • Disagree x 2
  7. essmd

    essmd Phantom X

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2015
    Messages:
    372
    Location:
    DFW, Texas
    ABSOLUTELY !!!

    I think the foundation of the AP2 process is far less stable and accurate despite using upgraded hardware and CPU, so is it mostly the software and AI component that puts it behind AP1?

    I don't disagree with the perspective that is not just ready for the road yet, perhaps it should be more limited or even deactivated until at least as reliable as AP1, but that would really raise some eyebrows.

    Has the NTSB fully evaluated and approved it in the current form,. or is it riding on the coattails of AP1?

    We used to hear about almost every little accident related to Tesla AP, but I am curious about the comparison of incidents comparing AP1 and AP2. We can only hope that for public safety, an "intelligent" government regulatory oversight is paying attention.
     
    • Disagree x 2
  8. essmd

    essmd Phantom X

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2015
    Messages:
    372
    Location:
    DFW, Texas
    No need to get personal, we are all entitled to opinions and perspectives, however mine happen to be correct;)

    I used to preach that AP1 increased the safety of my driving, as I was more relaxed while monitoring the quality functionality of AP1 without having to get "stressed out" by responding to every speed and directional adjustment of regular driving, which I had done very well for over 40 years.

    It is similar to current pilots flying with autopilot, versus those flying basic planes... Night and Day difference of an experience.

    With AP2, my stress is clearly increased, as is my frustration as I am constantly comparing AP1 to AP2, which may be unique to those of us with months of experience with the current AP1.

    For those of you only with AP2, I guess I should apologize for my negative perspective, since you have only enjoyed improvements over time.
     
    • Like x 2
    • Informative x 1
  9. NerdUno

    NerdUno Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2016
    Messages:
    647
    Location:
    Charleston, SC
    Sorry, @essmd. The last portion of my comment was directed to @Driver Dave who routinely attacks the driving skills of mere mortals.
     
  10. JonG

    JonG Banned

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2015
    Messages:
    490
    Location:
    UK

    But AP1 v AP2 is irrelevant in so far as they both require you to be alert and ready to intervene. The only difference is AP1 requires less intervention, but it still requires it and always will
     
  11. 3Victoria

    3Victoria Active Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2016
    Messages:
    1,699
    Location:
    Victoria, British Columbia
    AP2 is very close to AP1, and the latest update strating to roll out as I write this essentially makes them equal, if not AP2 better. From now on AP2 will exceed AP1 capabilities. Oh, and 6-8 months is incredably fast for Tesla to duplicate Mobileye-functionalty that had taken Mobileye years to develop.
     
    • Informative x 1
    • Like x 1
  12. NerdUno

    NerdUno Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2016
    Messages:
    647
    Location:
    Charleston, SC
  13. Electroman

    Electroman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2012
    Messages:
    5,489
    Location:
    TX
    #73 Electroman, Jun 10, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 10, 2017
    That was the PR stunt that MobileEye chief pulled, to tarnish Tesla.

    It was obvious that Tesla wanted to iterate and go at a faster pace than what MobileEye could possibly do, and when Tesla started plans of using nVidia hardware, MobileEye learnt they are being shunted out anyway and then decided the pull the plug earlier than Tesla would have done. So the gradual phase out that Tesla had planned did not materialize.

    Besides there was also a rumor that Mobile wanted IP rights to all the data Tesla is collecting through their hardware - which is laughable and outrageous. This is like Intel or Oracle stating that all your data belongs to us !!
     
    • Like x 3
    • Informative x 1
  14. kdday

    kdday Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2016
    Messages:
    719
    Location:
    AZ
    Not so fast :). AP1 reads speed limit signs and displays vehicles in adjacent lanes on the dash. Still some more catching up to do.
     
    • Like x 1
  15. anticitizen13.7

    anticitizen13.7 Not posting at TMC after 9/17/2018

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2012
    Messages:
    3,654
    Location:
    United States
    Disclaimer: I held shares in both MBLY and TSLA before and after the breakup with Tesla.

    My recollection is that Mobileye publicly praised Tesla's aggressive approach to self driving technology. Short of inside information, it's impossible to know whether the fatal accident in FL, business disagreement, something else, or a combination of factors led to the split between Tesla and Mobileye.
     
    • Like x 2
  16. 3Victoria

    3Victoria Active Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2016
    Messages:
    1,699
    Location:
    Victoria, British Columbia
    Yeah, very close, as I said.
     
  17. Driver Dave

    Driver Dave Member

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2016
    Messages:
    561
    Location:
    Boston, MA
    I'm not sure this is true anymore. I have both and use both regularly.

    Both are good on highways.

    AP1 is smoother.

    AP2 seems a little better on local roads.

    At this point it is sort of a wash.

    I do see how AP1 will stay as it is, and AP2 will eclipse it. Maybe with next update. Certainly when the rest of the cameras turn on.
     
    • Like x 3
    • Informative x 2
  18. Bladerskb

    Bladerskb Senior Software Engineer

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2016
    Messages:
    1,676
    Location:
    Michigan
    do you occasionally try to ram the car, truck, van infront of you or brake suddenly for overhead signs?
     
  19. Electroman

    Electroman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2012
    Messages:
    5,489
    Location:
    TX
    Yes.
     
    • Funny x 1
  20. WarpedOne

    WarpedOne Supreme Premier

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2006
    Messages:
    3,847
    Location:
    Slovenia, Europe
    So ... if I'm defending, then you must be attacking?
    What If I am not defending anything, just pointing out the obvious hole in this bickering. If you find AP2 unusable, DON'T use it. Demand your money back and go live your happy life without your children preventing you from turning it on.
    As far as I know, no-one is forcing you to use it. And as far as I can see your children have better judgment than you.
     
    • Like x 3

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Formed in 2006, Tesla Motors Club (TMC) was the first independent online Tesla community. Today it remains the largest and most dynamic community of Tesla enthusiasts. Learn more.
  • Do you value your experience at TMC? Consider becoming a Supporting Member of Tesla Motors Club. As a thank you for your contribution, you'll get nearly no ads in the Community and Groups sections. Additional perks are available depending on the level of contribution. Please visit the Account Upgrades page for more details.


    SUPPORT TMC