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Autopilot and Trust

NCC81701

Member
Feb 28, 2020
80
95
San Diego
I've had my MY for about the same amount of time as @ryanjeffords and I go to my in-laws about once a week so i've been able to try NoA over the same route multiple times and in two general conditions lite traffic and medium traffic situations.

FSD is like the perfect driver ed student. It knows and follows rules of the road pretty well and in these areas I actually trust it a great deal. If it's just a matter of keeping distance or following traffic in stop and go where there's zero decision making it's about as good as I can ask anyone to drive. Where FSD is really lacking are situations that involves human-factors or requires human experiences and the ability to predict potentially hazardous situations. FSD doesn't really do merging traffic well or at least I don't trust it enough to let it handle it.

What I mean by human factors are things like It doesn't watch cars coming onto the freeway on ramp, anticipating it and slow down/speed up so you'd end up parallel with a car that is trying to get onto the freeway. Speaking of, FSD have no issues with staying parallel with another car for super long stretches. It's not against the rules of the road but it's generally a bad idea as people in generally have pretty poor situational awareness of what's to the sides and rear of them while driving. I've found that when I do "take over" I generally have it change lanes to avoid a potentially problematic merge, or if I can't avoid being in the merging lane then I take over. In the parallel situation, I'd hit the accelerator until I'm ahead of the other driver. When I see a situation where I'm not sure how well AP will handing, I generally hover my foot over accelerator or brake peddle and so far I've generally found that I have not had to intervene in these situations.

From all the times I've used FSD on the hwy, my general conclusion is that under a lite traffic condition, you can pretty much trust that it will take you from on-ramp to off-ramp, especially if you tell AP to use the middle or left lanes on the freeway. Under medium traffic conditions you might have to direct it a bit more in terms of telling it to preemptively switch lanes or speed up based on traffic pattern. Under heavy congested traffic, FSD/AP works as long as you are not in the merging lane and if you have to be on the merging lane, just take over and drive yourself.

I've played with FSD on streets some but it is a far cry from what it can do on the hwy and in general this is because you are basically constantly in a merging lane in medium-heavy traffic condition on surface streets. One unexpected problem that I've found is that one part of my route to work have a section where the posted speed limit is 40mph, but because it is a huge stretch of downhill that the average traffic speed is 60+. You'd probably get run over if you are going 40 and AP wouldn't let you go over +5mph off highways which makes FSD unusable on my route to work. If my work route has almost no traffic and doesn't need to make turns at intersections it can probably get me to work and back w/out interventions. It will be interesting to see when we do get the Beta button how much of these human factor related problems Neural Net FSD have solved.
 
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73Bruin

Member
Nov 7, 2020
140
53
Torrance, CA
Worst part is having to hold the wheel so hard. I usually hold one hand on the bottom part of wheel , the Y seems to require the top, or a really tight squeeze on bottom...hope they fix else i might have to find other methods.
My experience is limited but it certainly doesn't seem to register two hands on 10-2 or the 8-4 that my safe driving course said is preferred (due to the increased chances of having one's arm broken if the air bags deploys).
 

TomServo

Active Member
Apr 10, 2014
1,165
708
Belleville IL
I trust it and use it on the highway and it's fabulous in stop n go traffic. It's a great way to eliminate some of the stress and mundane routines on long trips.

I don't use the "steering wheel wiggle" method anymore, I roll the left scroll wheel (volume) UP or DOWN on a notch to let the car know I'm still there.
 

DanDi58

Member
Jun 22, 2020
754
558
Dayton NJ
Worst part is having to hold the wheel so hard. I usually hold one hand on the bottom part of wheel , the Y seems to require the top, or a really tight squeeze on bottom...hope they fix else i might have to find other methods.
Don't know what you mean, I just have to give it a gentle tug anywhere and that satisfies the requirement...
 

kavyboy

Active Member
Jan 13, 2016
1,207
2,041
Spring, TX
Worst part is having to hold the wheel so hard. I usually hold one hand on the bottom part of wheel , the Y seems to require the top, or a really tight squeeze on bottom...hope they fix else i might have to find other methods.
It's not pressure on the wheel, it's torque - as in turning or wiggling. You could grip it hard enough to make diamonds on a straight road and still get nags.
 
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Hexo09

Member
Mar 8, 2021
62
45
Bay Area, CA
I've read a few things here and there but I'm still unsure of the answer to this question: What is the benefit to using TACC when you can use autosteer? Wouldn't everyone rather have the car steer AND stay at the right speed?
 

finman100

Member
Feb 4, 2016
19
17
Albany, OR
for me, sometimes basic Autopilot lane centering is not ideal. rutted roads are an example. i'll just run on TACC and steer a bit out of the ruts for a smoother quieter ride. i know, I'm weird that way. another example is the closeness to a lane line. I'd prefer to stay a bit farther away from bigger vehicles. that requires my steering input, not the auto-centering function.

Overall, basic autopilot is awesome. i dunno if Full Self driving will be in my future. I might do a monthly thing like i pay for internet connectivity. Surely right now at ten grand it's a no go for my finances.
 

DanDi58

Member
Jun 22, 2020
754
558
Dayton NJ
I've read a few things here and there but I'm still unsure of the answer to this question: What is the benefit to using TACC when you can use autosteer? Wouldn't everyone rather have the car steer AND stay at the right speed?
I was a little uncomfortable using Autosteer in heavy traffic, especially with a truck next to me. AS does a great job of keeping you centered in your lane, but of the vehicle next to you creeps to the side of their lane, you might normally creep to the opposite side of your lane to keep some space, but AS doesn't do that (I don't think). I also found that because many of the potholes in the road tend to be where the tires mostly travel, AS is great for driving through every single pot hole, where normally you might drift a bit in your lane to avoid one.
 

kavyboy

Active Member
Jan 13, 2016
1,207
2,041
Spring, TX
I've read a few things here and there but I'm still unsure of the answer to this question: What is the benefit to using TACC when you can use autosteer? Wouldn't everyone rather have the car steer AND stay at the right speed?
I'll second what @finman100 wrote. On side streets with curbs I don't want it wandering over and hitting them. I also don't trust it to keep in the correct lane at large intersections. It's easier to just steer than to monitor the auto steering, but I welcome the constant speed.
 

CapsEngineer

Member
Nov 28, 2020
67
54
Maryland
My problem is turning auto steer off. Whenever I try, I end up with this hard back and forth movement while I try to wrestle control from it. How does everyone smoothly take over from auto steer?
 

DanDi58

Member
Jun 22, 2020
754
558
Dayton NJ
My problem is turning auto steer off. Whenever I try, I end up with this hard back and forth movement while I try to wrestle control from it. How does everyone smoothly take over from auto steer?
I typically push the stalk up then down once to re-egage TACC. I'm not sure you can disengage AS without also disengaging TACC. The manual isn't really clear about that.
 
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Hexo09

Member
Mar 8, 2021
62
45
Bay Area, CA
for me, sometimes basic Autopilot lane centering is not ideal. rutted roads are an example. i'll just run on TACC and steer a bit out of the ruts for a smoother quieter ride. i know, I'm weird that way. another example is the closeness to a lane line. I'd prefer to stay a bit farther away from bigger vehicles. that requires my steering input, not the auto-centering function.

Overall, basic autopilot is awesome. i dunno if Full Self driving will be in my future. I might do a monthly thing like i pay for internet connectivity. Surely right now at ten grand it's a no go for my finances.

I was a little uncomfortable using Autosteer in heavy traffic, especially with a truck next to me. AS does a great job of keeping you centered in your lane, but of the vehicle next to you creeps to the side of their lane, you might normally creep to the opposite side of your lane to keep some space, but AS doesn't do that (I don't think). I also found that because many of the potholes in the road tend to be where the tires mostly travel, AS is great for driving through every single pot hole, where normally you might drift a bit in your lane to avoid one.
These are fair points, especially the pothole one. I could definitely see that. I'm lucky enough that my commute route got recently repaved. As for large vehicles, I feel like the car moved away from trucks and other cars if they creep too close to my lane. But it might be my imagination...
I'll second what @finman100 wrote. On side streets with curbs I don't want it wandering over and hitting them. I also don't trust it to keep in the correct lane at large intersections. It's easier to just steer than to monitor the auto steering, but I welcome the constant speed.
Uh? Autosteer is meant to be for highways and freeways, not for city driving. FSD isn't even technically for city driving yet.
 

CapsEngineer

Member
Nov 28, 2020
67
54
Maryland
I typically push the stalk up then down once to re-egage TACC. I'm not sure you can disengage AS without also disengaging TACC. The manual isn't really clear about that.

I currently turn it off by pushing the stalk up and hated it because it turned off TACC. I never thought about just pushing it back down.

Sometimes I’m just so stupid.
 
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Exelion

Member
Feb 21, 2021
105
117
Los Angeles, CA
Don't know what you mean, I just have to give it a gentle tug anywhere and that satisfies the requirement...

See, I think there's quite a few ways to accomplish this. Besides the tugging and the now-and-then scrolling, what I do is grab the steering wheel at the 8 o'clock position and hang my left arm from the steering wheel with juuuuuuust enough pressure to kinda pull the steering wheel a bit, but not enough to turn it.

Then there's some people who hang aerobic/scuba diving weights on the side of the steering wheel............(won't go there)
 

FOOLSLFDRVNG

Member
Nov 3, 2020
101
52
Los Angeles
I got FSD and on a 2 lane road with cars parked on the right, I'm most concerned that those parked cars are sticking out too much or if they open the door I will get side swiped.
 

73Bruin

Member
Nov 7, 2020
140
53
Torrance, CA
I dislike the AP on my AWD. Today's blunders both involved going round a curve on a freeway (so not that sharp a turn) at freeway speed. In both cases a large 18 wheeler tractor/trailer was in the right hand lane and about a car length ahead. As the road curved AP freaked out because the tractor portion was in front. of the MY. It caused the MY to break sharply even though the truck and I both remained in our separate lanes. Anyone else have these kind of issues? Do we report it to anyone? I do not have FSD.
 

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