Supercharger - Bethany, MO

[DanL50]

Tesla cancelled this planned SC installation. The transformer was already delivered, the project permitted, etc.
I know there are plenty of places that could use additional SC's, but this one is critical to winter travel along this major N/S route.
Tesla must be under a lot of $ pressure to have cancelled this one so late in the install process. Any other key cancellations? Now considering a CHAdeMO.
Story at Bethany, MO Supercharger

 

[Barklikeadog]

That is kinda scary. Enough analysts have written about the tesla cash situation being critical... And musk says all is well no cash issues. So many actions speak otherwise. August 1st is going to be interesting.

 

[funcc]

Tesla cancelled this planned SC installation. The transformer was already delivered, the project permitted, etc.
I know there are plenty of places that could use additional SC's, but this one is critical to winter travel along this major N/S route.
Tesla must be under a lot of $ pressure to have cancelled this one so late in the install process. Any other key cancellations? Now considering a CHAdeMO.
Story at Bethany, MO Supercharger

You have to really plan out your Mid-West trips as the number of SCs are scarce compared to other parts of the country. I-35 North from KC is one problem. I-55 South from St Louis is another. The Sikeston SC is just too far from St Louis. The recently opened SC in St Louis's South County Center will now help a lot.

Getting a CHAdeMO was expensive, but I felt like I had to do it to travel in the Mid-West. Saved me a couple of times. I recommend getting one as a patch between the too far away SCs. I'm very jealous of the density of SCs in California

 

[TexasEV]

Baseless speculation to claim it was due to Tesla needing to reduce expenses. How do you know it wasn’t related to a contract dispute with the site or some other reason? If it was to reduce expenses, more likely they would delay construction for a quarter, not cancel the site. Unless this is a widespread phenomenon I just don’t buy it.

 

[swegman]

I-10 and I-40 each gave an approximate stretch of 380 miles that prevents one from driving from the east coast to the west coast via superchargers. The Fort Stockton, TX location (the only supercharger location needed to complete the I-10 route) has been in the permit stage for nearly 2 years, with various locations having been proposed for its location without apparent approval.

So maybe Tesla canceled the Bethany location to save money, and maybe not. Above, it was stated that a Bethany official stated easements were being finalizing. That means Tesla did not have approval to encroach on the property at that time. Something may have come up to throw a monkey wrench in the selected location.

 

[DanL50]

If you read the referenced thread above, Bethany, MO Supercharger ,the info that Tesla cancelled the installation comes directly from conversations with the Bethany City Administrator and the building inspector.
The permits and easements were set and the transformer had been ordered (and may have already been delivered).
And yes, rather than "must be", I should have said "perhaps" Tesla is under pressure to reduce expenses.

 

[Beardco]

Did anyone consider the more classic and obvious reason: the local municipality demanded greenbacks or a cut of the revenue from the supercharger?

I guess that's not as exciting as claiming Tesla is out of cash.

 

[swegman]

... the info that Tesla cancelled the installation comes directly from conversations with the Bethany City Administrator and the building inspector.
The permits and easements were set ...

Actually, the Administrator was reported as saying the easements were being finalized. In other words, it was not a done deal with respect to the easements. Until the easements are actually granted, Tesla can not legally run electrical lines, etc on the property. Thus it's pure speculation that Tesla canceled the project solely to save money. Any number of reasons could have arisen to prevent construction on the chosen site. Only time will tell what the reason was.

 

[PLUS EV]

Looked at various route planners and the trip is nearly un-doable in winter with snow. This is a major bummer.
Beginning to get a bit disillusioned. The other "weak link" in my typical route is Kingman to Flagstaff AZ. Forget about that trip in winter.
The transformer was already paid for and delivered, so Tesla re-imbursed Bethany for that sunk cost. Ridiculous.

I have advocated for a supercharger between Kingman and Flagstaff, but I'm curious what you are driving that you think that leg is undoable. It's only 148 miles, albeit with a 3600 ft elevation change. Should be manageable with slow driving as long as you aren't in a 60.

 

[DanL50]

Uncle.
Relevant facts stated by city administrator in phone conversation: Tesla delayed twice, then cancelled; Tesla reimbursing Bethany for sunk cost of transformer; Bethany now looking to VW Trust for funds to install a non-Tesla charging station.

Tesla is the most wonderful company on Earth and Mars.

 

[Barklikeadog]

Uncle.
Relevant facts stated by city administrator in phone conversation: Tesla delayed twice, then cancelled; Tesla reimbursing Bethany for sunk cost of transformer; Bethany now looking to VW Trust for funds to install a non-Tesla charging station.

Tesla is the most wonderful company on Earth and Mars.

nice effort

 

[DanL50]

With a 75D, ABetterRoutePlanner, with settings of 20F, light rain/snow, 500lbs load, no headwind and only 10% arrival charge shows a max speed of 45mph for the trip.
Those conditions are likely when we make the trip. With dry roads it's 59mph max.
Not undoable...a weak link...probably avoid doing it in Dec/Jan. But I'm still a rookie with range anxiety I guess. We make the trip for the holidays with a full car. I'd likely be OK doing it alone. Also, Williams has a hotel with a DC, but for guests only. I think they would be flexible if needed.
Another factor here is that Williams is the "Gateway to the Grand Canyon". It would be a great place, and I think necessary, to top off for a trip to the canyon (about 60 miles each way).

 

[DanL50]

Bark...thanks.

 

[jgillispie]

With a 75D, ABetterRoutePlanner, with settings of 20F, light rain/snow, 500lbs load, no headwind and only 10% arrival charge shows a max speed of 45mph for the trip.
Those conditions are likely when we make the trip. With dry roads it's 59mph max.
Not undoable...a weak link...probably avoid doing it in Dec/Jan. But I'm still a rookie with range anxiety I guess. We make the trip for the holidays with a full car. I'd likely be OK doing it alone. Also, Williams has a hotel with a DC, but for guests only. I think they would be flexible if needed.
Another factor here is that Williams is the "Gateway to the Grand Canyon". It would be a great place, and I think necessary, to top off for a trip to the canyon (about 60 miles each way).

That's a strange number. I did 130mi, mostly flat, at -12F, moderate headwind and ~600lbs payload last winter. S75D made it with ~5% spare. That was doing 65-70mph most of the trip. The elevation hurts but I cant imagine AZ gets nearly that cold.

I noticed the reference consumption was a bit high on ABRP for my vehicle at 65mph. It started at 324wh/mi which is closer to what I get at 75-78mph with mild conditions.

 

[PLUS EV]

The elevation hurts but I cant imagine AZ gets nearly that cold.

Flagstaff can actually get much colder than what he listed. And even Kingman often freezes in the winter. An average day in Dec/Jan would be in the 40s in Kingman and below freezing up in Flagstaff, but if a cold front comes in, it could easily be below freezing in Kingman and single digits in Flagstaff.

The good news is you are unlikely to be driving into a headwind on the Kingman to Flagstaff leg, but if some freak weather pattern causes a headwind, you would be in real trouble. And obviously if there is snow/ice on the roadway, that would be a real problem as well.

I do agree that something seems off about his numbers though. I think with conservative driving (say 65mph) and a full charge, he should be able to make that leg on the typical winter day (bare pavement, no headwind and no extreme cold).


EDIT: I just entered some fairly awful conditions on evtripplanner and going typical highway speed into a 20mph headwind with average temp of 10F and payload of 800 lbs, it uses 228 rated miles in an S70D. It actually uses less than that with a 75D, but I'm pretty sure there's some bug with the S75D in evtp. Anyways the S70D numbers seem reasonable, and you would barely make it under those conditions with an S70D, but obviously you could slow down below the typical speed of traffic. Those conditions aren't the worst possible, but they are probably worse than 90+% of the Dec/Jan conditions you would encounter. The only thing I couldn't do is simulate snow/ice on the highway.

 

[DanL50]

As jgillespie noted, ABRP shows 324Wh/mile at 65. I have 5K miles on the 75D...not sure what the use rate actually is. Need to start noting the use rates. I'll take a look at EVTP too.
Thanks for the analyses and comments....helpful.

 

[TCIslandTime]

Drove from Independence, MO to Des Moines, IA last week. Left with 97% charge, drafted behind two different trucks at 71 mph for about 1/4 of the trip - otherwise never exceeded 70 mph. Finished last 20 miles at 60 to 65 mph and reached SC with 1% left and white knuckles. Model X, 90D with 22" turbines.

 

[RobK]

Drove from Independence, MO to Des Moines, IA last week. Left with 97% charge, drafted behind two different trucks at 71 mph for about 1/4 of the trip - otherwise never exceeded 70 mph. Finished last 20 miles at 60 to 65 mph and reached SC with 1% left and white knuckles. Model X, 90D with 22" turbines.

I bet that would be tense. We had traveled from Overland Park, KS to Verona, WI via Des Moines last year with battery indicator in the red in our Model S 85. I will charge the battery to 100% tomorrow and use the NAV to see if it will take me directly to Des Moines or if it will take me to the KCI SC first. Not sure how the loss of battery charge factors in our 3 year old (11K Mile) Tesla. Wish we had Bethnay. MO SC operational. That would make the journey so much stress free for lot of people.

 

[Jdcleary]

Drove from Independence, MO to Des Moines, IA last week. Left with 97% charge, drafted behind two different trucks at 71 mph for about 1/4 of the trip - otherwise never exceeded 70 mph. Finished last 20 miles at 60 to 65 mph and reached SC with 1% left and white knuckles. Model X, 90D with 22" turbines.

Was the A/C running all the way? We take this trip, both ways, several times a year and winter is even more challenging. Our Model X 90D with 20 inch tires uses a lot of watts with the Air Conditioning running (perhaps 10-15% more). It's 195 miles between the superchargers and conditions have to be good or slower driving is required.

 

[RobK]

Was the A/C running all the way? We take this trip, both ways, several times a year and winter is even more challenging. Our Model X 90D with 20 inch tires uses a lot of watts with the Air Conditioning running (perhaps 10-15% more). It's 195 miles between the superchargers and conditions have to be good or slower driving is required.

Yes, we had the AC running all the way. I just fully charged our Model S 85 to 100% (268 miles nominal range). As per the NAV system it will take me to Des Moines directly. I was under the impression that "Dual Drive" motors provided slightly better milage. Not sure about the X model but you have a slightly bigger battery than mine and you are closer to Des Moines than us. I thought that would have been a much easier trip. BTW how many people in the care when you make the trip?

You might find this route planner useful, if you have not used it: A Better Routeplanner