"Blind Spot Detection is disappointing"

[SDRick]

My bad, must have read too quickly. I am usually pretty good picking up and putting out the sarcasm.

It seems clear that he's poking fun at the absurdity of some other posts on this topic.

 

[FooBar]

My son's 2015 mazda 6 ($25K) has excellent blind spot monitoring - flash on the mirror whenever a car is in the blind spot plus a beeping sound if turn indicator is on. I have not seen it fail. It also warns of cross traffic when backing out - this is a very useful feature especially when backing out of a parking spot; it cannot be solve by checking blind spots etc. . My sister's 2015 Honda shows the camera view from the RHS mirror if you hit the right turn turn indicator. I prefer the one on the Mazda. Both of these are better than what is there on the Tesla Model S.

On Tesla the warning indicators on the front dashboard are fairly useless for blind spot or cross traffic. Keeping the rear view camera on half the screen all the time is a little distracting but that seems to be best option so far. BTW this can be improved by a software change in the Tesla where it only displays the camera view when the turn indicator is on; it can be further improved if it could use the newer model's side cameras instead of the rear camera.

One buys a Telsa for 1) electric car, 2) super power/acceleration, 3) Driver-assist and in the future full auto-drive, 4) Super cool car.
In this forum thread many have argued that checking the blind is more reliable - but so is fully manual driving.
Driver-assist feature such as blind spot and rear cross traffic monitoring work very well and have been available on $25K cars since 2015 (Mazda, Subaru, etc). Tesla does not have it on its $100K car.

In this forum, some have mentioned that because Tesla uses ultrasonic sensors and it is not fixable via software change. Indeed if that is the case then this sad: Tesla's has focused only on auto-driving technology and ignored much simpler driver assist technology.
I am middle of making a decision to buy a Model S and love that it has 8 cameras which makes the car ready for full auto driving when the software is ready and the regulations allow it; but what is holding me back is that simple driver-assist features like blind-spot and cross-rear-traffic monitoring may not possible. Can't they use the extra cameras for blind spot monitoring?

 

[Mirlen]

I keep my rear camera up on the top of my display 100% of the time and it acts as a wider rear view mirror which usually catches the tail of the car when it's in my blind spot. Highly recommend this and wish other cars would lose all their nannyisms which deactivate the camera when driving, so annoying! Hell my wife's new Odyssey won't even let ME, a passenger, program an address into the GPS?!?! WTF? Can't even use the app to send an address to the GPS because I'm registered as a 'driver'...good grief...Tesla, please don't go down that road!

 

[oktane]

Tesla cannot master basic safety features and will never accomplish FSD or EAP on AP2 hardware. It's really a shame.

 

[J-Bus]

I am aware we are on a Tesla forum. So obviously we are all a bit biased; but its pretty interesting to see how vigorously people feel they need to defend every shortcoming of the car. The fact that blind-spot monitoring is not supposed to completely replace the old-fashioned turn of the head and look over your shoulder is totally irrelevant. The whole point is that almost every other new car out there does a much better job at it than our Tesla's do. For a lot of people, myself including, blind spot monitors have made life on the road more comfortable and in some cases actually helped prevent accidents. Whether the accidents could have been prevented if I were a better driver is besides the point.

 

[edmost]

After almost getting creamed tonight in a lane change (not on autopilot) to the left, I am beginning to get the impression that the blind spot detection system on my 2016 Tesla Model S 90D is not nearly as proactive as the side mirror-based warning systems for other cars. On my previous car, a 2015 Mercedes Benz E400 Coupe, it was almost impossible to miss a car traveling behind you, and even if you ignored the warning light in the side view mirror, the turn signal indicator would have a very loud warning beep enabling you to abort the lane change.
With the Tesla, the "cone" that you see on your dashboard indicates vehicles on your side, but they are literally right next to you before the alert.
I brought my car back to the Tesla store in Paramus and they tell me that the sensors are not adjustable, and that they "all work like that". Not a good answer. Tesla needs to increase the distance that triggers those warning zones. I am just curious whether anyone else out there has experienced the same limitations with blind spot detection, especially on the driver's side rear sensor.

I am very disappointed in blind spot system
I had a Lexus hybrid previously - blind spot system is excellent- it does see cars in blind spot properly and it signals driver with amber warning light on side mirrors - I am very comfortable when in Lexus. In tesla I have no confidence. Warning light on dashboard is a mistake and it senses next land car when it is almost adjacent to you, not behind you. If I trusted the warning system I would have had multiple accidents . Major disappointment of the tesla system . It actually was much better before software upgrade in 2016

How do we get the attention of Elon Musk or engineers?

 

[electracity]

How do we get the attention of Elon Musk or engineers?

Find the entrance to the tunnel?

 

[whitex]

I am very disappointed in blind spot system
I had a Lexus hybrid previously - blind spot system is excellent- it does see cars in blind spot properly and it signals driver with amber warning light on side mirrors - I am very comfortable when in Lexus. In tesla I have no confidence. Warning light on dashboard is a mistake and it senses next land car when it is almost adjacent to you, not behind you. If I trusted the warning system I would have had multiple accidents . Major disappointment of the tesla system . It actually was much better before software upgrade in 2016

How do we get the attention of Elon Musk or engineers?

They know. It was Elon's genius idea that they could implement Body Side Monitoring using just parking sensors - he was wrong. His latest on this in the spirit "I will do it cheaper and better" is trying to do it using cameras in AP2. Sadly, it's been months since the AP2 release, but not camera based BSM. If and when they get there, it will likely work better than just parking sensors, but will likely still won't be as good as the other guys' radar based solution, especially in the dark, but hey, Tesla has to be different. I saw a schematic somewhere on the net once and the mirror wiring had a connection for BSM warning, but Elon probably thought that was too mainstream and therefore not in Tesla spirit, so it never made production. They even got rid of a rain sensor on AP2 cars because they thought they could do it differently, and so every AP2 car since day 1 has been driving without this feature.

 

[electracity]

They know. It was Elon's genius idea that they could implement Body Side Monitoring using just parking sensors - he was wrong. His latest on this in the spirit "I will do it cheaper and better" is trying to do it using cameras in AP2. Sadly, it's been months since the AP2 release, but not camera based BSM. If and when they get there, it will likely work better than just parking sensors, but will likely still won't be as good as the other guys' radar based solution, especially in the dark, but hey, Tesla has to be different. I saw a schematic somewhere on the net once and the mirror wiring had a connection for BSM warning, but Elon probably thought that was too mainstream and therefore not in Tesla spirit, so it never made production. They even got rid of a rain sensor on AP2 cars because they thought they could do it differently, and so every AP2 car since day 1 has been driving without this feature.

The total sensor package had to be inexpnsive enough to put on all model 3.

 

[whitex]

The total sensor package had to be inexpnsive enough to put on all model 3.

I get the intent, but:
1. I paid on average $100K+ per car for each of my Model S's, so I should not be getting cheap experimental sensor suite that doesn't do the job.
2. They could have included 2 sets of sensors, one proven working and one "Elon-experimental" on the car so they can evaluate how well they work. Heck, with the deep learning system, a working BSM could have been training the camera based neural net, save Tesla work.
3. Where is any engineering in this? The idea of using ultrasonic sensors for BSM shouldn't have made it passed the first proof of concept - someone took a car equipped with an ultrasonic parking sensor suite on a highway and noted how poorly it works detecting car when driving at 60mph. WTF? Elon has a brain fart and nobody bothers checking whether it makes sense, they just put it in production for a year and half? I get Tesla is using their customers as lab rats, but this idea could have been killed by a pair of high-school interns in 1 day of driving a rental car with parking sensors while recording how well it works.

 

[MarcusMaximus]

it senses next land car when it is almost adjacent to you, not behind you

I've seen this from others and find it different from my experience. I don't tend to use the blind spot detection because 1: Before I even think of using it, I've already turned my head and checked manually and 2: the indicator is pretty out of the way and easy to miss.

But, since I first saw complaints about it, I've been paying attention to it as cars approach/pass me on the freeway. Any time I've checked, I see the indicator come on shortly before the car leaves the mirror(in other words, while there's still ~1-2 feet of the car's rear bumper in the side mirror). It then stays on past the time when the car is visible in my peripheral vision while looking straight.

I guess this could come down to individual people's mirror settings, but at least for me, it completely covers what I'd consider to be the "blind spot".

 

[whitex]

I've seen this from others and find it different from my experience. I don't tend to use the blind spot detection because 1: Before I even think of using it, I've already turned my head and checked manually and 2: the indicator is pretty out of the way and easy to miss.

But, since I first saw complaints about it, I've been paying attention to it as cars approach/pass me on the freeway. Any time I've checked, I see the indicator come on shortly before the car leaves the mirror(in other words, while there's still ~1-2 feet of the car's rear bumper in the side mirror). It then stays on past the time when the car is visible in my peripheral vision while looking straight.

I guess this could come down to individual people's mirror settings, but at least for me, it completely covers what I'd consider to be the "blind spot".

Try it at highways speeds (>60mph) - it won't see half the cars in your blind-spots. Then try driving next to a semi.

 

[SucreTease]

I just received the August 2017 issue of Consumer Reports magazine, which contained a "Road Report" on Advanced Car Safety Features. It reports satisfaction scores on items such as Forward-Collision Warning, Automatic Emergency Braking, Adaptive Cruise Control, Blind-Spot Monitoring, Lane-Departure Warning & Lane-Kepping Assist, and Rear Cross-Traffic & Rearview Cameras. Tesla was in the Most Satisfying level on every one except for Blind-Spot Monitoring, where it scored lowest of all vehicles in satisfaction.

 

[MarcusMaximus]

Try it at highways speeds (>60mph) - it won't see half the cars in your blind-spots. Then try driving next to a semi.

Right, I've only ever checked at highway speeds.

That said, I noticed something tonight: on the driver's side, I see the behavior described(nothing until they're right next to me), but if people pass on the passenger side, I see what I described: any time the car isn't in view it shows up as the whisker graphic on the dash.

I wonder if there's something specific about the driver's side ultrasonics...

 

[whitex]

Right, I've only ever checked at highway speeds.

That said, I noticed something tonight: on the driver's side, I see the behavior described(nothing until they're right next to me), but if people pass on the passenger side, I see what I described: any time the car isn't in view it shows up as the whisker graphic on the dash.

I wonder if there's something specific about the driver's side ultrasonics...

It may vary with weather (wind, temperature, humidity), which side of the car the car is shining on, etc, etc. Bottom line, it's quite unreliable. If it does say something is there though, very good chance there is something there, though it may be a curb rather than another car, still, you shouldn't change lanes if the warning is showing. If the warning is not there, don't trust it, or we'll be seeing you on the other "how much does it cost to fix a Tesla" and "why does it take months to get parts" threads.

 

[Snowstorm]

Maybe this can be done using cameras in the AP2 set. The side camera may be able to be used but image processing it is a lot harder problem than just using echo from radar

 

[whitex]

Maybe this can be done using cameras in the AP2 set. The side camera may be able to be used but image processing it is a lot harder problem than just using echo from radar

It also doesn't work as well in the dark, especially once the headlights of the vehicle next to you are past the side camera. Basically, in the dark camera can only see lights, not the whole car, which makes tracking what's next to you harder.

 

[alevek]

Eh, I've never had a car with a blind spot monitoring system that actually worked worth a damn... Model S included. The one thing I am very happy about, however, is that you can set up mirrors in the Model S (at least, from my driving position) to completely eliminate lane-to-lane blind spots. The freeway merge offset induced b-pillar blind spot is still a tricky one, though.

You need to get out more. Works perfect on my Bolt.

 

[whitex]

Eh, I've never had a car with a blind spot monitoring system that actually worked worth a damn... Model S included. The one thing I am very happy about, however, is that you can set up mirrors in the Model S (at least, from my driving position) to completely eliminate lane-to-lane blind spots. The freeway merge offset induced b-pillar blind spot is still a tricky one, though.

I rent cars when I travel for business trips few days at a time. There are a number of car where BSM works really well, the last one I think was a late model Nissan Altima.

 

[Petra]

You need to get out more. Works perfect on my Bolt.

Having driven a Bolt, "perfect" isn't the word I'd use to describe the system... It's better than nothing and more functional than the system in the S, but it's far from perfect.