Canceling order due to autopilot death news?

[GoTslaGo]

I'm still having trouble with an eyewitness who admits “he went so fast through my trailer I didn’t see him”.

That wasn't a witness, that was the perpetrator, the truck driver at fault for this whole thing. Of course he's going to say that.

IMHO, this is a legal stunt to deflect blame from the truck driver. Let's blame technology and not my irresponsible driving. Let's blame the dead guy, he can't defend himself.

 

[xav-]

Even tesla acknowledged that the driver did not slow down.. Putting all the blame on the truck driver is non sense.

 

[greentee]

Keep in mind that without autopilot, the Model S was still the best overall car in 2014 and 2015.

With the crash details trickling in, I probably won't worry too much about Tesla. It's a new technology and they definitely need to improve it over time. But I doubt that it'd bring the company down.

For other car companies, closed-course tests won't get them too far and they'll have to go through this public beta stage as well.

 

[whitex]

Keep in mind that without autopilot, the Model S was still the best overall car in 2014 and 2015.

With the crash details trickling in, I probably won't worry too much about Tesla. It's a new technology and they definitely need to improve it over time. But I doubt that it'd bring the company down.

For other car companies, closed-course tests won't get them too far and they'll have to go through this public beta stage as well.

Agreed that without AP Tesla are still best cars you can buy. That said, I've been saying for a while that they are pushing the bleeding edge pretty hard risking a fatal accident with a lot of shock value (say kids involved) which it turn can lead to a legal backlash setting autonomous driving back for years. You can never underestimate the general public overreaction capabilities.

 

[Jbailey]

Autopilot did not prevent an accident that it was not supposed to prevent. A driver was doing things he was not supposed to do.

Its really no more newsworthy than the several other fatalities that happen in Levy County every month I hear about. It's a good lesson to the rest of us that there are autopiiot limitations. If we know it won't stop in a garage with bicycles hanging down, then we know it wont stop if there is a significant gap under a truck. It probably recognized it as a tunnel and it won't stop in tunnels.

It also seems he was going between 85 and 90mph. Even If there is a solid stationary barrier in front of you the tech does recognize, the car cannot stop in time at that speed. It may slow down but the impact would still be significant.

Its all statistics...very low likelihood a big white truck with a gap under it would cross in front of you while you are going 89 mph distracted by a computer or something...probably 1 in a million+ miles driven but not zero.

 

[Lex]

"Tragic" and "panic" probably sound too similar...

A series of Autopilot-driven cars did not initiate flipover maneuvers at high speed. Not even one did.

What seems to have happened here is that a driver drove his car under the broadside of a trailer and died tragically. The car had an Autopilot system which was active at the time, as well as passive emergency braking, but the technology apparently ignored the hazard (as a possible overhead sign).

Tragic, yes. Panic, no.

 

[CapeOne]

You can't expect any such system to be 100% flawless. Humans sure aren't.

I agree. As I stated previously, it isn't perfect but the problem is that some may think it’s better than it is and ‘abuse’ the system by doing things like not keeping their eyes of the road.

I'd bet the accident statistics for autopilot are better than for human drivers (Tesla's blog post quoted some numbers that support that argument). .

I don't think Tesla’s 94 million miles versus 130 million miles comparison is really apples to apples or necessarily tells us anything. Since cars have gotten safer and safer over the years, the autopilot 'fatality rate' should be compared against other cars of similar age (less than two years old) rather than ALL vehicles which include older cars that may not have the benefit of today's safety devices/features, design improvements, etc.

The fatality rate per miles on AP may actually be the same or worse than the overall fatality rate for cars 2014 and newer. I'm not saying it is but we just don't know (do we?). It's certainly closer than 94 million versus 130 million.

Also in this case, I would not be surprised if the accident happened exactly the same way with autopilot off. It just wouldn't be news.

Without AP on, the driver may have been paying attention more and perhaps been able to avoid the accident or severity of the accident on his own. We may never know for sure but more details will come out in the investigation.

 

[Zroiron]

Why would you (or anyone) cancel the order, unless you are buying the car purely for AutoPilot (in which case read on)? Tesla is a great car, with or without AutoPilot. Just don't get AP, unless you want it as a technical curiosity. You actually have to be more vigilant when driving on AP because it works so well most of the time, therefore it fools you into false sense of security, but when it fails it can cause a lot of harm. Those who relax and are less vigilant than driving manually risk getting into accidents. It's like driving with a student driver who has somewhat impaired vision, blind spots, and experiences occasional seizures - most of the time in good conditions it will be just fine, but when the student makes a mistake you have to be ready to take over at any time. So bottom line, takes more effort to safely drive with AP than without it. From my personal experience, the only time AP comes useful is in stop and go highway traffic, slow moving, no lane changes - there your risk is low, maybe a fender bender. And I say "your risk" because as you may or may not have gathered so far, AutoPilot comes with all the legal disclaimers and warnings that tell you that you as a driver have full override capabilities and therefore are completely responsible no matter what the AutoPilot does.

It appears to me that you're just looking for a reason....any reason, to cancel. Go ahead won't hurt my feelings!

 

[msnow]

It appears to me that you're just looking for a reason....any reason, to cancel. Go ahead won't hurt my feelings!

See post #20 where the OP states he has decided to buy the car.

 

[AMPd]

Cancelling because someone died while using the vehicle in an unsafe manner is downright silly, obviously the decision is wholly yours.
Autopilot is not responsible here, dont mean to beat the dead horse but the driver MUST pay attention while using autopilot!

 

[rogbmw]

Living close to where the accident was here in Florida, our thoughts go out to the Tesla driver and family. To put it simply, the Tesla was driving down the road, and the Semi turned left right in front of him. I don't know if driving without the autopilot engaged could have changed the results - very probably not.

The driver of the Semi has no knowledge if the Tesla driver was watching Harry Potter or not. All that was initially said was that the first person to get to the Tesla found a DVD player on. Who knows - maybe the force of the accident caused it to come on. Regardless - if a semi turns left illegally infront of a car, it can be catastrophic.

Again, our thoughts and prayers go out to the family.

 

[cpa]

Everyone--yes everyone--has been injured or hurt by using items in the ways that they were not designed or intended to be used. It is no different for AutoPilot. The driver's death was tragic and unfortunate. But if the reports are correct, his rate of speed combined with watching a movie was reckless behavior.

Personally I am too chicken to use a feature like this. I get that others love it and want to use it. With the success rate of AutoPilot mentioned above, there should be no qualms about buying a Tesla with AutoPilot. Just follow directions and be sensible.

(Tesla may have to disable certain features like the USB port playing a movie when AutoPilot is activated for safety reasons.)

 

[Stoneymonster]

Everyone--yes everyone--has been injured or hurt by using items in the ways that they were not designed or intended to be used. It is no different for AutoPilot. The driver's death was tragic and unfortunate. But if the reports are correct, his rate of speed combined with watching a movie was reckless behavior.

Personally I am too chicken to use a feature like this. I get that others love it and want to use it. With the success rate of AutoPilot mentioned above, there should be no qualms about buying a Tesla with AutoPilot. Just follow directions and be sensible.

(Tesla may have to disable certain features like the USB port playing a movie when AutoPilot is activated for safety reasons.)

There is no such feature.

 

[Clomer]

It seems that a lot of people in this thread have missed the point that the OP isn't questioning the car or autopilot itself - he is questioning whether Tesla as a company will be able to survive the negative public reaction that the incident in question is generating. The former is a technical thing, and it's well within Tesla's ability to navigate. The latter - the bad press - is a human thing, and is much more difficult to predict.

This is a genuine concern. If Tesla as a company folds, the value of the cars will plummet overnight. Tesla will probably be fine. It's not the first time they have encountered bumps in their road (a couple years ago, if all you went by was the sensationalist media coverage, you'd think every Model S was a moving fire trap, ready to spontaneously combust at any moment). That said, their ultimate success is not guaranteed.

I say go ahead and buy the car.

 

[EV-lutioin]

Even tesla acknowledged that the driver did not slow down.. Putting all the blame on the truck driver is non sense.

So what I am wondering is why a tractor trailer pulled in front of cars going 65 MPH down a highway? I sure hope they take a blood test from that guy....

The other thing I am wondering is.... was their enough time for the Tesla driver to react to the truck pulling in front of him? Was it physically possible for him to stop in time?

The last thing I am wondering is why we allow trailers to be designed such that cars can drive underneath them. Many trucks already have under-ride guards in the back, why not require them on the sides? (see photos). When a car goes underneath a truck all the safety features built into the car are pretty much useless. This looks like a problem with a fairly simple solution.

 

[Chopr147]

I don't know of any vehicle including Tesla that allow the front screen to play a movie while vehicle is in motion. That was the truck drivers statement so it's not very credible. It's a shame, especially due to the driver being a former Navy Seal. Say a prayer. The AP does give one a false sense of security and it's a reminder to the rest of us to pay attention!

 

[GoTslaGo]

The last thing I am wondering is why we allow trailers to be designed such that cars can drive underneath them. Many trucks already have under-ride guards in the back, why not require them on the sides? (see photos). When a car goes underneath a truck all the safety features built into the car are pretty much useless. This looks like a problem with a fairly simple solution.

But then we couldn't do those cool Hollywood moves with the sports car evading the pursuing police by dashing under the tractor trailer....

Like we can all do that....

 

[rays427]

It's interesting that several comments including from the truck driver have the Tesla speeding. Since he was using autopilot it won't let you go more than 5 mph over the speed limit which I wouldn't call speeding.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

It's interesting that several comments including from the truck driver have the Tesla speeding. Since he was using autopilot it won't let you go more than 5 mph over the speed limit which I wouldn't call speeding.

Autopilot will allow you to go up to 90mph as long as you're not on a road where autopilot is restricted to 5 over.

The road that the driver was on what not a road where autopilot is restricted. So the driver could have set the Autopilot to 90 theoretically. The Tesla logs should show how fast he was going when the accident occurred.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

In terms of bad news for Tesla I'd say the worst news was all the Model X issues, and secondly it was the tentative offer to buy Solar City.

But, that's part of the adventure of having a Tesla. Of when they do things that make you go "WTF????"

Strap yourself in because it's going to be an interesting ride. The choice to buy a Tesla isn't like buying any normal boring car. I had a lot of nervousness when getting the Tesla so its understandable. It does get a incredible amount of media hype that is hardly ever fair/accurate.