Confusion about FSD and AP

[TheGroove]

So I've enrolled into FSD and gave it a try for the first time today. I drove down several well known streets with a variety of stop lights and stop signs, with two different roundabouts.

Stop lights:
It slowed or stopped at every single green light I came across, maybe a dozen or so, to the point it was unusable and I had to shut if off because people kept honking at me.

Stop signs:
Stopped but would not take off without intervention, this happened with every one so I assume it must be a default.

Lane changing:
It did not get a single lane change right, it would say "take this lane" and then when it wouldn't move into it automatically, it fought me when I tried to do it manually. When I left it alone and it missed the turning lane it just kept going and attempted to backtrack to get back on its navigation path.

Roundabouts:
In both cases it stopped in the middle of the roundabout by hard breaking and screaming alarms at me.

Safety Score after my first trip is now 73, I assume this is not good since they say you need 99? I literally did none of the hard breaking or aggressive turning on my own, the car did that all itself trying to navigate itself through the roundabouts and missed lane changes and forcing me to bust out of it.

I'm sure experiences differ for everyone but I'm just a typical driver with no background on tweaks nor have studied on the proper way to use it, I just turned it on and went for the drive. YMMV and I only subscribed for a month but people should really know just how beta this thing is, frankly, it's basically unusable unless your goal is to babysit the car for nearly every action it takes.

 

[Willy3988]

Something is not right. Are you sure you have FSD activated? The lines that show on the screen of the car while driving should be red. You may still be in regular AP mode. Can we see a picture of your screen?

 

[K1Woods]

Probably need a FAQ for new owners. Please reference this thread; FSD vs FSD beta

I'm sure there are many other threads on the subject.

 

[whoosierdaddy]

Oh my.

It appears you did not read any of the pop-up dialogs that you accepted that would have explained how stop light and stop sign control and Navigate on Autopilot work.

 

[TheGroove]

Something is not right. Are you sure you have FSD activated? The lines that show on the screen of the car while driving should be red. You may still be in regular AP mode. Can we see a picture of your screen?

I believe so, I pressed the button to sign up a few days ago and it appeared this morning saying I was enrolled. I already had navigate on AP turned on and it the car was trying to drive itself. Here's a screen (keep in mind I just updated the software after the drive this morning).

 

[JulienW]

.....Safety Score after my first trip is now 73, I assume this is not good since they say you need 99? I literally did none of the hard breaking or aggressive turning on my own....

Actually you literally did do all the hard braking and aggressive turning when you weren't on Autopilot. Nothing counts against your Safety Score on AP. BUT it will magnify the events when you are off AP since you will be manually driving less miles. Driving to achieve a 99 Safety Score requires a high degree of modification in your driving behavior. You need to practice with AP off to learn. For instance you can never use your brake pedal to slow down. Just touching it will almost always get a hard braking. You need to go around curves MUCH slower that you normally drive (in peoples way slow).

 

[TresLA]

As others have pointed out, but I’ll reiterate clearly: you’re not enrolled in FSD beta, so therefore it’s behaving exactly as expected. Navigate on surface streets is not to be expected with what you subscribed to.

 

[TheGroove]

Actually you literally did do all the hard braking and aggressive turning when you weren't on Autopilot. Nothing counts against your Safety Score on AP. BUT it will magnify the events when you are off AP since you will be manually driving less miles. Driving to achieve a 99 Safety Score requires a high degree of modification in your driving behavior. You need to practice with AP off to learn. For instance you can never use your brake pedal to slow down. Just touching it will almost always get a hard braking. You need to go around curves MUCH slower that you normally drive (in peoples way slow).

View attachment 768186

If the takeaway is "you need to read up on all these little micro rules and FAQs" before even using this feature then it's clearly no where near ready for the average user. One thing if you aren't paying $12K (or $200 a month) and then using the beta excuse.

Frankly, when in FSD it was hard to tell when I should and shouldn't interact and it basically sets off screeching alarms so in that event I could've very well hit the breaks and there were several times I had to break out of the steering mode because it was pretty much accelerating through turns, even hitting the curb on a roundabout on its own.

"You're using it wrong" is a poor excuse here. In its current form it's a terrible system that's both scary and dangerous for the average driver.

 

[Mardak]

Driving to achieve a 99 Safety Score requires a high degree of modification in your driving behavior.

I suppose it works as a reading comprehension test too as there's plenty of warnings and caveats about FSD Beta behavior.

 

[TheGroove]

As others have pointed out, but I’ll reiterate clearly: you’re not enrolled in FSD beta, so therefore it’s behaving exactly as expected. Navigate on surface streets is not to be expected with what you subscribed to.

See my screenshot above.

 

[Incredulocious]

I believe so, I pressed the button to sign up a few days ago and it appeared this morning saying I was enrolled. I already had navigate on AP turned on and it the car was trying to drive itself. Here's a screen (keep in mind I just updated the software after the drive this morning).

I don’t have the FSD Beta myself, but that screen capture appears to show that you’re only enrolled and now waiting in the queue to get the FSD Beta software. In other words, you do NOT have the FSD Beta software yet.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

Ouch.

The OP thought they had FSD beta, but they only had FSD.

As a result they proceeded to ruin there chances of getting FSD Beta for a long time because their safety score is horrendous.

In the old days of the safety score you could de-enroll and wait for the safety score to disappear, and then you could re-enroll but I don't know if that works.

Not that it matters as the FSD Beta rollout is stuck. Everyone is just stuck on what they have.

 

[TresLA]

See my screenshot above.

Yes. The screenshot shows you subscribed to FSD Capability and that you enrolled into the FSD beta queue. You do NOT yet have FSD beta. Another sign you are only enrolled in the FSD beta queue is you have Safety Score. No one in FSD beta has Safety Score anymore. FSD beta car visualization will have red and yellow lines, show all lanes of traffic around you (not just adjacent lanes), and will look similar to these two pics:

 

[TresLA]

The title of this thread should also be modified, since FSD capability didn’t fail at anything it was supposed to accomplish.

 

[NCC81701]

@TheGroove you have subscribed to or purchased FSD. This only gets you auto-lane change, summon, smart summon, navigate on AP, and AP on city streets. These functions and behaviors are described in the owners manual and are the expected behavior for AP on city streets.

AP on surface streets needs confirmation to roll through stop signs, and green lights if you are not following another car through the green light. It does not make turns at intersection.

You will automatically be upgraded to FSD when FSD is ready for wide release. It is currently not ready for wide release.FSD is currently being open beta tested and you can opt-in to join the FSD open beta program if you’ve purchased/subscribe to FSD and then subsequently drive in a manner that meets the safety score requirements until you are enrolled.

FSD open beta is the thing that you “thought” you were on, but you weren’t because you still have a safety score. You were on AP on city streets. Once you have a safety score of 99 and maintain it until Tesla grace you with an enrollment into the program you will no longer have a safety score.

To get the full features of FSD you either can wait until it is in wide release, or apply to enroll in the FSD open Beta program if you want to be a tester and test it before it goes to wide release.

 

[JulienW]

If the takeaway is "you need to read up on all these little micro rules and FAQs" before even using this feature then it's clearly no where near ready for the average user.....

Exactly, Tesla is looking for a few people that work hard at earning the Beta by fighting the Safety Score and then willing to put up with and understand the Beta's workings, shortcomings and idiosyncrasies. You need to have a good understanding of Autopilot, FSD Compatibility Package (which is what you have), the Safety Score and the way it works. After you pass that and then earn and keep a Safety Score of 98/99/100 Tesla may at some time invite you into the Beta tester program. Sorry, but you are not ready for Beta since you don't have a basic understanding of the FSD Compatibility Package or the Safety Score.

EDIT: As of now Tesla isn't accepting any new Beta testers anyway (hasn't since Dec I think) but of course that could change anytime. There are 1000's of people driving every day working hard to keep their Safety Score at >98 waiting and hoping to get invited into the Beta soon. The queue is very long at this point. So start reading all you can and learn all you can and then put that knowledge to use. Here is the page for the Safety Score info.

Safety Score Beta | Tesla Support

The Safety Score Beta is an assessment of your driving behavior based on several metrics called Safety Factors. These are combined to estimate the likelihood that your driving could result in a future collision. We combine your daily Safety Scores (up to 30 days) to calculate the aggregated...

www.tesla.com

 

[TheGroove]

@TheGroove you have subscribed to or purchased FSD. This only gets you auto-lane change, summon, smart summon, navigate on AP, and AP on city streets. These functions and behaviors are described in the owners manual and are the expected behavior for AP on city streets.

AP on surface streets needs confirmation to roll through stop signs, and green lights if you are not following another car through the green light. It does not make turns at intersection.

You will automatically be upgraded to FSD when FSD is ready for wide release. It is currently not ready for wide release.FSD is currently being open beta tested and you can opt-in to join the FSD open beta program if you’ve purchased/subscribe to FSD and then subsequently drive in a manner that meets the safety score requirements until you are enrolled.

FSD open beta is the thing that you “thought” you were on, but you weren’t because you still have a safety score. You were on AP on city streets. Once you have a safety score of 99 and maintain it until Tesla grace you with an enrollment into the program you will no longer have a safety score.

To get the full features of FSD you either can wait until it is in wide release, or apply to enroll in the FSD open Beta program if you want to be a tester and test it before it goes to wide release.

This is clearly what happened, thank you for pointing it out, I stand corrected. Seems obvious now that this one trip thinking I was in FSD on city streets confusing both me and the car caused this score. Okay then, sounds like I won't qualify even if/when they do the next release but no biggie.

I cannot edit or change the title of this thread, I'll report and ask a moderator to do it.

 

[Krash]

…I cannot edit or change the title of this thread, I'll report and ask a moderator to do it.

Done. Thanks for asking.

 

[LastGas]

Ouch.

The OP thought they had FSD beta, but they only had FSD.

...

Just to clarify, the generally released FSD is beta too. Heck, Autosteer that came out in 2014 is still beta. Just some versions are more beta than others, and some are more widely released than others.

 

[nvx1977]

Daily Safety scores are being averaged in a 30-day window, so any bad score you may have will automatically be removed from the average after 30 days. Just in case you want to make an earnest attempt at qualifying for the beta at some point in the future. @TheGroove