I appreciate the note from
@bcsteeve, and yes it was a bit unnecesary, but
@JRP3 and I go back long enough that I can take it. Maybe I deserve some of it.
AR, I guess you think you come off as neutral and balanced but you generally seem negative.
I actually do admit I am negative about many things. Tesla the product is just not one of them, in many ways. The company, the way some things have been handled, yes. OTOH, the drivetrain (outside of some P model limiting ludicrosity) for example is superb, world-changing. And I think Model 3 will succeed, despite personal opinions on its shortcomings.
I do think a lot of us misunderstand each other in the process, though. That's the real shame part. I would like to get along with a lot more people that I do (and I would hope to think others feel similarly about some forum "opponents"), genuinely - however, I would like to do that without sacrificing the ability to debate, at times very hard, tough topics for maximum informational value at the end.
Some people I genuinely like a lot are at times polar opposites of my views and also, IMO, at times I feel mistaken in their information, beliefs and presentation thereof. That is the hard part, how to debate the latter, without changing the former... Often something ends up being taken personally, even when sincerely there is no intention of it being personal. Text is a very difficult medium, no less.
Because when we do debate and discuss the hard parts successfully, many times it also turns out that I was wrong. And that's when I learn too. But most importantly the process, no matter who is right, this peer-review so to speak, filters out the best information we can get. Taking nobody at face value, sufficiently doubting everyone and everything, that may be less good for egos, but great for information. That's what I've been looking for ever since I came here and have found this idea conflicting with many different interests.
I wouldn't prefer a culture where some take offense at being disagreed with or challenged - and yet that's what is happening often times, unfortunately. Some people don't take it well when they or their info is challenged and assume it is personal and basically check out. If only they'd participate in that hashing of the information, they might well be right, but the other party never gets the chance to learn that...
The other alternative that I know is simply to give up on those tough topics and let them - and whatever misinformation and misunderstanding is, on either side - be. Mind you, I'm not saying we need to seek mutual agreement, I am merely talking of mutual understanding and how often that is not even reached before someone gets offended and stops or tangents accordingly.
I'd say giving up is and would be a shame too, though even I do that a lot these days. I'd prefer if we all could just "hack the info" without feeling personal about it, or without fearing the negative either, when it comes to that. But no matter what you may think
, even I am conscious of the fact that many do take things personally.
That's IMO where specialist forums are best, hacking the info. But I admit it is not nice for those who come here merely to hang out socially and casually converse topics. That's the equation that I'd like to solve in a manner that suits everyone, because I understand not everyone wants the same things out of forums such as these.
I think the Autonomous Vehicles sub-forum, for instance, is great, because it is populated by many people who are into the same thing. It makes it easier for everyone. But not every sub-forum will be so homogenuous.
