Don't buy FSD for $2k more. [from 2019 - FSD upgrade not available for 2k at this time]

[ninpb]

Ponzi scheme :

What returns does Tesla give? Cars, and a few AP features. There is no monetary shifting from new buyers to previous buyers...

I think he meant ponzu sauce.

 

[Itsuo-DC]

Took the plunge, added the FSD to the AP on LR3 , I ordered it from the cars web browser. Strange thing happened upon completion of the transaction the Cars touch screen went completely blank and took a while to reboot, like over 30 seconds had a black screen. I am a bit concerned. The FSD is now listed on my cars option and my CC got dinged for the purchase.

I tried to do this last Friday on my LR3 and it was running slow so I just did it on my phone. Sounds like it needed a moment to celebrate the news!

 

[hydro 481]

Ponzi scheme :

What returns does Tesla give? Cars, and a few AP features. There is no monetary shifting from new buyers to previous buyers...

He’s clearly being overdramatic. I doubt he truly believes Musk is running a scheme...

 

[michidragon]

He’s clearly being overdramatic. I doubt he truly believes Musk is running a scheme...

Yes - I'm kind of a pessimist and cynical, and even I'm going to say: Disorganized? Hell yes. Scheme? No. Not at all.

And I'm not really trying to "defend" my $2k FSD purchase. I know it was a gamble. And a big one at that. I may benefit from it. I also may regret it and get nothing. But I'll survive it, and am *hopeful* it leads to new features down the road, so that's why I took the gamble. If not, I'll be angry later, but I'll live and learn.

 

[DB-Cooper]

Ponzi scheme :

What returns does Tesla give? Cars, and a few AP features. There is no monetary shifting from new buyers to previous buyers...

The $2k, $3k, $5k whatever was charged for FSD coming soon features is most certainly being used for production of cars/tech/salaries/costs/etc. While I'm not on the inside, I guarantee those who paid $2k or whatever, Tesla didn't park that in an interest bearing account specifically for FSD in the future, they need that cash now to fund their current operation. Ponzi schemes are great until they aren't, there's no surprise with the deposits, selling future tech, that they're raising capital today to fund development and pay today's expenses. It's all fine and dandy until it gets too crazy and the whole charade collapses. Many companies collect money via deposits to fund things, but Tesla seems to do it at the furthest extreme.

While you provided a literal translation, there still becomes a collapse when a company pulls in funds from new buyers (could be existing customer buying something new) and that shifting to build cars for other new buyers, etc. If Tesla truly struggles and has to lay off, they may layoff developers of future tech just to keep the lights on to deliver cars, they won't be in a position to refund those who pre-paid and basically this would all feel like a Ponzi scheme. Regardless, it could happen, I hope it doesn't.

 

[GeoX750]

Inspiring to see all those who have taken the plunge, even recognizing little FSD usability may actually come from it !

Trying to justify it to myself to: (a) help Tesla, (b) have fun experimenting with the limited FSD features that may come (even if they don't work well, I love getting updates), and (c) $2K is a better price than before (take advantage of a sale) that I can afford.

I still can't do it though. I don't think the sensors on the Model S currently will ever be able to have FSD functionality that I could be happy with or reliably use in my congested city driving. I have EAP and NOA, Autopark, summons are not usable for me. The current AP would have been perfect.

 

[Frunkenstein]

FSD owner here, but watch Elon release the file update to FSD called...

HW3

He did say we would get HW3. LOL

 

[mongo]

The $2k, $3k, $5k whatever was charged for FSD coming soon features is most certainly being used for production of cars/tech/salaries/costs/etc. While I'm not on the inside, I guarantee those who paid $2k or whatever, Tesla didn't park that in an interest bearing account specifically for FSD in the future, they need that cash now to fund their current operation. Ponzi schemes are great until they aren't, there's no surprise with the deposits, selling future tech, that they're raising capital today to fund development and pay today's expenses. It's all fine and dandy until it gets too crazy and the whole charade collapses. Many companies collect money via deposits to fund things, but Tesla seems to do it at the furthest extreme.

While you provided a literal translation, there still becomes a collapse when a company pulls in funds from new buyers (could be existing customer buying something new) and that shifting to build cars for other new buyers, etc. If Tesla truly struggles and has to lay off, they may layoff developers of future tech just to keep the lights on to deliver cars, they won't be in a position to refund those who pre-paid and basically this would all feel like a Ponzi scheme. Regardless, it could happen, I hope it doesn't.

The items you are looking for are
Deferred revenue
And
Customer deposits
Both located in the liabilities section of Tesla's balance sheet.
Neither contributed to the profit Tesla made the last two quarters.
Further, if you read the paperwork, Tesla explicitly states deposits are not held in escrow...

 

[MarkBrokeIt]

What returns does Tesla give? Cars, and a few AP features. There is no monetary shifting from new buyers to previous buyers...

Hmm, maybe that's why they had to end the referral program?

 

[DanH]

So how much did Tesla raise through this discount period? Let’s assume that 50K people have activated either AP and/or FSD and the avg price is 3000. They just pocketed a $150 mil easily.

 

[Glamisduner]

If Tesla promises audio, that doesn't automatically mean premium audio.

NOA does not mean flawless NOA. As long as it requires an attentive driver, Tesla is off the hook for providing NOA with an attentive driver.

Summon is slow speed in a very limited distance so I doubt it requires more than HW2.0

If it works less than 50% of the time, I think you would have a case to say it does not work

 

[happyzod]

The $2k, $3k, $5k whatever was charged for FSD coming soon features is most certainly being used for production of cars/tech/salaries/costs/etc. While I'm not on the inside, I guarantee those who paid $2k or whatever, Tesla didn't park that in an interest bearing account specifically for FSD in the future, they need that cash now to fund their current operation. Ponzi schemes are great until they aren't, there's no surprise with the deposits, selling future tech, that they're raising capital today to fund development and pay today's expenses. It's all fine and dandy until it gets too crazy and the whole charade collapses. Many companies collect money via deposits to fund things, but Tesla seems to do it at the furthest extreme.

While you provided a literal translation, there still becomes a collapse when a company pulls in funds from new buyers (could be existing customer buying something new) and that shifting to build cars for other new buyers, etc. If Tesla truly struggles and has to lay off, they may layoff developers of future tech just to keep the lights on to deliver cars, they won't be in a position to refund those who pre-paid and basically this would all feel like a Ponzi scheme. Regardless, it could happen, I hope it doesn't.

You are correct that the cashflow provided from FSD will fund their current operations. However, it is far from being a ponzi scheme. There is a difference between free cashflow and accounting net income. FSD promises will clearly be accounted for within Tesla's liabilities, thus not a ponzi scheme.

 

[mongo]

Hmm, maybe that's why they had to end the referral program?

Buy an actual car, then get 5 friends to also buy an actual car and we'll send you some tires for your actual car.
Not seeing the link to Ponzi here, everyone got the product...
Tesla was getting sued regarding the referral program by dealer's associations, plus it was an extra cost that was no longer needed.

 

[Revelation]

Buy an actual car, then get 5 friends to also buy an actual car and we'll send you some tires for your actual car.
Not seeing the link to Ponzi here, everyone got the product...
Tesla was getting sued regarding the referral program by dealer's associations, plus it was an extra cost that was no longer needed.

Word of mouth advertising works far better than any print / tv ad to date. Every car dealership out there has referral programs where if a customer is referred to them and buys a car they general get $300-500 for each purchase.

Dealer's Associations has a hard-on for Tesla as Tesla is refusing to play by their rules.

 

[Oyinko]

For those of you that went from EAP to FSD, did you get any kind of confirmation by email, pop up on the screen?

Mine isn't even listed as an option in my account and my SC are telling me it's normal.

 

[dave999z]

I got a confirmation screen on the website saying payment received or something like that; I wouldn't say it rose to the level of a receipt. But on the website when I clicked on my account/car it immediately listed EAP and FSD capability. Received no email. Nothing popped up on car's screen. Hope that helps.

 

[run-the-joules]

So here we are, almost two years later, with exactly one input-control feature released in the FSD package that isn't available to people who only have EAP. The current "FSD beta" given to social media influencers adds what is effectively Nav on Autopilot for local usage, with the rollout to those blessed and connected enough to be chosen for the Early Access Program probably coming in a month or two, and those of us who are just regular people are probably going to get the update in 5-8 months, if I had to guess.

How's everyone feeling about their FSD purchase?

 

[jjrandorin]

So here we are, almost two years later, with exactly one input-control feature released in the FSD package that isn't available to people who only have EAP. The current "FSD beta" given to social media influencers adds what is effectively Nav on Autopilot for local usage, with the rollout to those blessed and connected enough to be chosen for the Early Access Program probably coming in a month or two, and those of us who are just regular people are probably going to get the update in 5-8 months, if I had to guess.

How's everyone feeling about their FSD purchase?

Great, since I had hardware 2.5 and felt the upgrade to the faster computer was worth 2k to me, even if no other features were released. That got me the enhanced visualizations, and "whatever else, if anything" gets released. So, for me, just fine.

This is likely the wrong thread to zombie rez, though, since it was talking about a VERY specific point in time where a few of us got to upgrade for 2k from EAP.

 

[run-the-joules]

Great, since I had hardware 2.5 and felt the upgrade to the faster computer was worth 2k to me, even if no other features were released. That got me the enhanced visualizations, and "whatever else, if anything" gets released. So, for me, just fine.

This is likely the wrong thread to zombie rez, though, since it was talking about a VERY specific point in time where a few of us got to upgrade for 2k from EAP.

Indeed. I'm genuinely curious how people feel about that period of time, since it's the period of time where they started to do… interesting things… with the FSD option, pricing thereof, and treatment of people who ordered it.

 

[jjrandorin]

Indeed. I'm genuinely curious how people feel about that period of time, since it's the period of time where they started to do… interesting things… with the FSD option, pricing thereof, and treatment of people who ordered it.

Fair enough... but I edited the thread title a bit to ensure there is no confusion around "what 2k upgrade to FSD?!?!?!?" that might ensue.